e-Bay to ban any gun part sales.

Discussion in 'Cast & Blast' started by Roper, Aug 3, 2007.

  1. Jon Borcherding

    Jon Borcherding New Member

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    Jason, in my opinion these are the quotes that typify your responses. These are your words. You can put them in whatever context you like but they still carry a strong message of condescension, marginalization and malignment.
    Jason, in the past week or two you've jumped into at least two threads concerning firearms to tell people that there is no boogeyman. We know that there is no boogeyman but, there is a very real effort to disarm civilians in this country. I still have a hard time seeing which side if this issue you're on.
    Perhaps that is because you still refuse to answer my direct and simple question which I pose again:
    do you believe that the continued rash of gun industry lawsuits is meant to damage the firearms industry?
    I would like to add another or maybe 2 more questions:
    1. Are you an NRA member?
    2. Do you agree with the NRA stance on anti-gun litigation?
    Perhaps you view these questions as an attempt to "put you in a box". I would just like to know where you stand on the issues since you seem to have such strong opinions about firearms.

    JonB
     
  2. Jason Baker

    Jason Baker Member

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    Jon:

    I'll answer your question. NO, I do not believe the torts against firearm companies (in 99% of the cases) are designed to "disarm civilians". I believe they are in great numbers because they are easy targets. So are drug companies and medical providers (to the tune of $260,000,000,000 in 2004), so are retailers and restauranteurs for slip and fall torts (hundreds of multi-million dollar suits in 2006), and so are vehicle manufactures (one case awarded $6,000,000 form Ford for a vehicle roll-over). I guess we'd have to say that there's a "continued rash of _______ industry lawsuits meant to damage the ________ industry" as well?

    No, I'm not an NRA member? Do I agree with their politics, NO! Any organization that creates "black lists" like this one: http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?ID=15
    and make statements like these would get my support:

    Jeff Cooper
    NRA Board of Directors


    On Inner-City Violence:
    "…the consensus is that no more than five to ten people in a hundred who die by gunfire in Los Angeles are any loss to society. These people fight small wars amongst themselves. It would seem a valid social service to keep them well-supplied with ammunition."
    Cooper's Corner, Guns and Ammo

    On the value of diversity:
    "The goal of good government is the optimum balance of liberty and order. Social diversity does not pull in that direction. Liberty is what we seek over the centuries, but if we grant it to too diverse a population, order disappears. Regarding the United States… it would seem that we ought to choose assimilation over diversity. It seems to me that diversity, rather than being a goal to be sought, should be an obstacle to be circumvented." Jeff Cooper's Commentaries (self-published newsletter)

    On Federal Law Enforcement Officials:
    "Already a couple of the faithful have sent in checks for a foundation memorial to the innocents who perished at the hands of the ninja at Waco. ... I have been criticized by referring to our federal masked men as "ninja" … [L]et us reflect upon the fact that a man who covers his face shows reason to be ashamed of what he is doing. A man who takes it upon himself to shed blood while concealing his identity is a revolting perversion of the warrior ethic. It has long been my conviction that a masked man with a gun is a target. I see no reason to change that view."
    Cooper�s Commentaries (self-published newsletter)


    On Crime:
    "It is certainly difficult to render a calm and compassionate view of our
    current system of justice. After a legal friend of ours had his car trashed on the street, apparently just for kicks, he suggested that the proper solution to our inner city problem might be the mass drowning of street punks. Every month in a different big city we should sew up a thousand of them in a huge sack and dump it into the Mississippi. Such ideas may appear fanciful, but the decent people of this country are increasingly driven against the wall. ... While the federal ninja drive around in their black uniforms and face masks, we note that they never seem to bother the street gangs."
    Cooper's Commentaries (self-published newsletter)

