confused

Discussion in 'Spey Clave' started by Leroy Laviolet, Jul 3, 2011.

  1. Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    do'n it 4 the chinookie
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    Salmo, just between us, I'm still a wee bit confused... :) Though the simple truth too me is that they are all basically shooting heads....:ray1:
  2. Nick Clayton Active Member

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    I can Google with the best of them too, however I believe this horse is quite dead.
  3. fisshman26 Member

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    Trail, B.C., Canada.
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    I actually went old school and looked it up in one of my books!
  4. Wadecalvin Member

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    Redmond Oregon
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    I just googled Bruce Kruk
  5. Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    do'n it 4 the chinookie
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    :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
  6. Nick Clayton Active Member

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    You looked it up in a what? A b-o-o-k? Is that one of them old hand held things whats got all them internet pages printed out and attached to it?
  7. fisshman26 Member

    Posts: 355
    Trail, B.C., Canada.
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    Nick, that is some funny shit man!
  8. Red Shed "junkyard spey"

    Posts: 517
    Peck, ID
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    To me a head, is a head, is ahead. It doesn't matter if it is 20' long or 100' long. I also don't believe it matters what cast is used to make it sail out there.

    I've always heard that various members of the Golden Gate club were the first to use heads in competition after some of the members devised the method.

    I'm not old enough to go back that far but Leland may be.:)
  9. Red Shed "junkyard spey"

    Posts: 517
    Peck, ID
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    On page 20 of his book "Steelhead Fly Fishing" Trey Combs credits Myron Gregory with introducing the shooting head. He doesn't say Mr. Gregory invented the shooting head however.
  10. Nooksack Mac Active Member

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    Bellingham, WA, USA.
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    A. J. McClane frequently mentioned shooting heads when he was Fishing Editor of "Field & Stream." From the Rainbow Trout entry in "McClane's Standard Fishing Encyclopedia" (1965): "In 1949, the shooting head was introduced on the Eel and Klamath rivers. A development of the Golden Gate Casting Club, it led the way to new distance records in tournament competition. A shooting head is a short, 28-32 foot-long, single-tapered line of suitable weight for your rod. A loop is spliced at both ends, one for the leader and the other for the monofilament line. Ordinarily, a .021-inch monofilament is used, and this is attached to the loop with a Five Turn Jam Knot. Some anglers attach the head directly to the monofilament with a Nail Knot and dispense with the loop. About 75 feet of monofilament is sufficient unless you are an above average caster... These heads are usually custom made and may be obtained from at least four West Coast shops which specialize in steelhead tackle... The virtue of a shooting head is that distance with less effort is easily accomplished. A single false cast is all that is necessary to shoot the fly to fishable distances. A regular forward-taper line will handle much more satisfactorily in strong winds and is preferable under this condition. Also, beginners who are not skilled at casting will find a forward-taper line easier to use. It is essential to master the double haul." He goes on to cover line handling and making one's own heads.
  11. SpeySpaz still an authority on nothing

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    Roy, WA
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  12. shotgunner Anywhere ~ Anytime

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    45th Parallel NW Michigan
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    Sorry SS, not yet :)

    Context confused here, question was posted in the Speyclave forum?

    Bruce, could you please comment on what year and originally were these primarily spey or overhead cast? Appreciate it.

    I don't think we dreamed up the title 'Skandi' but that it was a no brainer for Euro style casting and gear. Goran Andersson must have started in the early 50's?

    Coincidentally I was just reading an old two part article by Dan Blanton when this thread kicked off.. it's all interesting [to me anyway]

    [IMG]
  13. James Waggoner Active Member

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    wa
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    I agree Brian, this horse is far from dead. Besides, I like these treads they are far more interesting than the "which rod should I buy" or the "look at my new reel" threads. What a great opportunity to learn a little history and evolution of our beloved sport, after all if it wasn't for the "Tradition" it would just be fishing.

    Thanks for the clip from Dan Blanton, only wish I coud read the whole thing.
  14. shotgunner Anywhere ~ Anytime

    Posts: 476
    45th Parallel NW Michigan
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    Thanks James, I agree. If I was skilled enough betting I could scan the script and assemble a file then email. I'll try and figure something out..

    Leroy, not faulting you for posing the question here in the Spey Clave, just expected 'Spey' orientated replies.. No worries though, all good stuff :)
  15. Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    Seems to me, the term " Shooting head" was used 30 years ago for us single hand steelheaders , much differently than the answer now is to what we are now doing with two handed rods. The definition of any head with a loop on the end seems awfully broad ... Doesn't answer the confusion for me, but I'm used to being confused , that's why i posed the question -
    I'm not sure why you didn't expect to see it here in the speyclave forum , that's where the term is common also( I probably am missing your point) ... Great read by Dan Blanton Gunner, thanx for posting-
  16. James Waggoner Active Member

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    wa
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    Leroy, I think your question is very valid and quite pertinent to the Spey Forum. Like I said before...if you buy Brand X spey rod specifically designed for Shooting Heads, and not heed the designers idea of what a shooting head should be, you could be in for a world of disappointment. If you just went by the broad definition you may surmise "any line" looped to the running line should be okay...as if loops define a line anyway. Loops are just a way of connecting; either integrated or looped it's still a line system.

    When it comes to defining a shooting head, I'll go out on a limb to say this:

    A shooting head is any taper or belly designed to deliver the running line at ratio of three times or more running line to head length.

    Just because a Grand Spey is looped to a running line doesn't make it a shooting head, by any means...it just makes it convenient to change lines.

    Am I out of line or does this definition capture the principle intent of it's many originators.
  17. fisshman26 Member

    Posts: 355
    Trail, B.C., Canada.
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    Actually a grand spey `head` looped to running line would be a shooting head.
    As for Jimmy Greens contribution of shooting heads for double hand use I would say it was in the mid to late 70`s at least thats what I found in one of my books ;-D
  18. Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    I got bad news for ya James, in my world, that makes a lot of sense, so if you are on the same page with ole Leroy, you got issues man ... :)
    Thanks for the ideas, realy does clarify somewhat ,to me anyways -
    Now if we could just get some more completely differing opinions ....:rofl:
  19. James Waggoner Active Member

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    wa
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    Great! Now I'm confused...thanks, I think?
  20. James Waggoner Active Member

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    wa
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    So shooting heads where created to be "all about the loop to loop" to running line? Why didn't they just call them changable heads, transient heads or changelings? Something more appropriate to the system....shooting implies something completely different then just a connection. Know if you say "No, shooting heads are designed to go the distance" I'd say: "HOW?" is it the fact it has loops? So if I get an intergrated line cut the running line loose and then reconnect with loops....BAM! Shooting Head...and forty extra feet of casting distance.

    Aside from what has been said, has anyone done a search about shooting heads on this forum or speypages? And if so what lines and lenghts are most talked about?