Help with a Couple of Older Patterns

[Southsound]

I was browsing thru the color plates of flies in Ray Bergman's "Trout" book {1984 Ed} and was intrigued by a couple of wet fly patterns. One was labelled "Nicholson" and the other "Strachan". I then tried to find contemporary tyers' versions of the flies but so far have found bumpkis. Anyone heard of and/or seen current versions of either pattern?

Thanks much, and Happy Holidays

Steve Cole
Olympia

[FT]

Why not simply tie them as Bergman lists the pattern? After all, they are some of the old classic trout featherwing wets and they have caught a lot of fish. Just because the old wets have gone out of fashion the last 20 years, doesn't mean they are not very effective flies. Tie them as Bergman lists the dressings and go catch some trout with swung wet flies.

[Tim Cottage]

I agree 100% on this. Tie them as shown in Bergman's Trout.

They are still as effective as ever and far more appealing (to my eye).

The trout still like them, they haven't changed. Although many of the people who chase them are constantly striving for something new and better, the trout are happy just as they are. As they have been for eons.

TC

[Southsound]

OK... good thinking. I will give it a go based on the recipes in the back of the book

Steve

[Les Johnson]

It is always respectful to tie a fly as the originator dressed it before trying to "improve" it. Attribution is important. Or, just tie up a similar but different pattern and give it a new name.
Good Fishing,
Les Johnson

[Nooksack Mac]

A thought about feather-winged wet flies in general: in our time, when most trout fly anglers have a working knowledge of entomology, it's hard to realize how ignorant the fly fishermen of Bergman's era and before were about the basics of insect life cycles. To me, it seems obvious that typical wet flies were pretty good imitations of what we now call emergers. The old-timers used wet flies effectively for several centuries without having a clue as to what they were really being taken for!

[Daryle Holmstrom]

But they didn't have the materials we have today. Can't wait to inject the baby oil into the liquid lace material. Hell I pass out from needles so maybe the liquid lace is out. The flies that are tied from them are awesome though. If my humble fingers get to try this technique I'm up for it.

Daryle

[Daryle Holmstrom]

I even have some of Les's books in my library that's how old I am, circa 1971, Fishing the Sea-Run Cutthroat Trout.

Daryle

[Daryle Holmstrom]

And I sitll have my Fenwick rod in perfect working conditon. LOL

[Daryle Holmstrom]

With all repect to Les, His books are a great read before your time. They are still a great read. Us old oldbies can still post a few messages the newbies can't answer.


Daryle

[Tim Cottage]

A thought about feather-winged wet flies in general: in our time, when most trout fly anglers have a working knowledge of entomology, it's hard to realize how ignorant the fly fishermen of Bergman's era and before were about the basics of insect life cycles. To me, it seems obvious that typical wet flies were pretty good imitations of what we now call emergers. The old-timers used wet flies effectively for several centuries without having a clue as to what they were really being taken for!


I wouldn't be too quick to jump to the conclusion that several centuries of fishermen were ignorant or unaware of insect life cycles or of their inability to create effective patterns to suggest those cycles.
In fact, fishermen have been doing just that for two centuries or more.
It is more a matter of interpretation. That older interpretations of those insects and their life cycles are different from contemporary interpretations does not indicate ignorance or lack of awareness.
It is true that many of our contemporary styles lean more toward direct imitation than impression but that is a matter of interpretation.
There were many astute observers of insects and fish in "the old days", and many of them wrote about their observations as well as their attempts to refine their patterns until they were deadly fish catchers.
Certainly there is nothing new about lifting rocks in search of nymphs or using nets to catch emergers and adults and taking them home to either, look at them under a magnifying glass or put them in a container with water and watching them develop.
Perhaps a bit of time spent reading about the old timers and their thoughts and methods would shed some light on who they were and how they arrived at their conclusions. :-)

TC

[tightlines]

Daryle--Us newbies have a lot to learn. I pray that you still have something to learn as well. I have long thought the most precious characteristic of the sport of flyfishing is it's challenge. The difficulty of fooling a trout I hope will never become easy. I own both "Fishing the Sea-Run Cutthroat Trout" 1971 and "Fly-fishing Coastal Cutthroat Trout" 2004 (both by Les Johnson) Before my time? I guess the first book was written a decade before I was a twinkle in my Momma's eye, but both books are still very informative and relavant.