    BIO
    Nominated for re-election by Nominating Committee. Author, lecturer, trainer. consultant. small-arms designer. Born Los Angeles. 1920. B.A. Political Science. Stanford. M.A. History, U.C.R. Retired Lieutenant Colonel of Marines. Founder, Southwest Pistol League: Founder and President, Gunsite Raven Corporation; Founder and Director. American Pistol Institute in Arizona. Founder, President, and Lifetime Honorary Chairman, International Practical Shooting Confederation. Member of NRA Board of Directors since 1985. Elected to NRA Executive Council in 2002. Lifetime big game hunter on five continents. Co-designer of the modern technique of the pistol. Originator of the modern Scout Rifle concept. Awarded Outstanding American Handgunner, 1995; Soldier of Fortune's Shootist of the Century, 2000: St. Gabriel Possenti Society medal, 2001. Editor-at-Large and columnist, Guns & Ammo magazine. Author: Fireworks, To Ride, Shoot Straight and Speak the Truth. Another Country, Principles of Personal Defense, Gargantuan Gunsite Gossip I & II, The Art of the Rifle and Jeff Cooper's Commentaries.

    Mr. Cooper was re-elected to the NRA Board of Directors in 2003 for a 3 year term

    or this one:

    Ted Nugent
    NRA Board of Directors

    On South Africans:
    "Apartheid isn't that cut and dry. All men are not created equal. The
    preponderance of South Africa is a different breed of man. I mean that with
    no disrespect. I say that with great respect. I love them because I'm one of
    them. They are still people of the earth, but they are different. They still
    put bones in their noses, they still walk around naked, they wipe their
    butts with their hands � These are different people. You give 'em
    toothpaste, they fucking eat it ... I hope they don't become civilized.
    They're way ahead of the game."
    --Detroit Free Press Magazine

    On Racism:
    "I'm a fun guy, not a sexist or a racist�. I use the word ****** a lot
    because I hang around with a lot of ******s �."
    --Detroit Free Press Magazine

    On Hillary Clinton:
    A "Toxic **** � This bitch is nothing but a two-bit whore for Fidel Castro."
    --Westworld Newspaper

    On Dating:
    " I met a couple guys in line yesterday who go, 'Write something to my
    girlfriend, she won't let me go hunting.' I wrote her something and I said,
    'Drop dead, bitch.' What good is she, trade her in, get a Dalmatian. Who
    needs the wench?"
    --WRIF FM Radio, Detroit, Michigan

    On the Confederate Flag:
    " Those politically correct motherfuckers can take the flag down but I am
    going to wear it forever."
    --The Fort Worth Star-Telegram

    On homosexuality:
    A "despicable act" performed by "guys that have sex with each other's anal
    cavities."
    --Hannity and Colmes



    BIO
    Ted Nugent began hunting in 1953, and playing guitar in 1956. To date, he has released 29 recordings, and sold over 30 million albums. Renowned as one of the world's leading guitar showmen, he's equally well known as one of the nation's preeminent media personalities.

    Acclaimed for his bold, insightful commentary on issues ranging from gun control to biodiversity, Nugent is a regular guest on top-rated programs like Larry King, Howard Stern, Politically Incorrect and Rush Limbaugh.

    A recipient of numerous commendations from police agencies nationwide, Nugent has been lauded for his Ted Nugent Kamp for Kids and work as a national spokesman for D.A.R.E. He continues to fight for personal freedoms on the lecture circuit, and as Editor/Publisher of Adventure Outdoors magazine.

    Ted Nugent is an award-winning writer for over 20 publications, and author of New York Times best-seller God, Guns and Rock `n' Roll.

    Ted "the Nuge" Nugent was re-elected to the NRA Board of Directors in 2001 for a 3 year term.

    or this:

    Paul Blackman
    Head NRA Researcher

    On crime victims:
    " In fact, studies of homicide victims -- especially the increasing number of
    younger ones -- suggest they are frequently criminals themselves and/or drug addicts or users. It is quite possible that their deaths, in terms of
    economic consequences to society, are net gains."
    "The Federal Factoid Factory on Firearms and Violence: A Review of CDC
    Research and Policies."

    On Inner-City Redevelopment:
    " [T]he NRA is composed primarily of non-big-city middle-class white males... They cannot be counted on any more than any other non-big-city middle-class whites to actively lobby to rebuild the inner cities. Further, even if the NRA attempted fully to address the problems of the inner city, it would no more be welcomed unhesitatingly and unsuspiciously than would any other proposed interference by people who do not look as if they belong in the inner city�."
    "Children and Guns"

    or this:

    Leroy Pyle
    Former NRA Board Member

    On Sarah Brady, wife of Jim Brady, paralyzed due to injuries he received during the assassination attempt on Ronald Reagan:
    "That ugly cackler. She pulls her husband around like a pulltoy on a string. My friends and I say that if that ever happened to one of us and our wife did that, somebody would slip into the house one night and slit her throat."
    --Quoted in "Under Fire: The NRA and the Battle for Gun Control"

    or possibly this one:

    Marion Hammer
    Former President & Current Board Member of the NRA

    On police-maintained databases of gun buyers:
    "We don't want government to know who has the guns. If the government knows
    who has guns and where to find them, they can ban them and then confiscate
    them."
    --Miami Herald

    On privacy rights of gun owners:
    "Owning a gun is not a crime. Pawning a gun is not a crime. The Constitution is not for the convenience of law enforcement. It's about protecting the rights of private people�. This is not about law enforcement. This is about profiling innocent citizens."
    --Miami Herald

    a little more humor for ya:

    Rep. Barbara Cubin (R-WY)
    NRA Board of Directors

    On an amendment to a gun control bill that would have banned gun sales to drug addicts or people in drug treatment:

    "My sons are 25 and 30. They are blond-haired and blue-eyed. One amendment today said we could not sell guns to anybody under drug treatment. So, does that mean if you go into a black community, you cannot sell a gun to any black person, or does that mean because my..."
    [NOTE: her comments were interrupted at that point by Melvin Watt (D-N.C.)
    who demanded that her words be stricken from the record as inappropriate.] --Washington Post

    "You might think that Mrs. Cubin then would have realized she had equated
    African Americans with drug addicts and apologized as profusely as
    possible."
    --From Washington Post editorial about Cubin's remarks

    BIO
    U.S. Representative Barbara Cubin is a lifelong advocate for the right to keep and bear arms. Currently serving as Wyoming's Congresswoman, she was first elected to the U.S. House in 1994. She serves on the House Resources and Energy and Commerce Committees. She is the House Republican Conference Secretary, a peer-elected position in the House Leadership. Representative Cubin was the first member of Congress to join People for the U.S.A., a group dedicated to private property rights and defending the Second Amendment. As a member of the Wyoming State Legislature from 1987 to 1994 she voted in favor of Wyoming's conceal carry which became law in 1994. She is also a member of the Airborne Law Enforcement Association. Cubin is married to Dr. Fritz Cubin, and they have two sons. The Cubins are active in hunting and shooting sports and are Life members of the NRA.

    Rep. Cubin was re-elected to the NRA Board of Directors in 2003 for a 3 year term.

    Woo Nelly, even more:

    Charlton Heston
    Former NRA President

    "Mainstream America is counting on you to draw your sword and fight for them. These people have precious little time and resources to battle misguided Cinderella attitudes, the fringe propaganda of the homosexual coalition, the feminists who preach that it is a divine duty for women to hate men, blacks who raise a militant fist with one hand while they seek preference with the other �"

    "I remember when European Jews feared to admit their faith. The Nazis forced them to wear yellow stars as identity badges. It worked. So what color star will they pin on gun owners chests? How will the self-styled elite tag us? There may not be a Gestapo officer on every street corner, but the influence on our culture is just as pervasive."

    "On the other hand, I find my blood pressure rising when Clinton's cultural shock troops participate in gay-rights fundraisers but boycott gun-rights fundraisers and then claim it's time to place homosexual men in tents with Boy Scouts, and suggest that sperm donor babies born into lesbian relationships are somehow better served and more loved." --Speech to Free Congress Foundation


    " I was astounded to read these courageous remarks by Charlton Heston. I am thankful to hear a man with such high esteem say essentially the same things for which I have been reviled by the liberal media. His words should be reproduced and put into the hands of every American."
    --DAVID DUKE's response to Heston's speech

    Had enough? One more....


