Help me overcome some of my ignorance

Discussion in 'Fly Tying' started by Olive bugger, Apr 22, 2013.

  1. Olive bugger Active Member

    Posts: 2,448
    Woodinville, WA
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    Over on another thread we were discussing dryer lint for dubbing. I started the thread as a tongue in cheek comment. One of the posters mentioned the Tups Particular fly. I have never heard of the
    Tups Particular fly. I have heard of the Tups Indispensable fly.

    So I ask, is there such a fly as Tups Particular, or did I just misunderstand.

    If it does exist, could someone please describe it?


  2. Rob Ast Active Member

    Posts: 1,916
    West Pugetopolis WA
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    No, I think it was just me trying to recall an obscure name off the top of my head without confirming via google.
  3. Brian Thomas Active Member

    Posts: 806
    Kamloops B.C
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    Sorry , brain cramp .
  4. Olive bugger Active Member

    Posts: 2,448
    Woodinville, WA
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    Ah ha. I hope your memory is better than mine, Rob. Haha.

    IIRC I read somewhere that the urine stained fur of the fox was used
    in the Indispensable. Odd choice of material, but I suppose that some
    would not find it at all unusual. Wonder if we could convince Davy McPhail to do a vidio on the Tups?
  5. Brian Thomas Active Member

    Posts: 806
    Kamloops B.C
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    When you mentioned Tups Particular , I KNEW I had heard of a pattern named the Particular . I had a brain fart and thought it was the Tups . Turns out it was the Lunn`s Particular I was thinking about . Don`t know if there is a Tups Particular .
    http://www.fish4flies.com/Dry/Winged/Lunns_Particular
  6. Thomas Mitchell Active Member

    Posts: 835
    Western, WA
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    The Tups Indispensable us dubbed with urine stained wool from a Ram's scrotum. Hence the name.
  7. Olive bugger Active Member

    Posts: 2,448
    Woodinville, WA
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    Ah ha. So I am learning. The Fox apparently has nothing to do with it.
    The Ram is a major contribution however.

    My next question would be, "WHY WOULD ANYONE CHOSE SUCH A MATERIAL? IS FISHING THAT METICULOUS THERE?"

    It would seem that a lot of substitution, for good reason, has come into the pattern.


    Thanks for the update.
  8. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,140
    Willamette Valley, OR
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    Oh for crying out loud!!! First it's female fox urine on her belly and now it's male goat pee on its balls!! Evidently there was a really weird fly tyer of old sneaking around checking wild animals for pee stains. Pee stains on fur!!! Strange obsession.
  9. Olive bugger Active Member

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    Woodinville, WA
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    Maybe things get slow in the high country of Scotland, Gene.
  10. zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

    Posts: 3,213
    Moses Lake, WA
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    What I'd like to know is how the ram was restrained when the harvesting was done. Some of the ones I've seen have been a bit cantankerous when humans are nearby.
  11. Olive bugger Active Member

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    Woodinville, WA
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    Werry carefully.
  12. Hans Weilenmann Active Member

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    There is a Tups Indispensable and a Lunn's Particular.

    There may, of course, also have been an undisclosed liaison....

    Cheers,
    Hans W
    Thom Collins and GAT like this.
  13. GAT Active Member

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    Willamette Valley, OR
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    ha hah hahhahahhah That's for sure...:D
  14. Jack Devlin Active Member

    Posts: 1,214
    Western Washington, Puget Sound area
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    Here is an actual specimen of urine-stained ram's "fur" taken from an unmentionable area of the ram. It was given to me by a mentor in 1965. A Tup's Indispensable was one of the first flies I tied.
    Jack DSC01209.jpeg
  15. Olive bugger Active Member

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    Woodinville, WA
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    Well, to show how profound my ignorance is, I had to look up Mr. Lunn's Particular fly, since I am not familiar with it.

    I found this tidbit of great interest.
    http://www.flyanglersonline.com/features/oldflies/part309.php

    Some of these old stories make for very good reading.

    That is some interesting material, Jack.
    However, i can see Charlie making a substitute for it in my Tup's
  16. Thomas Mitchell Active Member

    Posts: 835
    Western, WA
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    Just to be more explicit... Tup is an old British term for ram. So a ram's 'indispensable'... Well you get the picture.

    I really like the pattern and use a blend of cream and yellow seal with a few pink strands blended in. It's probably a little more coarse than the original but it works and I get a kick out of fishing it knowing the origins. LOL
  17. Dave Evans Active Member

    Posts: 548
    E. WA / N ID
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    Huh, I do not use dubbing wax and just prefer to lick my fingers then wet the thread and material. I may change my strategy when using this stuff.
    GAT likes this.
  18. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,140
    Willamette Valley, OR
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    Think I'll stick to the synthetic Rams Urine Stained Balls Fur.... or imitation RUSBRF. (dirty orange dubbing)
  19. Olive bugger Active Member

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    Woodinville, WA
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    Gives you a whole new perspective on dressing flies, don't it.

    Wonder if latex rubber gloves would work?
  20. Jack Devlin Active Member

    Posts: 1,214
    Western Washington, Puget Sound area
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    The Tups Indispensable is not the only fly to use urine "burned" fur. The Hendrickson pattern calls for urine "burned" red fox fur.
    Jack