Book Review: Magical Fly Fishing for Majestic Steelhead!

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by Zen Piscator, Jan 31, 2006.

  1. Nailknot Active Member

    Posts: 1,907
    Ratings: +11 / 0
    Amusing thread. I find it quite amazing that the core American value of literary criticism and debate is under fire. But not surprised, given the warped view of media as open discussion forum in this day and age. Criticism is patriotic. And Zen did one hell of a job. You think Zen's review is harsh, look at the NYT review of books, any Sunday. Grow up you ninnies. If you are bent on bashing WFF, you could find a better cause. Or probably not. Get over it.
  2. James Mello Inventor of the "closed eye conjecture"

    Posts: 2,785
    Ratings: +88 / 0
    Nailknot, I do have one issue with your response! :) I do think that there is merit in resisting group think, and I for one have been very much of the idea of "love it or leave it" :) So in that regard I do raise my glass to SilverFly. :beer2: :beer2: But other than that, the freedom to critique and dissemanate that information is the basis of what we are as a country!

    Now, the real difficultly to me in this whole thing is how some people will knee jerk defend this, and others will knee jerk pig pile on.

    RANT ON (and not pointed to you Nailknot!)

    As far as I'm concerned, unless you've gone back to the archives and read the *kinds of claims* that Clay has made, you really aren't in a position to understand Andy's review of the book.


    Other than that, this thread has been one of the more entertaining things to read in a loooonnnggg time, and it's very neat to see most of the discussion being accomplished in a civil manner!
  3. Northlake27 Member

    Posts: 102
    Twisp wa, us.
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    I have followed the Sharp Steelie saga with interest and amusement, he has evolved from super steelheader to bragart to jerk to author to oppressed abused victim.
    I have two questions;
    1. Has anyone ever fished with him and witnessed his prowess?
    2. Where can I get a "Sharp Steelie" T-shirt?
  4. Les Johnson Les Johnson

    Posts: 1,590
    .Redmond, WA
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    I have already stated on this thread that I wish Clay's book the success it derserves. I know Clay only through the two-day visit I had from him at the Orvis store when I was working.
    In a general sense though there certainly is a lot of emphasis among "fly fishermen" to boast about the numbers of fish (any fish) they catch in a day. sometimes the numbers are merely inflated and at others they are preposterous. It is not about the fishing and all that it encompasses but all about the catching and nothing more.
    This trait among some fly fishers does seem to be the nature of the beast in recent years but certainly not the majority. We can get fly-fishing back on track by simply ignoring things that are not in keeping with the spirit of Fredrick Halford, Dame Juliana Behner, Roderick Haig-Brown, A.J. McClane and others who wrote so elequently about the sport of fly-fishing. Based on this thread it appears that, "we have seen the enemy and it is us" and I did indeed throw one of the barbs. I'm sorry I did it.
    Good Fishing,
    Les Johnson
  5. Paul_ Active Member

    Posts: 212
    La Center
    Ratings: +99 / 0
    Us SW WA boys are just mad because they left out the 360, in the Seahawks Super Bowl Song. 206, 425, 253 and no 360, man we get no respect:)
    the 360 mafia- deer punchers and blunt nose brooder trout cowboys
  6. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    Uh, 360 is up north here too...
  7. SilverFly Active Member

    Posts: 395
    Camas, WA
    Ratings: +58 / 0
    "Ninnies", not exactly what I had in mind when I invited (in jest) taking on the satirical wrath directed at Clay, but I give you points for creativity.

    You're right in suggesting I over-reacted to Zen's review, but maybe you missed that I already apologized for "giving Zen both barrels". Unfortunately, he took the brunt of my offense to "criticism" of an individual that has gone far too long, and beyond the envelope of what is necessary to "put him in his place" (by ANY reasonable standard). It is the personal, and protracted nature of the attacks on this guy that is drawing my fire. Trust me, if I didn't know the history, I would have been laughing along with everyone else. In literary terms, Zen did a great job and obviously has a strong wit.

    I also applaud your defense of the "core American value of literary criticism and debate" (ironically, two activities I was engaging in). While we're waving flag, I would just like to know when criticism of an individual taken to the point of verbally eviscerating him and stomping on his entrails has become a "core American value".