    Wayne LaPierre
    CEO & Executive Vice President
    NRA Board of Directors

    On Gun Control Advocates:
    " What fakes, frauds and liars! ... [A] shadowy network of extremist social guerillas fueled by anonymous wealth, sophisticated research, free media access and high-dollar consultants. You know, terrorism against freedom isn't just practiced with bombs and box cutters. Anti-freeedom elitists in academia, the media, rich foundations and government can do permanent damage to individual freedoms just as real as an insurrection or coup. Together they form a sort of Taliban, an intolerant coalition of fanatics that shelter the anti-freedom alliance so it can thrive and grow."
    2002 NRA Annual Meeting Speech

    On Celebrities included in the NRA's List of National Organizations with Anti-Gun Policies:
    "Our members don't want to buy their songs, don't want to go to their movies, don't want to support their careers." --NBC's Today Show

    On people who support gun control
    " If you consider the Constitution less relevant, if you ignore or distort the Second Amendment, if you conspire to make lawful firearms less accessible to lawful citizens, if you infiltrate school boards and churches and legislatures and foundations to advance an anti-freedom agenda of any kind -- the fact that you were born on American soil won't mask the fact that you're an enemy of freedom and a political terrorist."
    2002 NRA Annual Meeting Speech

    BIO
    Wayne LaPierre is the Executive Vice President and Chief Executive Officer of the National Rifle Association of America. In his leadership position, Mr. LaPierre conducts the affairs of an over 3.5 million member association through a staff of over 550 employees with an annual budget of over $120 million.

    Under the direction of a 76 member board of directors, he is responsible for implementing NRA policy as well as serving as president of the National Firearms Museum Fund and trustee of the NRA Foundation. An avid sport shooter, he holds an executive position with the North American Wetlands Conservation Council, the world's largest wildlife program, and officiates each year at NRA events nationwide.

    Mr. LaPierre joined the staff in 1978, as a state liaison in the NRA Institute for Legislative Action, the lobbying arm of the Association. Initially responsible for a 10-state region, he was promoted twice in two years and named the Director of State & Local Affairs in 1979. The next year he accepted a position as the Director of Federal Affairs, where he was responsible for the planning and execution of all NRA initiatives before Congress and the executive branch.

    In 1986, Mr. LaPierre was again promoted to Executive Director of NRA-ILA. It was in this position that he took to the forefront as the leader and spokesperson for all NRA legislative activities at every level of government.

    Wayne LaPierre serves on the board of directors of the American Association of Political Consultants. He holds a master's degree in American government and politics from Boston College and a bachelor's degree in education and political science from Siena College in New York.

    After accepting his current position in 1991, Mr. LaPierre became the chief national spokesperson for the National Rifle Association which, under his leadership, has achieved the most dramatic growth in membership since NRA was founded in 1871.



    So it's fair to say that , No, I don't support anything to do with the NRA.....
     
  3. Roper

    Roper Idiot Savant

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    Jason, I'd appreciate it if you'd start your own soap box and quit using mine.
     
  4. Jason Baker

    Jason Baker Member

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    Any comments on the NRA leader's comments? I'm just waiting for a reply/justification.

    If we are going to solicit support for an organization on the site, it would be fair to allow folks to see what it's leaders viewpoints are, right?

    I've met you Roper. In the few hours we spent together, I'm sure you are a better man than to be aligned with the comments from the NRA representatives. Unfortunately, like Mom and dad said, "Choose your friends wisely, you'll be judged by the company you keep."

    It's folks like these that mobilize the left. They provide all the ammo one needs to discredit what otherwise would seem a just cause.

    I'll quit, it is your thread, but I'd love to hear your viewpoints on the comments I posted....
     
  5. Jon Borcherding

    Jon Borcherding New Member

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    Fair enough Jason. I get your message loud and clear. So tell me this; As a person who claims to be a gun owner and a supporter of the right to keep and bear arms. (you did claim that you support the 2nd didn't you?) which of the many gun lobbies DO you support? In other words, is there a single organization lobbying to preserve your right to keep and bear arms that you are willing to support?
    Once again Jason, not trying to "put you in a box" here, simply trying to ascertain what your viewpoint really is???

    JonB
     
  6. Roper

    Roper Idiot Savant

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    Jason, I won't reply on the comments, it's too biased and narrow focused. All I'll say is that I agree with some of the comments, but not all, or the way they were presented. I'm sure folks on "the other side of the coin" have said some off color things also.

    But that has nothing to do with the e-bay issue and providing an avenue for social comment, even if it is a private company. That was my intent.

    This is the problem with forum debates, they go off on tangents and the original issue gets pushed aside. That's why I asked not to get into a pissing match about anything. (I have to laugh at myself, I seem to have "marked" this thread as mine, talk about pissing on something...:rofl: )

    Maybe we can debate this on another format/arena/tavern floor/river bank/lake some day...:thumb:
     
  7. Jason Baker

    Jason Baker Member

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    I'd love to Roper!
     
  8. Jon Borcherding

    Jon Borcherding New Member

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    I don't see it as my responsibility to justify the comments of others. The internet is full of quotes that can be easily copy & pasted to support almost any agenda. We could burn up a whole lotta bandwidth copy&pasting nonsense back and forth ad nauseum. There are certainly enough quotes from our elected officials in both houses of congress and on both sides of the aisle that need defending but that's never gonna be my job. Furthermore, I haven't renounced my U.S. citizenship simply because we have some stupid leaders so why would I refuse to support an organization that fights for the 2nd ammendment simply because their leadership has some stupid (alleged) quotes floating around on the internet?
    Oh, and by the way, I would go duck hunting with Ted Nugent in a heartbeat.:cool:

    JonB
     
  9. Jason Baker

    Jason Baker Member

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    You guys could just live it up! Flying the Conferderate flag on the duck boat, dropping the N word, laughing about your wenches, talking about those bone in the nose SOBs, and wrapping it up with a few good queer jokes. What a day! What a great day!

    Jonnie, I'm done with you. You make it too easy. Do you live in my neck of the woods? If not, you'd feel right at home.....
     
  10. gearhead

    gearhead Active Member

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    REGARDING EBAY, MY OPINION IS: SO! IT'S THEIR OWN BUSINESS THEY CAN DO WHAT THEY WANT. I'M A FRIGGIN GUN NUT, AND HAVE PLENTY OF RESOURCES. YA WANT TO BUY A GUN OR PARTS OVER THE INTERNET, GO TO THE MANY DOZENS OF SITES DEDICATED TO SELLING THEM. I SEE NO RIGHTS VIOLATION HERE.
    AND JASON, MAN YOU ARE ONE WHACKY TACKY. SORRY FOR THE CASE, NO DO-OVERS HERE.
     
  11. mozart

    mozart Chris

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    I'm mixed on this. For one, you have people that are using firearms for hunting. Second you have people using firearms for collecting, and third, you have people using firearms for wrong doings. eBay is simpling cutting it all out in the prevention of the wrong doers obtaining firearms for their own wrong ways or using them. Plain and simple. eBay is way too easy for anyone to purchase firearm type goods very easily. This just makes it harder for those types to obtain them. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with it and I agree with eBay for banning this type of usage.

    Now, I do feel for the types that are buying for legal hunting and collecting. This reduces a market that reduces the costs of retail considerably. Unfortunately, all it take is a few people to ruin it for everyone. We all know this in all types of society.
     
  12. Jon Borcherding

    Jon Borcherding New Member

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    :rofl:

    No you're not!
    I can jerk your little chain just about any time I want, and you'll (over) react in a manner which is easily predicted by anyone who's ever bothered to read the negative drivel that you regurgitate with boring regularity.

    JonB
     
  13. Jason Baker

    Jason Baker Member

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    XOXOXO
     
  14. Islander

    Islander Steve

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    About the only thing I ever bought on EBay was gun related and a few fishing items, so I guess they will lose my small amount of dollars. As for the rest of this thread I'll just say: I'd like to go hunting or fishing with Roper anytime (met him once on Lone Lake) and I'm glad Jason doesn't live in WA.
     
  15. Be Jofus G

    Be Jofus G Banned or Parked

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    :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
     

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