CHIRONOMID THREAD -

Discussion in 'Stillwater' started by Drifter, Jan 11, 2012.

  1. Blue Active Member

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    I wanted to pass this on as well to those that are not familiar with them. These are great for Multi fly aplication as they can't twist like tying a tag to the leader.

    http://gamakatsu.com/new_products/new_dropperbead.htm

    I use a small split shot below the dropper bead to keep it from sliding down but a knot will also work. Sink putty is cool cause you need very little. For 6 lb line the medium works great. 6lb is probably max for the small, but small will work as well.
  2. pond monkey Guest

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    Hi Blue,
    I cannot speak to fishing out of a pontoon boat.... You would have to try it.... another thing I believe that you mentioned fish only one foot off the bottom....I'm at 2-3 feet especially in deep flats. I don't want risk being out of sight as trout don't look down but from any reasonable distance they can easily see up.
    The barrel swivel versus shot is a no brainer....... they never come off.
    FYI....I never bother with two flies. It is illegal in BC anyway, although many ignore the silly law.....I have spent hours even days fishing side by side with a friend who uses two flies most of the time.... Fish are almost always caught on the point fly....plus I have had many days catching quit a few more fish than my bud using two flies .... so I just don't want to fart around with it......

    Paul
  3. Blue Active Member

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    Pontoon on lakes is the norm here, but as I said I also fish from shore lines and try to guess the depth.
    I put one fly a foot off the bottom and the second fly is actually 2 to 3 feet up from that so basically cover two depths. This has resulted in numerous doubles which is always fun and interesting trying to net.
    I am seriously thinking the swivel idea this year, but I do so like the dropper beads...LOL
    If multi flies are illegal then one it is for sure. I use the multi flies never exceeding three as it gets really crazy unless wash lining. And I agree they generally hit just one fly but again I have had numerous doubles. I have had them hit one fly so I remove the other to find they no longer hit. I put the other fly back and they hit again. Maybe an attractor thing.

    It is all about what one feels comfortable with and I love to fart around..LOL
  4. pond monkey Guest

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    Hi Mark,
    When we am fishing Diamond or Crane or Wickiup we're fishing in water that is only 6'-7' much of the time ....sometimes up to 12' but it really isn't necessary to be in water deeper than 12' once you get familiar.....So over there I always use a tapered leader....I use a 9' 3X nylon ( cut down to 8' ).... then I ad 4' of 3X flouro to extend and then knot on 4X flouro tippet. I grease most the tapered leader portion with a paste floatant so it sinks not... don't want to drag down my bobber.. plus if it's floating it's much easier to pick up...


    Paul
  5. pond monkey Guest

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    Hi Blue,
    With all due respect, I really don't care about hooking two fish at a time. That is just a distraction to me, a bother... and also I hate foul hooking fish and two flies result in too much of that... especially when they are so close...i wouldn't smoke two quality cigars at a time or drink two glasses of wine.....
    Like I said I have seen it over and over fishing side by side with a "two fly guy" and I have not seen any net advantage...I have actually seen the opposite.......

    Regards....Paul
  6. Caveman Member

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    You don't use two hooks to catch two different fish. You use two different hooks to see what they are keying in on.

  7. Nick Clayton Active Member

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    Two glasses of crown royal is always better that one!

    This is a fantastic thread. I'm gonna experiment with furled leaders. Never tried them but I have heard great things. I don't use split shot. I often use a barrel swivel for a little weight and the ability to quickly change
    tippets. Then most of my patterns are weighted a bit. Often. I will fish a weighted micro leech with a mid dropped behind it. The leech gets the fly down quick and I believe acts as an attractor. When out in the boat I don't mind waiting an extra little bit for the flies to get down.
  8. pond monkey Guest

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    Hi Caveman,
    I mentioned that because Blue said that she enjoys catching two at a time...... Like I said i have fished hundreds of hours side by side anchored up in my boat with a two fly guy and most of the time if not all of the time I do better.... with a single fly...... and never foul hook fish.
    Fishing out of a boat with a fish finder and always knowing the depth is a huge help especially in deeper zone.......if you are not getting bit within ten minutes then raise your fly or move....
    PS.... btw....you pump fish to see what they are eating....

    Regards.....Paul
  9. Blue Active Member

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    Whatever trips your trigger and hook choice also equals fouls. I hate that as well, so ....I don't do it :)
    I prefer a bicycle over a Uni cycle, what can I say, but don't smoke and don't drink wine so can't answer that, plus not sure what that means.
    Most people that fish next to me end up rigging like I do......he, he, he

    I did want to add as far as the dropper beads however, they are easy to adjust different depths. Just slide up or down.
  10. Nick Clayton Active Member

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    I have always wondered this and received several different answers when I asked.....

