I Know in fly only water like the nf stilly you are not allowed to use shot on your leader but the rules don't say anything about indicators... Is it legal?
best fishing regulation ever...I can't speak to the wording in washington's regs, but Oregon has many fly fishing only waters and most allow indicators. If you look at the regs for the fly only stretch of the North Umpqua it explicitly outlaws things that are allowed on all the other "fly only" waters.
And then you have the nymphers with Napolean Complex. That, in itself, is just as hilarious.The superiority complex that some swingers have is down right hilarious.
I say no to any private meetings, this debate is far to entertaining to stop now !Ira,
Surely we have been through this before. Respect is among the last things I strive for in indicator threads, but I'd hate to learn that you've lost respect for me on all topics and all things.
Ignorance abounds to a degree among all the fraternities, swing, indicator, and others. You won't find me denying that nymph fishing requires skill, just as most methods require skill to do well. It might be true that in order to experience the highest possible success in indicator fishing requires more skill than is required to enjoy the highest possible success while swing fishing; I honestly don't know. However it doesn't require extremely high skill in order to experience a good degree of success with indicator fishing, and I think that is why it attracts some anglers who haven't experienced much success with the traditional swing method.
As for swingers demonizing indicator fishermen, I think they do it because they see the indicator guys taking the easy way out, meaning they will hook more fish per unit of time spent fishing than if they stuck with the swing. I, on the other hand, only demonize indicator fishermen on internet indicator threads because I find it hilariously funny that such a large mountain can be made of such a small mole hill.
I do agree with those who think it is more of an accomplishment to hook a steelhead on a swung fly than by nymphing for the same reason it is more of an accomplishment to do most anything with a less effective method. Choosing to swing flies for steelhead rather than indicator nymph is to adopt a self-imposed constraint that limits success when measured in hook ups per hour angled. Sort of like traditional bow hunting (recurve or longbow) limits one to spend more hours to get within range for an effective kill shot than with a modern firearm. Then there are contemporary compound wheel bows, that are analogous to indicator fishing in that they allow success rates similar to some firearm hunting because of their extended range.
The less effective method is not a superior method. It is just less effective, and in this case, is more traditional, which has value in itself to some folks. Another aspect of traditional swing fishing that I think is over-looked is that it effectively spreads a limited resource among more users due to its inherent limitations. The NF Stilly is an excellent example of this. A large part of the original intent of the NF Stilly fly only regulations was in the recognition that allowing anything goes fishing would rapidly deplete the native summer steelhead population. And that would not be good for the fish; and it would have meant recreation for far fewer anglers. Of course this was all before the notion of CNR was a part of angling consciousness, let alone fishing regulations, but it still applies under contemporary CNR circumstances.
Ira, you with your superior method and preference for it and acquired skill set may kill or sore mouth steelhead that would have provided recreation for 6 or 10 traditional anglers. Surely you don't think I ought to congratulate you for that now, do you?
BTW, if you know what the mystique of the swung fly is, would you please tell me, because I sure as hell don't know. It is a mystique to me however, because I cannot fathom why steelhead, and other fish, move to it, just as I cannot fathom why they grab a dead drifted plastic bead. But I am grateful that they do, the swung fly, that is.
Yes Ira, I have read a number of your other posts on this subject. What I take from it is that you seem to take this internet topic a tad more seriously than I do. I'm mostly having fun with it while also trying to mix in a small amount of educational content, which I may not be very successful at.
And yes, you should encourage other anglers to swing flies so that you can have all those unmoved steelhead to your indicating self, if that's what you really want out of this sport. We should meet for a beer and then see how much time we're really willing to waste on this topic.
Sg
That's funny, because I feel the same way about swinging flies. I call it "brain drain" because it's so mind numbingly boring. I usually set my girlfriend up to swing flies because getting a drag free drift with a nymph is too challenging.The problem with nymphing is that is sucks. Pure and simple, it is no fun. I'd truly rather not fish than fish a bobber of any sort in the river. Hooked fish don't get me excited if nymhed up. I'd rather be mowing my lawn.
I truly 100% don't understand the alore at all. I find the thought of nymphing unpleasant at best and hate seeing nymphers or even internet discusions of nymphing because it sucks.
Go Sox,
cds
What I typed is a pretty accurate comparison. I don't expect people with NC to actually see it themselves. As many times as you've stated you can't be offended without your consent, these threads sure would lead some to believe different. What's the old saying, "thou dost protest too much"?So swingers who pick on indicator fisherman, now I get it. Thanks for the clarification. Although you said nymphers with this syndrome... can't say that I've met one.
Nymphing and swinging are actually pretty easy. To do it well, with solid results, is the hard part. I've done a fair bit of both and know I'd outfish myself probably close to 6-1 if I strictly nymphed.That's funny, because I feel the same way about swinging flies. I call it "brain drain" because it's so mind numbingly boring. I usually set my girlfriend up to swing flies because getting a drag free drift with a nymph is too challenging.
This is the point that I continue to make. I always make it clear that I don't care how others fish and my interjections on the subject are only in response to swinger zealots. I do not for a second think that my way of fishing is the best way for everyone else it is though how I most enjoy the sport and I think it is funny that others struggle with the fact that I like to fish an indicator and they think I do it only to catch more fish. I do catch fish with an indicator but I've taken enough people out now with fishing skill to be aware enough that it is not as easy to do successfully as many people make it out to be. I still fish with some very good anglers who just don't do as well as I do fishing the same method I fish, even if I set them up with the depth and the flies. Not being arrogant, but I believe I do better because it is what I love to do so I've taken the time to really understand it.Again, I've got more important things to do than spend a minute of my life worrying about how someone else fishes. The part that does interest me, is that attitude with which others have about their preferred way of angling. THAT, I find somewhat comical.
The only real important part of this affliction called FF'ing is that we enjoy it. All this other stuff is simply BS.