30 lb steelhead on the hoh

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by TomB, Feb 21, 2009.

  1. TomB

    TomB Active Member

    I agree that the resource managers deserve alot of blame Jeremy, but I also believe we each are responsible for our own decisions, and if someone decides to kill a wild fish, legal or not, I don't think it is unfair to hold them accountable. With the state of wild steelhead populations on the Hoh (and most other places), intentionally killing one is, in my opinion, unethical and deplorable.
     
  2. ak_powder_monkey

    ak_powder_monkey Proud to Be Alaskan

    I got the data from ADF&G's comprensive trout managment plan for southeast Alaska, if 20% of the fish are repeat spawners and 10% are over 36 inches then this all makes sense...
     
  3. Flyborg

    Flyborg Active Member

    Who cares if it's harassment? We're men, they're fish, that's what we do. The point is, without catch and release, we won't be able to continue harassing them.
     
  4. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

    Cough, Cough, gotta remember guys where the retaining the one wild rule came from. If you don't like it you can probably head to Pike Place or to the local Haggens store and buy one. Hell at $25 a whale the 50 percent overage of catch would probably add up to $.35 Forks mayor, guide service, WA gov? You guys can figure it out
     
  5. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

    Or maybe "douchesickle"?
     
  6. wolverine

    wolverine Member

    Just think about it. Had he just taken a pic and then let it go he would have been a fly rod hero. He chose to bonk it, even though its legal on certain rivers, he's become a pariah. To each his own. He made the choice to kill it. I doubt that he'll post pictures anywhere as he knows that he'll get flamed.
     
  7. inland

    inland Active Member

    "I do fish for steelhead, only in rivers with hatchery populations."

    Then you are the one who is causing more damage. Through solely supporting THE VERY mechanism that legally allowed/continues to allow the near extinction of wild stocks.

    What I don't get is your harassment angle. Angling to kill which is harassing a fish in order to be reduced to camp meat. So that is OK? That makes you morally superior? While fishing purely for fun isn't? I will take my odds of a MAXIMUM 1-2% wild incidental fish kill. Considering the state of wild fish right now its going take a while before I kill too many of them.

    The most intelligent suggestion would be for you to stop fishing. Would cause you less internal conflict. Your complete support of fish culture pretty much kills any point you had. Let alone your hypocritical "I release most of what I catch" comment.

    William
     
  8. Ed Call

    Ed Call Mumbling Moderator Staff Member

    HOLY FREAKING CRAP someone tossed a damn grenade into the forum. Lots of steam and testosterone in this one.
     
  9. Jim Speaker

    Jim Speaker Active Member

    Manimal, my point is that based on the discussion on the gear forum which included a couple posts from folks who had seen the fish, it was wild. Now, from what I read (so far) nobody knew whether it was deep hooked and bleeding out or what... who knows. I'm in no way judgmental towards the angler in question, I wasn't there. My comment was simply that the statement
    is kinda ridiculous. That's what I mean about thinking it all the way through. If you get a wild fish take great care and release it so its genes are spread - and bonk the hatcheries. It's selective C&R there is just a little more to it. And it's fishing. w00t
     
  10. SpeySpaz

    SpeySpaz still an authority on nothing

    well, there's this whole objectionable "fish as penis size substitute" thing that bothers me.

    Of course, being hung like a donkey, I am more than satisfied with little fish:D and have much less to prove than our douchesickle peninsula wild-fish psycho-bonker.
    perhaps he should consider an implant of some sort...or take up a different hobby.
     
  11. i love daryls avatar....my dream
     
  12. Big E

    Big E Moderator Staff Member

    I'm not familiar with your fishery...how scarce are 30lb steelhead either wild or hatchery? What's the average size of steelhead? How many fish of this size would you find in the approx 1300 fish that are expected to be gill netted on the Hoh this year?
     
  13. Manimal

    Manimal Member


    Will,
    I take your points and agree with some of what you say. No doubt what i do is hypocritical, not arguing that. I should stop fishing, that would solve the ethical dilemma if i werent going to eat them. When i fish for food, i release what i first catch that i wont keep if under sized. Then stop fishing after i've taken what i need. Fishing to kill to eat is not harassment i dont get your angle on that. Fishing for the thrill of C+R is simply satisfying a strange desire not related to survival.