    If I'm out on a lake and come across a ton of schucks in the water does this mean the mids are currently hatching, or is it more likely this is a sign of a previous hatch?
  11. pond monkey Guest

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    Nick,
    IMHO.... Those rafts of floating exoskeletons are not even necessarily from a chironomids hatching for starters.....could be Caddis... like the ocetis....they hatch at dawn or even pre dawn or maybe callibaetis .... some chironomids hatch at dusk or later...I suppose they could stay afloat for up to to 24 hours... and a little wind would sweep them into rafts...
    When a hatch is actually in progress you will see emerging pupae and adults flying off just like a mayfly hatch... so IMHO those floating exoskeletons are from a previous hatch.....
    One thing to consider is where are you seeing these husks? .... peppered out in open water spread out somewhat ( recent hatch) or all concentrated and up against shore. (older hatch...maybe a day or more )


    Paul
  12. Nick Clayton Active Member

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    Interesting. Thanks for the detailed response. I will have to be a little more observant next time I'm out and see if I can notice a little bit more
  13. Caveman Member

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    What kind of epoxy are you using on the Chironomids?

  14. Blue Active Member

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    Just Sally Hansens. Any body here using Hydro?
  15. Mark Mercer Member

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    port orchard, wa
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    I used to use Sally Hansens, Just cause I had it around for steelhead and atlantic salmon fly heads, but the the last few years I've been using more
    Loon's Hard Head clear for pupa bodies and have had good luck with it, I think it might hold up a little better, and can be thinned with water, but not
    sure if it really makes that much difference.

    Blue, your pupa's are really nice ties, thanks for sharing them. On smaller flies (20, 18, 16) I keep it real simple, bead and tapered body and thats all,
    seldom even a rib, it doesn't seem to help to add anymore. When I'm lucky enough to get to use anything larger I'll put ribs and gills on them, but still
    not sure if they are that much more affective, at least where I fish. Love watching that indicator disappear....
  16. pond monkey Guest

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    Sally's is good stuff and it is best/ easiest to use without before it gets too thick. When it gets too thick it does not flow on evenly and dries too slow ( three coats or more) ..... by the time a bottle is half empty it is getting too thick. I still keep it around though and use it coat my "quick release indicators".... two coats toughens them up a little but also makes 'em shinny so they reflect more light and show up better... on those cloudy, choppy days.... also can be used to coat and smooth over nail knot connections... also it helps to take the original brush and trim it down with to make it thinner and bring it to a point...

    I like your buzzers Blue....I have been tying them for eight or nine years.... don't know if you weight yours but you can get the thin lead shields from your dentist they are 1.25" X 1.5' and .003 " thick.... cut 1/8 strips then lay and secure with thread on top of hook in thorax area..... then add a second.... then a third.... each a little shorter( to taper) next the other then cover with thread, and add cheeks (wing buds) if desired...

    PM
  17. Blue Active Member

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    I basically use ribbing to bullet proof the flies from tiny teeth, plus an easy extra weight. Can't imagine a Zebra Midge without it's rib...LOL
    I have a bottle of Hard Head that was given to me at a fly tying show, I guess I need to try it. But, some epoxy turn yellow, do you know if this does?

    Pond, I do use weight wire in the thorax area. I build them like Davie McPhail. I also have Biot in every color imaginable for the gills.
  18. pond monkey Guest

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    Blue...I don't see anatomically correct gills on your buzzers.... actual gills are white little filaments almost always on the abdomen end .... some species have gills on both ends..... looks like the biots that you refer to are being used for what the Brits call cheeks but they actually represent pre emergent wings or wing pads....

    Respectfully....Pond Monkey

    ps don't know if epoxy turns yellow..... Sally's is so easy to use... plus it's tough and clear....and cheap....
  19. Blue Active Member

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  20. pond monkey Guest

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    Electric blue, wow!.... that's the British for you....It goes to show you that trout primarily feed opportunistically I guess ... of course in England there are more than one thousand pay to play venues....mostly small ponds....and most raise their own fish to maturity in their own "stew ponds." .... very different than the US and Canada.... These small stillwaters in the UK are common and not expensive though and are the main opportunity for the average citizen to cast a fly.... there are a few public reservoirs with good fishing but ya need a boat and the chalkstreams are all controlled by private clubs.