Poll:

[fly_rep@hotmail.com]

SPey_dude had me thinking. Would you pay the same price for a rod mass produced in Korea as a rod hand made in the USA by Gary Anderson/Bob Meiser/ C.F Burkheimer *IF*
1) the rods looked the same (Anderson didnt put on those awesome rod handles )
2) they fished and cast the same?
3) and of course the rods cost the same, so were the same price as a Anderson, Meiser, CFB (not to mention any names, unlike Speydude this isnt a rant on any particuliar company)

[Big K1]

Burkies, Meiz, and Andersons are not mass produced. They are made to your specs.
What's your point?

[James Mello]

SPey_dude had me thinking. Would you pay the same price for a rod mass produced in Korea as a rod hand made in the USA by Gary Anderson/Bob Meiser/ C.F Burkheimer *IF*
1) the rods looked the same (Anderson didnt put on those awesome rod handles )
2) they fished and cast the same?
3) and of course the rods cost the same, so were the same price as a Anderson, Meiser, CFB (not to mention any names, unlike Speydude this isnt a rant on any particuliar company)

You could do this as a poll...

At any rate, if price weren't a differentiator, and the performance were the same, I'd stick local. But I do think big K1 is right. This isn't quite the same thing, as those other rods aren't particularlly mass produced. A better example may be something like Loomis/Sage/T&T etc...

[Sloan Craven]

If they are EXACTLY the same in every way then I would buy the one I could obtain the fastest.

[Charles Sullivan]

Yes, I'd buy American.
I'd buy union made before non-union as well.

38 tonight,
cds

[fredaevans]

Burkies, Meiz, and Andersons are not mass produced. They are made to your specs.
What's your point?iagree

Exactly ... which is why I have at least two rods built by all three above.

[Salmo Trutta]

they fished and cast the same?

To fish and cast like Burkheimer's ????????

It will never happen, it is like saying if someone can paint like De Vinci.

Everybody can get the same "paint and fabric" ( the best materials to build a spey or single a hand rod) but can everybody paint like De Vinci ( Kerry) ? who also prepares his own "fabric, paint and brushes"........

[Marty]

If everything was on level ground and there was no difference I would stick with my Burkheimer because of the guy building rod. If you know Kerry you would understand. Kerry is one of the pioneering icons of the NW two handed rod. He was there in the beginning and developed a rod that everyone has been trying to duplicate. Kerry’s rods are pure class and give the feel of tradition with the most advanced capabilities. The agate guide says it all. His heart and soul goes into every rod, he is a true master of his art and just a great guy.

I am sure you could say the same thing about Anderson and Meiser. You could compare Kerry, Anderson and Meiser to cane rod builder such as Leonard Payne and Brackett. You get the same feel with their rods as you do when you pick up one of the old classics.

[inland]

It's funny how many people put way too much stock into a rod doing things for them. Burkies aren't any better at fishing then the person using them. If the rod action suits what you desire then its the best since sliced bread. For every Burkheimer lover there are hundreds of thousands just as devoted to Sage, T&T, (gasp) TFO, Orvis, Scott, Winston, and so on.

Rods don't paint masterpieces- the painter does.

William

[doublespey]

Interesting! I hadn't thought about it that way, but in answer to the original question my own prejudice would be to buy American.

Unfortunately, the prices will NEVER be the same. That's why the rods are built in Korea in the first place.

As for Inland's comment about the painter and the paintbrush, I agree. There are many fine rods by all the manufacturers he listed. Given individual preference for weight and action, an accomplished speycaster could probably cast just as effectively with a number of rods from budget to extravagant.

But there is life beyond performance. I can also catch just as many fish with an eggsucking wooley bugger as I could with a fancy speyfly that it took 5 times longer to tie. Just because it's equally effective doesn't negate the aesthetic value of a handcrafted work of art. Kerry's rods are works of art, with amazing fluid actions and exceptional workmanship.

Fortunately for all of us, there are plenty of choices out there for every pocketbook and predilection. :beer2:

[luckybalbowa]

It is very possible to like rods from more than one manufacturer. Usually a manufacturer can do one thing better than others, but the question is "all things being equal....." Well, of course, I would buy local if everything else was equal.

(side note) Kerry Burkheimer is one hell of a nice guy that makes a great product and I will buy from him again in the future.

