accidentally discarding flies in the lake

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Allison, Apr 24, 2006.

  1. Allison Banned or Parked

    Posts: 829
    Seattle, WA
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    I've heard it's a common practice for new fly fishers to lose flies in the lake, stream, or whatever body of water they are fishing. Assuming the knots are good, what causes this? I'm a good little knot tyer and am losing bucketloads of flies when I am casting/fishing.

    What the hell am I doing wrong to be losing all these #@$^!!! flies? I'm not good at tying yet, and flies are at a premium. Usually I am getting tippet with no fly and a wrinkled bit on the end of the tippet. So maybe it IS the knot to tie the fly onto the tippet????

    **this is NOT including flies lost to the reeds, backcasting into the grass, or faulty fish landing practices. I'm only asking about the ones that are mysteriously leaving the end of my tippet.**
  2. Zen Piscator Supporting wild steelhead, gravel to gravel.

    Posts: 3,076
    Missoula, MT
    Ratings: +13 / 0
    What knot are u using? It does sound like faulty knot tying is mostly to blame. Also, wait a bit on the back cast, alot of newer fishers snap off flies all the time when they hurry the casting.

    And, there isnt much need to ever go under 5x, and yesterday i used 5x for the first time in 2 years, but that was also the first time in 2 years or whenever that I had fished the ford.

    I usually stick to 0, 2, or for smaller trout 4x for my lightest applications.

    Also, are you wetting your knots with saliva? Tying a knot and cinching it tight while try will reduce breaking strengh hugely.

    Peace,
    Andy
  3. Michael Brady New Member

    Posts: 300
    Seattle, WA
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    What method of tying the flies on are you using.
    I go with a Uni-Knot. I haven't lost a fly except for the occasional tree snag.
  4. jeff bandy Make my day

    Posts: 2,241
    Edmonds, Wa.
    Ratings: +284 / 1
    Usually I am getting tippet with no fly and a wrinkled bit on the end of the tippet. So maybe it IS the knot to tie the fly onto the tippet????

    Are you cutting the tail off ,real close to the knot? That little (wrinkled) end, is your knot. It didn't break off, just came untied:(

    Check how your knot on the link. tighten it wet. then, trim just trim the tail so it's shorter then the hairs on the fly.

    I went through the same thing when I started.
    It's hard to learn this stuff without some help.
    Jeff
  5. espja New Member

    Are you whipping your casts?
    Maybe your timing is off when your casting causing you to snap off flies?
  6. jimmysworking Well, at least I'm supposed to be...

    Posts: 72
    Kent, WA
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    These are the two biggest reasons I lost flies when I started, now it is mostly to feed a hungry tree.
  7. Old Man Just an Old Man

    Posts: 21,614
    Dillon, Mt
    Ratings: +1,655 / 0
    If you are using the Clinch Knot or the improved one,it is probably coming undone because it wasn't tightened properly. Go to the home page and click on knots. There are several good ones there and ask Zen about his Davy Knot. Easy to tie and I haven't had any problem with it coming untied.

    Jim
  8. Porter Active Member

    Posts: 6,429
    Kenmore, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +512 / 0
    Davy Knot? Zen is this posted anywhere.

    I find the clinch knot to be a poor knot but the improved clinch knot is a good strong and easily tied knot that I have really never encountered problems with. Zen makes a great point of lubricating your line before you tightenn it. Another good knot...that I sometimes use especially on leeches and streamers is the Duncan Loop...It's on the page Jim described.
  9. PeteM Member

    Posts: 625
    Snohomish, WA, US.
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    Check the knots you're using. A uni-knot is easy and holds well.

    Pay attention to your backcast. Most flies I see newer flyfishers losing are being snapped off during the backcast. Instead of letting the line completely unroll behind them, they are powering the stroke too early and doubling the force on the fly (top line is going one direction while the bottom part of the line is going in the opposite direction).

    For flies, a good place to pick up cheaper flies is outdoor emporium in Seattle. They are .75c instead of 1.25 - 1.75. They aren't the strongest hooks but they work and if you're losing a lot of flies, they will keep the expense down. Hill's discount flies has good prices as well.

    Good luck!

    Pete
  10. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    I use the improved clinch 90% of the time and never have issues with it. Wet the knot in your mouth with spit and tighten very slowly but very firmly. Test it with a good tug.