    We all get it, everyone hates this guy. I just think WFF "could find a better cause" by moving on now, and forgetting about him for good.
  8. Jason Rolfe Wanderer

    Posts: 1,178
    the beach
    Ratings: +373 / 0
    Imagine all of this coming from a bunch of third graders. A big group of eight year olds calling one other kid a bunch of names because he boasted about something--maybe how fast he could go on his bike--and then everyone found out he was full of it. I know most school teachers, and probably most parents, would tell their kids to be the better person. Instead of bashing the boastful kid with the rest of the group, they would be told that the proper thing to do is move on. The boastful kid didn't do anything except tell a stupid lie, and now he gets bullied for it.
    I thought Zen's review was great. But the way everyone has bullied Clay...
  9. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    How does one feel better about and elevate himself, if he doesn't have someone he can point to and laugh in front of others?

    Zen's review was great by the way.
  10. ZugBug Member

    Posts: 213
    Castle Rock, Colorado
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    You mean like the Democrats and GW?;)
  11. Desmond Wiles Sir Castaline

    Posts: 812
    Snohomish, Wa
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    I could understand a 3rd grader making up stories about how fast he can go on his bike, I was that 3rd grader once. Getting laughed at and mocked for telling stories is a lesson to the fibber: fibbing doesn't earn you friends (unless your good at it, which I wasn't), it only earns you a painted bullseye to your forehead! Sure, the group of 3rd graders gang'n up on the kid will always get out of hand, but that's the nature of the beast isn't it? That kid, should he learn from his actions, won't make the same mistake again....... or, he'll grow into a pattern of embellishing his stories more and end up as another Clay Sharp!
  12. Matt Burke Active Member

    Posts: 3,654
    Ratings: +66 / 0
    I really don’t think that anyone hates Clay even if he does make it easy. What I think is striking is that you guys feel compelled to come over here as the appointed ethics police of the internet highway. I bought into being “PC” the last time this issue raised it’s ugly head and deleted several of my posts on several sites regarding Clay. I’m not much of a diplomat and tire quickly of that kind of BS. I am astonished that he wrote a book. This reminds me so much of the Jehovah Witness folks trying to beat down everyone’s door because they need to get their brand of God poured down their throat. Clay’s audacity to keep trying to pump the community is bizarre. I’m tired of being “PC”. Clay is a damn moron. Your compulsion to be the cyber ethics police is damn weird. Any of the new guys to the site that buys into this Clay Sharp crap deserves to be parted from their cash. Christ, I am so God Damn tired of this BULLSHlT. Three years and it’s like a strain of antibiotic resistant Syphilis that wont go away.
  13. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    Matt, please, don't hold anything back. I hate haveing to read between the lines. Tell us how you REALLY feel :rofl:
  14. SilverFly Active Member

    Posts: 395
    Camas, WA
    Ratings: +58 / 0
    Exactly my point.
  15. Jim Wallace Smells like low tide

    Posts: 5,663
    Somewhere on the Coast
    Ratings: +544 / 0
    I finally read thru this thread:eek: Nice satirical book review there, Zen. I have no intelligent comments on the resulting comments, though...just another wisecrack:

    This thread ain't no "soft parade," but if Jim Morrison had been a steelheader, I imagine the lyrics to one of his songs would have been,

    "When I was a lad back in seminary school, someone put forth the proposition that you cannot petition the Lord for a steelhead with prayer...":rofl:

    Now, I'd better go find a place to hide!:rofl:

  16. smc Active Member

    Posts: 383
    Up River
    Ratings: +30 / 0
    Nice review Zen. Never imagined it'd go this far when I first read it.

    I find myself all nostalgic for some Bob Lawless commentary.

    Steve, the incredulous about this thread. :cool:
  17. doublespey Steelhead-a-holic

    Posts: 596
    Bothell, WA
    Ratings: +22 / 0
    Tried to resist this thread but have finally given in.

    1. Thanks Matt - you summed up the gist of my thoughts.

    2. Re the whole PC thing - Clay is an adult. He left his trail of outlandish
    claims, pious self-gratification, and pink flies in his wake. Now he's
    written this book. If he didn't like the abuse, I'd think he would have
    quit long ago. I've met him and we talked for a bit - i didn't dislike
    him at all - in fact I felt a bit sad as he seems to have a enormous
    need for attention and respect.

    3. Zug - are you kidding re GW? Alone, in small groups, . . . . the
    laughing never stops!


  18. inland Active Member

    Posts: 598
    Ratings: +49 / 0

    Nice! :) I'm sure it's all jealousy tho...

  19. Zen Piscator Supporting wild steelhead, gravel to gravel.

    Posts: 3,076
    Missoula, MT
    Ratings: +13 / 0
    You might be shocked to find out what Clay is currently doing with his life.
  20. Mark Kulikov Active Member

    Posts: 438
    Polson Montana
    Ratings: +77 / 0

    Are you sure you want to keep this post rolling Zen?:hmmm: