Flyfish steelhead (DD) a sponser now?

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by BDD, Dec 29, 2007.

  1. Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

    Posts: 2,575
    Quesnel, BC
    Ratings: +323 / 0
    I am not trying to hang my fate on the law. I just think it is a very poorly written law.

    I also bet you never again see what you are talking about too.
  2. Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

    Posts: 2,575
    Quesnel, BC
    Ratings: +323 / 0
    Chad,

    I caught a silver this year on something around a size 10 oct caddis pattern in the top foot of the water column while SRC fishing. It happens.

    Can you honestly tell me that the method and flies you use for SRC are similar to what you use for steelhead and salmon or are they vastly different? I know when you called me up to ask questions specific to that trip as to where you should be fishing on the Stilly, and what flies you should use, that none of the small fly patterns I recommended would draw the attention of a chum because you were after SRC. Wasnt that trip also early November or late October too before the river had even come up much?

    Also I see you using large weighted purple streamers now for steelhead. Don't you think that would have changed not only which area of the water column you were fishing but also the type of fish that would be interested in the fly? If you were targetting steelhead at that time I believe your experience would have been very different.

    I dont think, if you are in any way making a comparison, that you are comparing apples to apples.
  3. David Dalan 69°19'15.35" N 18°44'22.74" E

    Posts: 1,998
    Walla Walla, WA
    Ratings: +782 / 0
    Jeremy,

    Got your PM and replied. It's all good :)
  4. stan Banned or Parked

    Posts: 106
    yreka ca
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    It is NOW, was it 20 years ago?!??!? People are going to insinuate he was acting illegally when he might not of been.

    PS: The people who have just joined to praise DD, if the were DD or Jeremy, Chris would boot them, delete the post, and boot DD as a sponsor. That is just the ethical kind of guy Chris Scones is.
  5. stan Banned or Parked

    Posts: 106
    yreka ca
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    Winston rep should be happy

    Guess now you will have to call up the Winston rep to get one of those magical piece of paper that get you a rod at %50 off. Boy the rep will be happy to hear from you!!! :rofl:
  6. Smalma Active Member

    Posts: 2,841
    Marysville, Washington
    Ratings: +719 / 0
    Stan -
    There have not been any salmon seasons on the North Fork of the Stillaguamish for at least 30 years (probably much longer).

    Tight lines
    Curt
  7. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    I know from personal experience as a client that this was happening around 1999-2000.
  8. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    If I was fishing over a pool loaded with chums splashing about, I surely wouldn't tie on a weighted purple fly, catch several in a row, and then try to say I was just steelhead fishing...

    If it got to the point I couldn't even work the non standard chum water while looking for steelhead and hook them anyway, I'd get tired of breaking them off and probably switch to fishing for cutties or just quit and enjoy the rest of the float.


    I'm done with this post. Feel free to PM me if anyone wants to discuss further. After all the squeaky clean praises, I just wanted to pipe in with some first hand experience and say the problems some folks have ARE legit. I also respect Dennis for moving on from such practices. We all make mistakes...
  9. chadk Be the guide...

    Posts: 5,057
    Snohomish, WA.
    Ratings: +41 / 0
    oh, and just to clarify - I simply pm'd you to ask you about put in and take out spots on the stilly - I already had my cuttie flies all tied up and ready to go :ray1:
  10. Jamie Wilson Active Member

    Posts: 978
    Arlington WA
    Ratings: +99 / 0
    Well said - speaking about moving on - count me in.
    Done wit this-
    Magill
  11. Coach Duff Banned or Parked

    Posts: 1,272
    Kailua Hawaii
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    Dennis is obviously an outstanding fisherman and a top notch guide. He is also a chest thumper and self promoter. I don't say that in a bad way, he's built a small empire working the internet. Some of his claims on fly patterns and colors are questionable to me. The olive beadhead damsel is an exact copy of William Survey's legendary "Olive Willie" beadhead designed 39 years ago. William named it after his son Willie who died falling off of a cliff while hiking with with his father. Every lake fishermen in Washington has tied on an Olive Willie or the beadheaded version over the last three decades. Many of us have had the honor of fishing a few William tied just for us. I e-mailed Dennis when I first saw it on his site a couple years ago and respectfully asked him to call it the Northwest name. He included my letter on my website which was first class in every respect but could not bring himself to give final and ever-lasting credit to the local boy. He makes claims of being the first to fish this fly, this color, this line. His claims about pioneering the Hoodsport Fishery could be considered controversial. Hell, the Yancy system is a glorifed version of the Amnesia and shooting head system the Golden Gate Casting Club was tossing back the late 40s and early 50s. Lastly he loves to tell us he is a fisheries biologist. Well, frankly, most of us know there are talented fish-first people in that fraternity, but he was also on duty when things really went to shit. What did he do? He started taking out as many people as he could in one man pontoons as many days as he could flossing the shit out anything in the river, regs or not. There is even a legend about him being ticketed on the North Fork as a biologist years ago for fishing a sand shrimp on a fly line. There is another one of him fishing illegally and saying it was for scientific reasons. Now are these my beliefs? The part about the Olive Willie is, the rest are things that are muttered often in flyshops, by buddies, but North Fork residents. The Neah Bay guiding with no Captain's Liscense is another. He was anti Spey Rod for years, but now says he never said that. I don't even know him so I am not in a place to say or confirm any of this except my "Olive Willie" event. I am playing Devil's Advocate and throwing out common things I hear time and time again by our own, who seem to have disappeared when this thread was posted. In fact with all of the things I have heard about Dennis, I am dissapointed nobody has the balls to throw it out there. I like his fishing reports and have read them for years. I do have one question: What is "swimming a fish"?:hmmm: Anybody who is successful will have detractors, especially in our business. It's interesting how you never hear people bad mouth Brazda, Kinney, or many others. Dennis bring controversy and that's that. He's a whole lot more interesting than alot of the stuffy types that frequent our world. I hope to run into him someday and shoot the shit with him. Maybe even crack a cold one if he has 10 minutes. I bet he's an interesting, knowledge filled and lively conversation and a good Northwesterner. :beer2: Tight Lines Coach
  12. FT Active Member