    You'll know if it is your casting because you'll hear the snapping \ whip cracking sound behind you.

    About the only time I lose flies now days is when I hit that branch sticking out on the far bank that I didn't see at first and I can't wade over and get it back. And a few are lost now and then on the back cast when the hook catches a branch as I do my foward stroke - but mostly I just stop my cast and go untangle my hook.
  11. Jason Decker Active Member

    Posts: 2,626
    Issaquah, WA
    Ratings: +1 / 0
    iagree

    moistening knots is critical

    if you are doing this on the lakes too, then it's gotta be either the knots or the cast


    jason

  12. Jergens AKA Joe Willauer

    Posts: 2,141
    Twin Bridges, MT
    Ratings: +19 / 0
    yeah, make sure your using appropriate tippet for appropriate flies. if your throwing a ibg heavy bug on light tippet it could easly break or unravel a knot.
  13. Zen Piscator Supporting wild steelhead, gravel to gravel.

    Posts: 3,076
    Missoula, MT
    Ratings: +13 / 0
    The clinch knot is in my opinon a poor knot, and the improved clinch is often times weeker and also harder to tie.

    Instead I use the uni-knot (known also as the duncan loop) for most of my fishing.

    The other knot i use for smaller flies is a davy knot (the one ryan davey wishes he invented :rofl:) which is just a figure 8 knot. Its stronger than an improved clinch and takes less than 1 secound to tie if you practice alot, but its not as strong as a uni-knot. Hope this helps.

    Peace,
    Andy
  14. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    what kind of line are you using?

    You may want to stick with Maxima UG down to 4lb as your tippet. That line is tough.

    4lb should be fine for most trout fishing until you start going smaller than size 16 or so. And if you start doing bigger flies (like woolly buggers and such), or are fishing stained or cloudy water - stick with 6lb.

    Unless you are fishing spring creeks for selective trout on size 22's - you don't need fancy fly shop tippets. A few spools of Maxima UG will last you quite a while. Apparently the line agrees with clinch and improved clinch knots because like I said, I use that knot 90% of the time with no knot issues (that includes tough as nails chums and acrobatic silvers testing my leader\tipppet knots to the max).
  15. theworm New Member

    Posts: 193
    Smokey Point Wa.
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    I prefer flourocarbon. It rules! If and when you do break though, look at the breaking point. If it is a break in the middle of the knot you can tell by the way the line frayed or curled.
  16. Old Man Just an Old Man

    Posts: 21,614
    Dillon, Mt
    Ratings: +1,655 / 0
    Yeah,but flourocarbon sinks. No good on a dry.

    Jim
  17. Porter Active Member

    Posts: 6,429
    Kenmore, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +512 / 0
    I have to diasagree with the improved clinch knot being weaker...and why harder to tie? :confused: ? maybe you have more experience landing those S.W. Steelhead..heh ...I've seen the pictures :eek: ? For me it (improved clinch) has been great for many number of years.

    I Like the Duncan Loop/Uni Knot like you say.....I know the figure 8...aka Davy Knot..Huh? Just like flies...same flies but many number of names attached to them...:confused: at times! :)
  18. ceviche Active Member

    Posts: 2,312
    Shoreline, Washington, U.S.A.
    Ratings: +42 / 0
    The thing I'm trying to figure out is where all those flies end up. It's like they should be somewhere, right? But how many of you actually ever find them? I never even find the ones that other people lose, let alone the ones I lose. So, like, whazzup? Where do they go?:confused:
  19. Porter Active Member

    Posts: 6,429
    Kenmore, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +512 / 0
    That hungry rock or tree in many of our waters has them? I know of one spot the Sky where you can catch fish but also you can lose flies by the galore ...(several a day)...because something lurks below...I believe a 100 year-old Fir tree...I just call him Muncher now! I always think I can outdo him but he wins more than I like to admit...and he helps the potential catch too at times :(
  20. Zen Piscator Supporting wild steelhead, gravel to gravel.

    Posts: 3,076
    Missoula, MT
    Ratings: +13 / 0
    The Davy Knot
    [IMG]

    The Improved Clinch

    [IMG]

    Well its just been stronger for me. The improved clinch is more complex to tie, so i guess it would be more difficult for a beginner or someone with limited dexterity, like i have when it gets way cold. Improved clinch will work, just not as well as others.