FYI: Boat-ban suggested for Klickitat, Hoh, other rivers

#61
The issue that concerns me is spawning success after fish have been c and r once, twice, three or ten times. WE DON'T KNOW. I have a hard time believing it doesn't have some impact. This is what needs to be addressed. While the specifics of the boat regs particularly on the duc and calawah are a bit much in my opinion it is something that could help this issue. This isn't to benefit any user group it is to protect the fish. I have a lot of opinions after what I've seen personally on the coast but I'll leave it at that....
 

Chris Bellows

Your Preferred WFF Poster
#62
i've been thinking about this a bit and i think i'm bothered by the fact that it is small stretches above some of the worst boating and fishing abuses (lower river bait fishing). i think picking an entire river system would be better.

i think the hoh would be the best choice. tons of boat pressure, lots of wading access, and runs barely or not making escapement. they also currently have data on the high levels of c&r on hoh river fish. i think a couple seasons ago they calculated that something like 70% of the escapement number was caught and released.
 
#63
Which is worse, c and r mortality on a tide fresh, uncaught steelhead Lip hooked on bait or one c and r'd 3 times while staged upriver waiting for enough water to run up its creek? After it dodged sea lions, jonas' gill nets and the fleet of guides... I mean sport fishermen? I think they deserve better
 

gt

Active Member
#64
the escapement on the Hoh is not met simply because of lower river netting 6 out of every 7 days. rec angling has not much to do with this disaster.
 
#66
the escapement on the Hoh is not met simply because of lower river netting 6 out of every 7 days. rec angling has not much to do with this disaster.
But if we limit other's fishing we'll have more of the river to ourselves and if we can't make a real change to benefit the run, we can at least make a change that will benefit us and pretend it's all about the fish!
 

Derek Young

Emerging Rivers Guide Services
#67
Just need $60 to party...

Which is worse, c and r mortality on a tide fresh, uncaught steelhead Lip hooked on bait or one c and r'd 3 times while staged upriver waiting for enough water to run up its creek? After it dodged sea lions, jonas' gill nets and the fleet of guides... I mean sport fishermen? I think they deserve better
 
#68
But if we limit other's fishing we'll have more of the river to ourselves and if we can't make a real change to benefit the run, we can at least make a change that will benefit us and pretend it's all about the fish!

Not sure what you mean since the vast majority of fly anglers on the coast nymph from the boat on the move and the fly angling guide community depends on it. This isn't a joust at gear anglers it will effect everyone even swingers. Ie More displaced pressure onto the gravel bars. I nymph from the boat every day but I'm more than willing to give up that privilege if it means more steelhead on redds
 

Ed Call

Well-Known Member
#70
As regulations change, so too will tactics to catch the fish. I'll follow the rules changes as they happen, but I hope the rule changes make sense for the strength of the runs and are both enforceable and enforced. I recall when part of a small local river was made "Fly Fishing Only" with intent to reduce snagging of hatchery fish that were mixed in with two native species. The same rec anglers of all types were right out there, cheap fly rod combos in hand, with weighted flies and learning new fish snagging techniques with a new type of pole in hand. The more regs change, the more things stay the same, the angling community finds a way to successfully locate and get into fish.

Will this one make a difference? I think it could, but I'm just a talentless fly angler that puts very little pressure on any fish species.
 

Chris Bellows

Your Preferred WFF Poster
#71
Jim Kerr, JD Love, and a few others
the point was that the vast majority besides JD have not lived out there as long as many of the gear fishing guides... so basing guide licenses on long-term residency would reduce the number of fly fishing guides to one or maybe two. the idea of basing guiding on long-term residency might sound good but would remove the majority of the guides so popular on this board.
 
#72
the escapement on the Hoh is not met simply because of lower river netting 6 out of every 7 days. rec angling has not much to do with this disaster.
I agree but what happens to them once they pass the nets? Isn't that our concern at that point?
 

Charles Sullivan

ignoring Rob Allen and Generic
#74
I don't think the road to success is paved with changes to the sport anglers rulebook. It's easy. There is a mechanism for these changes, but I don't think the results will be equal to the internal sportfishing carnage these changes will create.

No one likes being restricted. If there were people who wanted to outlaw wade fishing due to redd damage and not boat fishing, I'd be pissed. A little empathy goes a long way here. The issue at hand is the early returning steelhead. They have been largely impacted by the net fishery for hatchery fish. C&R mortality does not help but even eliminating it may not make much of a difference either. I commend WSC for noticing the need to bolster these populations, but I can't support the proposal.

In truth, lawyers guns and money are the items required to deal with the issues the early OP returners face. The presence of hatchery fish, foregone opportunity, the lack of reasonable (and sometimes approved) harvest management plans by the co-managers and wild steelhead kill reg.'s hurt these fish most.

Success will likely depend on an arrow like approach to these issues as I see it. The present approach athough laudable for it's intent is a shotgun styled apprach where large game is being fired at with birdshot. The management paradigm WDFW finds itself in due to tribal rights and lack of power over the co-managers needs to change. Hence, lawyers, guns and money.

P.S. I added the guns part only because of the song. I sincerely hope no guns are used in any political disagreement over fish. Lawyers and money are certainly needed though.

Go Sox,
cds
 
#75
the point was that the vast majority besides JD have not lived out there as long as many of the gear fishing guides... so basing guide licenses on long-term residency would reduce the number of fly fishing guides to one or maybe two. the idea of basing guiding on long-term residency might sound good but would remove the majority of the guides so popular on this board.
If it was only about helping the fish this wouldn't matter.