Need Help With A Question...

[HappyHooker]

I received this question and I'm not quite sure how to answer it.

"Why are so many flytiers so hung up taking credit for "inventing" a new fly when more often than not it"s just a variation of a fly that's been around for years?"

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

Duke

[earlsmith]

Some tyers develop flies for a living and profit, you will see them at shows, touting their latest and greatest, and what you say about "reinventing the wheel" is in part true, but if you scrutinize anything, that could be said to be true. I know very good tyers who keep the recipes to themselves or closely guarded. I also know tyers who have sold the rights to patterns to major outfitters such as Umpqua for rediculous sums of money. If you are trying to strike it rich, you are like the "one pro in the graduating highschool class in
King Co Metro", my point being that they are few and far between. Tying for a shop on a popular home water is how some get their rep ect. Teaching at the round table, is where I am comfortable in a local group in bellevue, ect.
Respectfully

Earl

[chadk]

putting something besides bait (fur, feathers, etc) on a hook is what was 'original'. the rest is just 'variations'. ;)

[HappyHooker]

haha...Good reply Chadk...Definitely true...You sound like you like to get to the nuts and bolts of the matter :)

EarlSmith, thanks for the thoughful reply. Very valid points...All of them.
I especially liked your point about how you could scrutinize just about anything and make the same inferences (sp?).

I think a lot of people just like to feel special so they take credit for creating something new (to them) and when honestly, it is just a variation off of something else.

Any more thoughts about this?

-Duke

[Davy]

as in alot of , or all of, the steelhead marabou patterns, only the colors change.

[Keith Hixson]

If one promotes themselves they may be able to make a good living. However, some of these new promoters don't have anything new out there. Yet, if you don't promote yourself you can't make a living as a fly tier. But, having tied flies for over thirty years. I really believe some of these folks taking advantage of the "new" interest in fly fishing don't have anything new to offer. Brian Chan and Denny Rickard's stuff isn't anything new. Us old geezers have to chuckle about how well these men promote themselves. Yet, what they promote looks good and will catch fish. Are they any better fishermen and fly tiers than a host of friends I have fished with and tied flies with over the years, I don't think so. But, you can't fault them for self-promotion, because it does pay. I think fishermen are suckers for something promoted as: "new, better, exciting, etc." Well, we have names like: Wulf, Teeney, Kreh, etc and they had to promote themselves or they wouldn't have been able to make a living doing what they enjoy. So I'm not too critical of these folks.

"There is nothing new under the sun." Ecclesiastes 1:9

K.

[earlsmith]

As an example, most of you who started to attend the Fly Show when they split it out first at the expo center then at the maydenbauer, if you will remember the "Bloody Mary", shortly after that show, where there was the "buzz" about the fly...it got picked up by a major outfitter, and written up as the fly of choice on the Kettle River in NW Fly.....reputable publication that it is. You can see the cycle all the time.

We took a fly down to three dollar bridge one time and absolutely slayed everyone else on the water for two hours, we got back to the parking lot at dusk and started fielding the inevitable questions "what is that thing" We decided to name it the "crybaby flomer" after a good friend who was also very pissed at the wompin this bug put on him on one of our outings. The next morning, we stopped in at the Blue Ribbon and bet the owner he could sell probably 5 dozen of that fly if he set somebody to tying them, and in exchange we would come back in the next day for the hat of our choice, if it panned out. So we left him a specimen of the fly, and actually did collect our hats the next day. We have a good laugh about that stunt every time we annualy go into that shop, and the owner still knows us to this day, asking for the next pattern we are gonna sell out for him, LOL

And yes, the crybaby flomer has had some notoriety in some circles and you can find them in the boxes of the guides who take clients from the Blue Ribbon. We have fun with our tying =)

Earl Smith

[Daryle Holmstrom]

If one promotes themselves they may be able to make a good living. However, some of these new promoters don't have anything new out there. Yet, if you don't promote yourself you can't make a living as a fly tier. But, having tied flies for over thirty years. I really believe some of these folks taking advantage of the "new" interest in fly fishing don't have anything new to offer. Brian Chan and Denny Rickard's stuff isn't anything new. Us old geezers have to chuckle about how well these men promote themselves. Yet, what they promote looks good and will catch fish. Are they any better fishermen and fly tiers than a host of friends I have fished with and tied flies with over the years, I don't think so. But, you can't fault them for self-promotion, because it does pay. I think fishermen are suckers for something promoted as: "new, better, exciting, etc." Well, we have names like: Wulf, Teeney, Kreh, etc and they had to promote themselves or they wouldn't have been able to make a living doing what they enjoy. So I'm not too critical of these folks.

"There is nothing new under the sun." Ecclesiastes 1:9

K.


I remember showing Brian Chan my chiro pattern about thirty years ago on Pass lake when he was just a young kid. He did have a passion for fly fishing.

Daryle

[Daryle Holmstrom]

An afterthought, my dad worked with Roderick Haig-Brown in the lumber camps in the early twentys. Dad said he was always fishing. I have a photo if I can find it, it will date me though.LOL

Daryle

[Keith Hixson]

I don't think we have to be critical of those who promote their product and themselves. It's a business and if you don't do some advertising and promotion you won't make a living at it. One of my best friends is a professional fly tier in the Spokane Area. In order for him to sell his flies he has to go to various fly club meetings and talk about fly fishing. He is fishes every chance he gets. But, if he didn't promote himself he couldn't make a living out of fly fishing. However if one gets to cocky they can loose the respect of others. I have rarely outfished my buddy. He's just a slightly better fisherman than me. But he does promote himself. You have to.

K.

[Minx]

"Having to take credit" opposed to "accepting credit" to me is the division between doing it for a living & doing it to get away from your living, neither of which is wrong......$.02 from the east side, chuck

[Keith Hixson]

Minx

Very Good. Ditto

K

[HappyHooker]

Great replies ya'll...Thanks again.

Yes, people that are in business do have to promote or else they won't have a business and as with most, "New" items coming out these days I think anyone who is even just a little pessimistic will question the "Newness".

With Synthetics and other new technologies there very well could be some new inventions out there and yes I agree there is nothing wrong with giving these guys the credit.

The only one's that bother me are the ones who are waving there, "look at me" flag around more to stroke their ego's then to "bring to market" a new fly.

Most fly tiers from my limited knowledge do appear to be pretty humble and easy goin' though.

Thanks for making this such an awesome post fellas...:beer2:

-Duke