Gloomis Warranty? The end of a free rod era?

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by JesseC, Oct 2, 2012.

  1. PT

    PT Physhicist

    Costco has changed their electronics warranty. And, Nordstrom will replace a 4 year old pair of shoes if the customer is a complete prick and expects new shoes because the sole is worn.
     
  2. Ed Call

    Ed Call Mumbling Moderator Staff Member

    Agreed, this really comes down to a choice to buy it or not. Maybe there are dozens to thousands of variables considered when you purchase a fly rod (or anything else). Decide to buy it or not based on those variables. I've never cast a GLoomis fly rod (or gear rod) that I was not very impressed with, same goes for my favorite rod company Sage, and a close second Orvis. I have had customer service interactions with Sage, Loomis, Orvis, Redington, TFO and Echo that all have been fantastic. This covers, rods, reels and soft goods over the past 10 years or so, I'll not shy away from continuing to get my fly fishing items from these companies. That is largely in part to their warranty and customer service.
     
    fifafu likes this.
  3. Kent Lufkin

    Kent Lufkin Remember when you could remember everything?

    Huh? Does the phrase 'Everyday Low Prices' ring a bell?

    Retailers like WalMart, JC Penney, K-Mart, and others spend millions on advertising every year promoting a business model that's based on the notion of getting something for nothing. As an indicator of just how ingrained that mantra has become, look at how JC Penney has been struggling with 2 consecutive quarters of double-digit sale declines after their new CEO (and former head of Apple's retail stores) decided to abolish the company's former 24x7 everything-on-sale-all-the-time marketing strategy last winter.

    Why do those companies continue to beat that drum despite the many commonsense reasons not to?

    It's a simple answer: Greed. Too many folks are hardwired or have been conditioned to expect something for nothing.

    K
     
    Steve Call likes this.
  4. Kent Lufkin

    Kent Lufkin Remember when you could remember everything?

    I have a friend and former employee who worked for Nordstrom during their legendary-customer-service heyday in the mid-1980s. She tells stories of women 'bringing back' dresses obviously made at home from a pattern but claiming they were bought at Nordstrom. Or people bringing back automobile jack stands that they received as Christmas gifts and claim were bought at Nordstrom. Apparently so many people were abusing their liberal return policy that Nordstrom has cut waaaay back on just what they'll accept as a legitimate return today.

    K
     
  5. Rob Allen

    Rob Allen Active Member

    The no fault warranty is the worst thing that ever happened to the fishing rod industry. First off manufacturing defects that make it out of the shop are rare. secondly it makes a rod have no value even though it cost a great deal to manufacturer market sell and to buy... people will not treat them as the fine tools they are if they can have it replaced at their whim for nothing..
     
  6. dflett68

    dflett68 Active Member

    nothing just "happens" in markets. manufacturers competed their way into the market that they have. some people are talking like consumers just aren't fair. consumers expect what's marketed to them, and what is marketed constantly is this basic message: "buy our product instead of our competitor's because we have added value that our competitor hasn't added, without adding cost to the consumer". translate: something for nothing. it's a mess undoubtedly, but seeing it developing didn't keep any of the manufacturers being discussed from jumping into the market and conforming to the competitive environment of the market, did it?
     
  7. dflett68

    dflett68 Active Member

    i don't think there's any comparison between the marketing and brand quality of those shitty faceless retailers and the ultra-premium rod manufacturers being discussed. and i can't imagine why anyone would think that a person who succeeded as a retailer for apple (brand statement: you are lucky to be in our store loser, we'll get to you when we don't have something better to do), could transfer that success to a decaying icon of mediocrity like jc penny (brand statement: we are desperate and lost, will you come to our store?).

    those companies continue to beat that drum because they have nothing else to offer. they have no differentiation or value proposition without it. and the greed is their own. they competed and marketed their way into a marketplace where people expect what the marketers have offered. consumers didn't wake up one day and start saying "hey, why do i have to pay a fair price for what i get at the store? why can't it be free? i want my rights and i've got a right to free stuff, damnit!"
     
  8. scottybs

    scottybs Active Member

    Alrighty, everyone is going to bicker about it, list some POSITIVE ways to change this. The no fault warranty is GREAT for the consumer and is a MARKETING TOOL for the manufacturer. Fly rods are EXPENSIVE rather fragile items, people make mistakes. Why not offer a reasonably priced alternative such as upping the service fee($100-$150)? Covers both parties, however, if they go down that road, I think that the top end rod market will have to come down in cost. I have a used Scott rod that I broke a section on and it is going to cost $150 to have it fixed, (reasonable) + they're going to build me an extra tip for $100! Great service, probably a little revenue for them. I've heard of guys asking GLOOMIS if they could "BUY" a spare tip, and were subsequently told "we don't do that!" That's a business decision they make that it contrary to other manufacturers.

    People abuse the shit out of things!!! Kent good luck and thanks to you for providing American products!!!