    The very mechansim that has created the near extinction of our steelhead, as far as we know, has been logging, commercial by-catch and over fishing, and destruction of spawning habitat. Having hatchery fish in a river is an illusion of a healthy river but i am not sure how it contributes to wild stock extinction.

    In BC we have very few hatchery rivers and the wild stocks may be in worse condition than the WA rivers (at least south of the DEAN).

    In any case, my original point was not to argue my superiority, it was to convince that chosing C+R over bonking in general is not ethically superior. While the bonker of the 30lber maybe shouldnt have killed that fish, i dont think we can claim superiority just because we C+R as a rule, because what/you do can be just as harmful...
     
  14. Jeremy Floyd

    Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

    Tom I wasn't saying the person responsible is without blame. I think it is upsetting on several levels. That said, it is like bitching about a guy going 59 in a 60 zone when it is dark and stormy. Some folks may feel it's too fast and dangerous but they are within their legal rights.

    I find it far more upsetting that the legal option is there, than the fact that someone actually did it.
     
  15. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

    You'll probably have to ask the nates that buy the mono nets, I would guess 6 and 1/2 inch mesh would just about catch everything but the king salmon.
     
  16. ZigZag

    ZigZag Member

    Holy s%#$ You can legally catch and kill native steelhead?
     
  17. sportsman

    sportsman Active Member

    "In any case, my original point was not to argue my superiority"... that's good because you failed at it! " it was to convince that chosing C+R over bonking in general is not ethically superior." You lost that one also.... A DEAD NATIVE FISH IS JUST THAT....DEAD, BUT IF IT WAS RELEASED IT HAD A GOOD CHANCE OF SPAWNING ONE MORE TIME! While the bonker of the 30lber maybe shouldnt have killed that fish," i dont think we can claim superiority" ...... nobody is talking 'superiority" except you....Gee, we have diametrically opposed thumbs, kinda makes us 'superior' in the animal kingdom,,, but for some that doesn't translate into the common sense of trying to perpetuate an endanjeresd specie!When the last one is gone, it's lights out, sayanora, no mas... end of the fucking road!
     
  18. Ryan Buccola

    Ryan Buccola I ain't broke but brother I am badly bent

    how about "tardsickle"
     
  19. Redsider

    Redsider New Member

    No proof, no pictures...why all the drama?? The original post from Pisca looks like rumor at best. It looks even more like someone stirring the pot.



    Is the fishing really that slow for you all that this is what we do?
     
  20. inland

    inland Active Member

    Manimal,

    In the US hatchery fish were the mechanism allowing overharvest and extractive habitat uses. Our fish were gone over 100 years ago in nets. The solution to the problem were hatchery fish. Instead of reducing harvest we would create more fish. Instead of responsible logging we would mitigate through hatcheries. People were fighting the destruction back then too. Hatcheries were the legal foundation for allowing everything that destroyed the wild fish. I also assumed 'Vancouver' was the Washington version not BC. Which you would see first hand how hatcheries were (and continue to be) substituted for habitat and responsible harvest.

    I can't argue about there being a 'completion' when fishing for harvest. Serves a purpose. Just not when flyfishing for steelhead. Which, I assumed, we are talking about flyfishing. Sure flyfishing puts fish on the BBQ but seems like a rediculous way to go about it if comparing to mans survival. I see black and white. If my survival depended on eating a steelhead the last thing I would do is angle for them with rod and reel. Since you are using rod and reel angling 'for pleasure' (and you know it) to kill...that means you are harassing your food before you kill it. Goes against the crux of your arguement to bash on those which are up in arms, as they should be, over the DIRECT harvest of wild steelhead in the lower 48.

    The point of people gripes over this killed Hoh fish is pretty simple. If a fly angler caught 100 30# Hoh steelhead odds are, at most, 2 of them MIGHT die. It took this guy one fish. Which isn't fair to the fish or other anglers. What man did eons ago, through evolution, has nothing to do with modern pressures. Blatantly put... IF the fish were still abundant enough to allow direct harvest I would be all for it. As it is they aren't. And we are left to play with them.

    William
     

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