Shock loop or no shock loop?

[TallFlyGuy]

When Swinging, who uses a shock loop and who doesn't? Why?

On John Hazel's video he says if you don't use one the fish will feel the tension on the fly and let go. (I'm assuming he means before you have time to set the hook).

If you are using a shock loop, doesn't it take some of the "grab" away by desensitizing your hand while having slack between you and the fish?

I personally have not used the shock loop, and have been losing a few to many fish. I am now going to start using the loop and see if my hook up to landing ratio increases.

Again,

When Swinging, who uses a shock loop and who doesn't? Why?

Tall

[FLGator]

I have never used a shock loop but am interested in hearing why people do and the advantages. Also, how people use their shock loop would be of great interest.

I've always done my best to keep my hand off the line and off of the reel and let the reel do the work on the grab. I set my drag just tight enough to prevent over-spooling. I keep a low rod tip. When I experience the grab I pull straight back sharply and simply raise my rod tip letting the rod and reel do the work. Then, I set the hook, hard, towards the near bank. If I 'think' I feel something but am not sure if it is a fish or a rock I'll simply pull my rod straight back. If it's not a fish I'll usually be able to free my fly and continue the swing. If it is a fish and it's missed the fly, my fly simply darts away, like prey and I've often experienced another grab. If it was just a soft grab (but I wasn't sure), the sharp straight back pull plants the hook point. At this point I now know it's a fish and will strike him again, hard and low towards the near bank.

Always game to improve my grab to land ratio and am interested in applying the most successful technique. Great question, very interested in reading what others are having success with.

Chris

[Skilly]

I use a loop held ligthly with one finger. I believe it gives the fish a chance to turn with the fly and gives a better hook set. The more the fly wakes the bigger the loop. Especially with a hitched fly.

Skilly

[Salmo_g]

Tallflyguy,

I don't carry a loop in my hand while swinging the fly, assuming that's what you mean. I've tried it some, but if steelhead are the fish of a thousand casts, I never was doing it when a fish grabbed. I do know a few skilled anglers, like Jerry Wintle, who do it and believe it contributes to more and better hookups.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

[cnaka]

I was fishing with a very well-known local steelheading guide and asked him the same question. He said he doesn't use a shock loop when using sink tips and sometimes uses one when fishing a dry line. I wish I could remember his reasoning, but I seem to recall that he didn't seem to think it made much of a difference. I usually favor keeping the hands off the reel to avoid instinctively clamping down on the line. I sometimes like to use a loop (just to change things up), but I'll just let the weight of the rod hold the line against one finger. When the fish takes, I can't clamp down and the line is on the reel in no time flat (usually). I've also held the line between forefinger and middle finger. I'm sure that others have trained themselves to release at the slightest twitch, but I found it hard to do consistently, especially when you're spaced out and in auto mode after X # of hours / days / weeks without having touched a fish. Then, all of a sudden BAM, Mr. Steelhead wakes you from your slumber and the first thing you do is grab your line hard. Nothing but tears and curses as you wonder how many more hours / days / weeks / etc till the next grab.

[inland]

I don't use one anymore. Never did when swinging a sunk line/fly. For near/in/on surface stuff it really depended on the water speeds and what 'feels' right. I experimented for several years using a loop and found that at times it helps and at times it doesn't. I now fish with the line tight to the reel, but loosely pinched between my index finger and the cork, and rod tip flat to the water. I do not want any slack. If the fish takes slowly I just use 'feel' to extend my arm until it soundly has the fly, even letting line pull off the reel if need be- then pinch the line tight to the cork and a slight jab backwards and slightly outwards (to give some cushion) to bury the point before the fish takes off. A strong grab will best any reactions we posess so a loop isn't going to do anything anyway- these fish generally hook themselves. Again using 'feel' for a downstream take I will extend (even lunge if needed) to allow the fish to somewhat turn/take some line before sticking them.

While now hardwired to give line rather than take line...at first it was real tough on those somewhat soft to really soft takes to keep from pulling the fly away. Let them take the fly to help improve hooking and landing ratios. The plucks that I think Hazel is referring too will generally come back as long as you don't pull the fly before the fish lets it go.

In the end no matter how good you think you pulled it off it is never surefire. Which is good. For me anyway...if it gets easy I make it harder. Landing 90% of the fish was fun for a while but then it gets anti-climatic. Even though it isn't usually a 'happy' feeling...the loss of a fish that causes some frustration is good for the game. I always remember the ones that get away or I blew. 10 years ago and it's still fresh like yesterday. The rest, unless a spectacular event, are blended and lost to my journal.