    Great service is well worth the $$$ paid for an item. Even if you purchase that item on clearance. Like I previously stated, in my arsenal I have Sage, Scott, Winston, Redington and TFO's. I USED to fish Loop sticks and they were GREAT rods, but to get one fixed or a replacement section took well over 6 months my last occurrence. As a resultant I sold them all!
     
  9. Tim Lockhart

    Tim Lockhart Working late at The Office

    They're just fishing rods. Offer a simple way to cover any damage, regardless of the cause (a broken rod is a broken rod). A simple effective warranty keeps the buyer fishing w/o starting over every time his/her rod breaks while keeping the mfr in business. The fee can include a little margin and still be a completely reasonable amount for the customer to pay. If I'm not mistaken this is what most of the better rod makers are already doing. And if undercutting a standard warranty is how you choose to compete, good luck. Pretty easy stuff. Why so difficult?
     
    Kent Lufkin likes this.
  10. Kent Lufkin

    Kent Lufkin Remember when you could remember everything?

    Ford's post above raises an excellent question: What's the purpose of a warranty? For almost any other product, a warranty is a type of insurance policy that protects the customer from loss due to defects in manufacturing or materials.

    The problem with current anything-goes warranties for fishing rods is that they also cover damage to the product that's self-inflicted by the customers as a direct consequence of possibly negligent behavior. Warranties have become a hedge against irresponsible actions by communicating the message, "No matter how badly you treat this product, we'll repair or replace it." As a result, it's likely that folks take fewer precautions with their rods than they might if they were directly responsible for user-caused damage.

    As a comparison, I and a number of my fishing friends use classic bamboo rods that are literally irreplaceable - in some cases made by manufacturers who have been out of business longer than Sage for instance, has been in business. If any of us suffers damage to these classic rods, there's no warranty to get them fixed. As a result, we spend extra effort and time to make sure that they're well clear of car doors and SUV hatch lids, that they're not casually leaned in such a way that they may fall into the path of a person or vehicle.

    In other words, without a warranty, we take a little extra responsibility to make sure that we minimize the chance for damage to irreplaceable rods that is NOT caused by defects in manufacturing or materials.

    K
     
  11. Brian Miller

    Brian Miller Be vewy vewy qwiet, I'm hunting Cutthwoat Twout

    So far since I started fly fishing in the late 80s I have never broken a rod. That makes me a pretty good risk for a company with a lifetime no-fault warranty. However it helps justify buying more rods for specialized uses with what I feel is my disposable income knowing that if I do break one it will get fixed for a fraction of the sales cost. Is that greed or win - win? I still can't afford high end Loomis rods but the Wildcard Warranty is at least plausible for me.
     
  12. Rob Allen

    Rob Allen Active Member

    I think the most reasonable course of action is to offer warranty against defects in workmanship and materials and then replace parts broken my mishap or abuse at manufacturing cost plus shipping.

    this protects the customer and the manufacturer while honoring the customers patronage... it's just common sense
     
    Kent Lufkin likes this.
  13. Kent Lufkin

    Kent Lufkin Remember when you could remember everything?

    Absolutely agreed - except the part about common sense! If it was that common, this thread wouldn't have gone on for 4 pages!

    K
     
  14. Ed Call

    Ed Call Mumbling Moderator Staff Member

    Common sense, a truly rare commodity these days. I like the warranty and likely would pay more for a nice rod with a warranty over one without. I do have many rods without warranties, and take that into consideration each outing.
     
    PT likes this.
  15. Nick Clayton

    Nick Clayton Active Member

    Yeah for me it's pretty simple..... as long as companies offer that kind of warranty I will always choose those companies over those that don't offer that kind of support at the same price range.

    Honestly I would totally not blame a company for going a different dirrwctiom, but as long as I can continue to drive a short trip to the Sage factory to get any issue taken care of I will continue to support them above all others.
     
    PT likes this.
  16. Lugan

    Lugan Joe Streamer

    By the way, if you fish with fiberglass rods, breakage is a non-issue short of the ol' car door mishap.
     
  17. Porter

    Porter Active Member

    common sense ? If it was so common why don't more people have it? (forget who said that?) ......Interesting topic here.
     
  18. ribka

    ribka Active Member

    Just broker my IMX 4 wt after 18 years of use. I would pay $200 to get an IMX replacement

    Great rod as was the GLX
     
  19. Josh Smestad

    Josh Smestad aka Mtnwkr

    Just dropped my xi3 off at sage for repair. Received nothing but smiles, free stickers and an offer of a factory tour. As I was leaving I was thinking to myself, I doubt I'd buy save without a warranty, even if they cut their prices by half. I've only ever broken two rods, and only one of those was my fault. A 200, 400 or 800 dollar rod is an investment to me and it's nice to k ow I'll be fishing that investment for a long time regardless of any accidents.
     
    scottybs likes this.
  20. fifafu

    fifafu Guest

    I have a 3 weight IMX factory rod from the mid 90's. Holy cow the tip is bent. It warps aways from the guides and a little to the right. It casts fine but I don't fish it anymore because it just looks too odd. Has anyone else had an issue like that? Would you send it back?
     

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