[Brian Thomas]

I think the last rod I would buy would be a Burkheimer , with a Meiser a close second . Let me explain . I don`t doubt for a second that these two gentlemen build exceptional quality rods .I`ve read the glowing endorsements here , and elsewhere . The reason I`m hesitant , is because I`ve yet to have an opportunity to be able to try any of their rods . I don`t think it`s ever a good idea to buy a rod based on somebody else`s experience with it . It has to feel right in my hands . Example... a friend of mine busted his Sage 10150 a couple of years ago . It`s a rod I`ve grown to like . While it was being repaired , the Sage rep lent him a TCR 10150 .Big ticket item . I hated it .It cast well enough , but IT FELT LIKE A POOL CUE , once the fly was in the water . If I had bought that rod , without first trying it , I would have regretted it .

I would love to have a chance to try some of Mr.Burkheimers` , and Mr. Meisers rods , but without doing so , it`s too much of a gamble .

Just to let you know that I`m not overly loyal to any manufacturer , the six Spey rods I now own , were made by Daiwa UK , Guidelines , Loomis , Loop , Scott , and Snowbee .

[Salmo_g]

If I like a rod, and the rod seems like a good value for its price, then where it's made shouldn't matter much, if at all. It seems to me that prudent consumerism would always seek quality and good value first, with political or philosophical considerations (- like nationalism or union made) in descending priority.

Sg

[Coach Duff]

I think that the only reason people are Winston, Sage, TFO or Loomis desciples is because they haven't had Bob or Kerry custom build one of their tailor made rods for them and fished it. Talk about no comparison, I have owned everything, but its only Meiser or Burkheimer ( and that includes one-handers) for as long as they make them. Kerry has over 60 different tapers for a 5 weight alone, and Bob can build you just as amazing a rod for any special circumstances or application. He built me a 7 foot 6 inch four weight that is incredible. I have a 5 weight Kerry built me that is unreal. We seem to think of them as spey builders only, but my Meiser and Burkheimer one handers are just as magical as the spey rods. None of those factory rods, which I own a bunch of, come even close. If I only knew then what I know now....... Coach:beer2:

[Steelie Mike]

It's funny how many people put way too much stock into a rod doing things for them. Burkies aren't any better at fishing then the person using them. If the rod action suits what you desire then its the best since sliced bread. For every Burkheimer lover there are hundreds of thousands just as devoted to Sage, T&T, (gasp) TFO, Orvis, Scott, Winston, and so on.

Rods don't paint masterpieces- the painter does.

William

Yes and

If I like a rod, and the rod seems like a good value for its price, then where it's made shouldn't matter much, if at all. It seems to me that prudent consumerism would always seek quality and good value first, with political or philosophical considerations (- like nationalism or union made) in descending priority.

Sg

Yes

[inland]

Coach,

That isn't entirely true. Bob and Kerry's finish work yes- they spin circles over almost every 'off the shelf' rod company. Overall rod action and performance is a very personal item. And while I feel Bob and Kerry are the best at what they do (custom rods)...neither make a two handed rod taper that I can't live without. Not because they are 'bad' or not 'the best' but simply because my tastes fall elswhere.

Willliam

[Marty]

Is it not all about taste? I have both custom and factory rods. I can cast all of them and I do switch from rod to rod. But even with the factor rods I prefer my Winston over my Loop because of the fit finish and feel which has nothing to do with casting. I lean towards the traditional end of the spectrum when it comes to equipment. I know there have been some major advancement with equipment over the years but I still stick with the old school stuff. It is all just part of the game. There is no way to win this one because everyone does have different tastes.

[bigtj]

Fly rods are such a personal thing. To make a blanket statement that all meiser and burkheimer rod actions are "better" than mass produced rods is too subjective. I would wager that some folks think a TFO casts better than a Meiser or a Burkheimer for any amount of money. Neither statement is right or wrong it's just a personal opinion. I say let the companies make the products and let the consumers decide what to buy. Besides, at this point in time, there is no way that Meiser or Burkheimer could supply the demand the rest of the rod companies do, and even if they did, they'd no longer be the same kind of company.

If I liked the way the Korean rod cast better I'd buy it over any other rod if I thought I was getting the best product for what I needed. I don't think a Korean spey caster would hesitate to buy a quality American rod, why should Americans hesitate to buy a Korean rod? Nobody flinches at buying a Hardy reel from the UK. The world is globalizing, good stuff comes from everywhere not just America.

The funniest thing about this whole argument is that Mesier and Burkheimer could probably give a rat's you know what about what other people buy. They just make the best rods they can and don't worry about all the other junk. They just leave it up to us internet geeks to worry about. They have better things to do.