William

[Joepa]

I started using one consistently this past winter after reading a long thread on this subject on the other spey board. I think it may help. I hooked 2 fish this winter after releasing the shock loop to very subtle initial hits. Feeding a few inches of line back to these fish resulted in solid hookups (both were hens BTW). Of course, who knows - I could have hooked those fish without releasing the line, but I've never tried that technique before and was happy with the results. That noted, I also had an extremely frustrating day in April on a river full of fish when 6 times this technique failed me and so I wonder if dropping the line back to those fish actually hurt my cause. It is my experience that summer fish have a much more aggressive take so I guess that's where Hazel's point comes in (allowing them to turn with the fly). I've been using one this summer but haven't run into a darn SH yet! (hooked a Springer though)

[KerryS]

I carry a loop, always have. I do because that was the way I was taught and now I am to old to change. Also I don't care if I loose fish because of it. Well, I care if I loose fish but I am not going to worried about it a whole lot. I have been loosing fish ever since I started fishing and with every method of fishing I have ever used. I don’t have the time to try and figure out why I lost every fish.

A couple of years ago a guy was shooting video over on the Ronde and shot some of me catching a couple of steelhead. Interestingly when I would hook a fish not only did I drop my loop but I would reach forward with my rod arm and lean forward slightly at the waist before I struck with the set giving the fish even more slack line to turn with. I never knew I did this until I saw the footage. This may be because of a gentleman named Charlie Gerhardt. Charlie is an entertainer and was teaching me how to fish steelhead skating a dry. When I had missed a fish because of striking at the first lunge of a fish to my fly he would say "Bow to the fish, just like it were the audience. You have to bow to the fish." So I guess I bow to the fish.

[Dan Page]

I always use one in summer fishing. I have lost fish that grab and run quick that I think I would have hooked had I given them a little slack. I often have a loop in winter but don't usually use it. There's not time to think about this when the fish hits, but in winter my goal is to hold the loop unless I feel the situation says different. A real strong grab usually pulls it loose from my fingers.

[Joe Smolt]

This is a good question that has puzzled me for a while. As Kerry brings up, I wonder if the use of a shock loop is more important for a skating or a surface presentation to give the fish time to take the fly.

Here is what has puzzled me: over the past year I have been focusing on having a better connection with the fly through the whole swing. I am finding that I am feeling more plucks (most likely smolts). Before this, there was more slack in the line. If tension on a line means missing fish, why wouldn't a loose swing catch more fish?

I've used a shock loop in the summer. With my minimal success, nothing was intentional. All of a sudden the reel starts screaming. I don't even remember the shock loop sliding through my fingers.

[Steelie Mike]

I have always used a shock loop when swinging for steel. I find your guys takes on this method fascinating. I see now how it may be beneficial from reading your guys posts to forgo the shock loop in the winter when the fish are a little more sluggish. I have caught fish that were sluggish during the winter with the loop, but see that a slow suble take may not be strong enough to pull on the loop for a strong take. I will have to experiment with it in the future.

In regards to summer fish, in my experience, they almost always take the line from you. Even the subtle takes take a small portion of the loop and you can feel enough to set the hook. I also like to keep the rod down and give a slight pull instead of lifting the tip. That way if I miss the strike the fly can still swing through the drift. I have had descent success with this method.

[Red Shed]

I used to be "in the loop" but now I'm "out of the loop".

[Hal Eckert]

I carry a loop, always have. I do because that was the way I was taught and now I am to old to change. Also I don't care if I loose fish because of it. Well, I care if I loose fish but I am not going to worried about it a whole lot. I have been loosing fish ever since I started fishing and with every method of fishing I have ever used. I don’t have the time to try and figure out why I lost every fish.



Yep, ditto

:beer1: :p

BG

[Brent Comer]

No loop. :cool:

[TallFlyGuy]

I tried the loop on Friday. I got a soft slurp of a take. The line just kinda stopped. I normally just pull back to feel for "give", but since I had the loop I raised my rod tip up to about a 45degree angle(Yea I know, that was dumb). This confirms to fish and me that its time to play.

The fish comes up to surface exploding and rolling. I drop the loop and try to set the hook, but I'm already at about 45 degrees, so then after I drop the loop and try to come back more there is slack in the line and well, needless to say I didn't get a strong hookset. The fish races down river peeling off line, jumps/cartwheels in the air, lands and then comes right at me. I'm thinking he must of got disoriented in the air. I'm trying like heck to strip line in enough to get slack out. Well, after not being able to barb the fish, he got off.

Today, I didn't use the loop and went back to my old ways of strong drag and no loop. I went 2 for three.

I think I'm gonna stick to no loop now :cool:

[cnaka]

I drove by the Yak after a weekend out to Walla Walla. Briefly fished a local WW stream and the Yak of course. I was swinging big bunny leaches just like I was steelheading and caught the largest trout I ever had in both the local creek and the Yak (fat and aggressive 14-16 inchers). Anyway, got me thinking that if I wanted to experiment more with the shock loop, a relatively pain free way of doing it would be to practice on regular bows. I can say this much: the takes were vicious with the streamer. The line literally just starts peeling off, and with a 4wt and click and pawl reel, kinda feels like a steelie. If I lose a few, no biggy. There are always more waiting around to be caught, especially in the Yak. Also a nice low risk way to practice using a deeply sunk and swung fly with a dry line if so inclined to try out some other steelhead techniques.

[fredaevans]

Surface fly=always
Sub surface fly=usually
Sink tip=never