    Posts: 1,245
    Burlington, WA
    Ratings: +103 / 0
    There were also the advertised guided salmon trips on the Sauk (which hasn't had a salmon season for 20 years or so, and Skagit for areas on the Skagit that weren't open to salmon or for salmon species that did not have an open season when he advertised, booked, and took people on the trips, while making the claim that it wasn't his fault if the salmon just happened to grab a fly being fished for steelhead or dollies. Or having a group of his steelhead students go into a run on the NF Stilly and take it over for hours preventing others from fishing it (which I witnessed first hand).

    No Sir, he has done nothiing to warrent the ill feelings many have toward him.:rolleyes:
  13. Coach Duff Banned or Parked

    Posts: 1,272
    Kailua Hawaii
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    I said I have no first hand knowledge, only second hand. FT has seen otherwise. Like I said controversy follows him. Coach
  14. Denny Active Member

    Posts: 4,050
    Seattle, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +46 / 0
    I don't know the guy (Dennis) at all, but . . .

    FT, you've never heard of someone fishing for an open season species on certain water when they know full well they'll likely hook up with a species that was closed on that water? People talk about it (and profess to it) all the time in this forum. :confused:

    Also, I've been on the Stilly before where several buddies will hang out in a certain hole for hours, preventing anyone else (including me) from fishing the water. And, how do you know Dennis's students were there for hours? Does that imply that you were also fishing (hanging out) on some water nearby where you could witness this Stilly occupation? Heck, putting a positive spin on it, them hanging out at one hole means they stayed off of all those other holes on the river, and left them available for you! Many local (Puget Sound area) who conduct saltwater beach fishing classes wil conduct their on-water seminars at popular beaches, effectively taking over the beach for hours at a time. :confused:

    Again, I don't know the guy, but I don't see the controversy in these examples.
  15. Coach Duff Banned or Parked

    Posts: 1,272
    Kailua Hawaii
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    Controversy. Do we need to define it? Anytime Dennis' name comes up it stirs up all kinds of responses, many of them controversial just like the the difference in opinion on "posting up" on a hole. Personnally I like it when guides piss pound one small part of a river. I drift by them if the river is sled free and piss pound everything below them.;) Or I drive up above them and fish that water and then drive down below them and fish that water. That's what jet sleds are for. On the Skagit and Sauk, Dennis can throw in as many pontoons as he wants. I'll fish where he and the rest of the guiding fraternity aren't. There is always good water to be had, and if you can actually read it well, there is alot more than most people think. Or you can sit around waiting for your turn into Buck Island, or the Mixer or Two-Bit or any of the other "Disneyland Rides". We all know that.:beer2:
  16. Denny Active Member

    Posts: 4,050
    Seattle, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +46 / 0
    Winston rep should be happy

    WTF? What does that have to do with this thread? Dude, if you 're envious and want to get discount rods, get in the industry or become a guide. Whether he gets an industry deal or not, he still has to buy the rod. Sheesh.
  17. hendersonbaylocal Member

    Posts: 966
    Seattle WA
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    You don't see why there is controversy over a guide booking trips targeting a species with no open season?
  18. FT Active Member

    Posts: 1,245
    Burlington, WA
    Ratings: +103 / 0
    Richard,

    Just because people fish flies and line types that will most likely catch a species that has no open season while professing not being able to help it if one of the closed species "just happen to take my fly" doesn't make it right or OK to do. I'd bet if someone was using steelhead dries or wets on the Yakima in the fall and a gamie happened to come by, said angler would be ticketed for targeting a species with no open season despite any protestations he might make about "not being able to help it if a steelhead happened to take his fly".

    Also, You mean you see nothing wrong with a guide advertising and booking trips to target a species with no open season? I believe this fits the definition of poaching, even if no fish are kept.
  19. Denny Active Member

    Posts: 4,050
    Seattle, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +46 / 0
    Attaboy. If folks are pounding or spending inordinate amount of time on certain stretches of water, that means there is a whole lot of water that isn't being populated/fished at that moment. Like you, I see that as opportunity. :thumb:
  20. Denny Active Member

    Posts: 4,050
    Seattle, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +46 / 0
    Agreed.

    Do you fish the Stilly during the Fall when the salmon are in? If so, then you are one of those folks you note as "Just because people fish flies and line types that will most likely catch a species that has no open season while professing not being able to help it if one of the closed species "just happen to take my fly" doesn't make it right or OK to do." Regardless of intent, but do you ever fish water that has in it a species to which fishing is closed? I'm guessing highly likely.

    In the fall many of the salmon in the Stilly jump all over many different patterns. While fishing for summer steelies I've hooked up many different anadromous species, including coho, pinks, chums, searuns, steelhead, etc. Heck, a buddy of mine on that river landed a large bright adult chinook that inhaled his steelhead caddis dry.

    Fishing any water that is shared by both open and closed season species, there is a chance that the closed season species will take the fly.

    Does Dennis do some uncool things that are borderline? I don't know, and it appears that many of the folks here don't KNOW either. If he advertises fishing for a closed species, that's uncool. Generically fishing in the water that has closed species, it's allowed.

    We sometimes need to look in the mirror, and apply our morality brush equally to all, including ourselves.