How Many Winter-Run Steelhead???

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by Ben Waldschmidt, Apr 13, 2009.

  1. Coach Duff Banned or Parked

    Posts: 1,272
    Kailua Hawaii
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    For those of you who don't understand there IS a difference between nymphing and swinging. The most glaring difference is that nymphing is about 200 percent more effective. It is the new way to hotshot, only with a flyrod as the delivery method. Now, that means far more fish hooked and played, and since many of these rivers contain only an endangered species, well......... Now in the hands of any conservation minded catch and release advocate, this is simply a more effective way to hook and release fish. In the hands of a complete dumbass it is a better way to hook more, overplay and kill fish. For those of you who don't know or remember, a few years back a guide and a bunch of his clients had a shitload of Deer Creek fish pinned in low water. Hot summer conditions, high water temps and the maybe the most celebrated and fragile run of steelies in the world. They pounded the fuck out of those trapped fish with bobbers and jigs (but delivered with flyrods) and a good number of a truly endangered speces floated down the river dead as doorknobs AFTER being released. Now boys, before you get defensive, or think anybody is incriminating you, I am not in any way. The end to the story is that Alec Jackson and his Deer Creek brothers attacked the state to get a closure before the bobber tossers wiped out dozens more. I have always thought that this led to the intense split between the swinging and nymphing ranks which is bullshit. We need to stick together as brothers, not enemies. However we need to quit saying there is really no difference between the two techniques. One outfishes the other 20 to 1 and has more footprint or impact on any fishery it is employed in. As fish become more and more scarce, we need to be honest in our evaluation of techniqes used on an endangered species, and if a run is so fragile that nymphing endangers it so, that river should be closed before we get in pissing contests with each other. Fishing is about friendships and sharing something, and steelhead are a pretty cool thing to share! Tight lines Coach Duff
  2. Ben Waldschmidt Member

    Posts: 345
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    Hell yeah, Coach!!! Well stated. United we stand, divided we fall (and so do the steelhead)
  3. ThnkMcfly Member

    Posts: 64
    Ketchum, ID
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    To the coach,

    I like what you had to say. I still think fisherman shouldn't feel less about themselves if they happen to find a nat steelie while running the nymph rig. They are still damn hard to find and land. Like I said before, I'd rather hook up on the swing and thats what I set out to do in the winter.

    As long as the angler isn't a bonehead and doesn't rip face with barbs, play a fish to death on light tackle, take 60+ pics , but practices good C&R and carefully returns the fish to the water to go hump some gravel then I don't see any real problem with it. Any true steelhead fly fisherman wouldn't pound a hole to death anyway, checking the "gluttony" and "greed" boxes.

    I believe that if more and more people can experience a beautiful steelhead in their own two hands the more advocates will be created. Its not an easy thing to do, and we don't want them to be a secret, they will simply fade away. They need to be experienced and revered by many.

    I'm a young guy, and my generation has a lot to shoulder because of careless management of our wild places and species in previous generations. I hope we can meet the challenges, actually we have to. I hope everyone out their can do their part for these fish.

    On a side note, how was the FFF certification Coach Duff? I'm taking it this June, have heard mixed conclusions about it. Have you taken the double handed test too?

    Griffey just sent one, #400 as a M.
  4. Eric Tarcha gear whore

    Posts: 1,067
    Seattle, WA
    Ratings: +12 / 0
    0 for forever. lots and lots of days, nary a bump. ARRGGG.
  5. Charlie Erdman In search of steel

    Posts: 354
    K. Falls, OR
    Ratings: +0 / 0
    1 fished hooked on the schwang dang...broke me off. sandy river. during the cold days in december
    18 or so landed nymphing from four different rivers. was my first winter exploring southwest Oregon. didn't get as much swinging in as I would have liked to. solid winter with a lot of new river explored.
  6. Charlie Erdman In search of steel

    Posts: 354
    K. Falls, OR
    Ratings: +0 / 0

    I agree. Interesting how nymphing is not allowed on the North Umpqua until October.
  7. Jerry Daschofsky Moderator

    Posts: 7,786
    Graham, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +689 / 5
    Wow, they have a rule against nymphing? Interesting. Is there a definition, or do they specifically say "nymphing" in the regs. I was just curious if they said "a float with a lure is not allowed" or what the regs actually say. Nymphing is a deadly way to fish, basically one of the ways we do it from the boat (other is a modified swing, just the boat is doing the work, not the person with the rod in their hands).
  8. Charles Sullivan dreaming through the come down

    Posts: 2,317
    bellingham wa
    Ratings: +565 / 0

    I believe that the N. Umpqua is a flyfish only stream. Oregon flyfish only rules are more stringent than WA. If I remember corectly they don't allow for attached weight or weighted flies. That'd pretty much eliminate nymphing.

  9. Jerry Daschofsky Moderator

    Posts: 7,786
    Graham, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +689 / 5
    Ah, ok. That makes sense then. Just wasn't sure what the distinction was. Remember when some of our rivers had a "non bouyant lure" restriction. Wasn't sure if it was something like that.
  10. HauntedByWaters Active Member

    Posts: 2,750
    Ratings: +105 / 0
    The reason all the different techniques matter is because some of us are very good fishermen who have been swinging flies for a very long time and don't catch much while others are newbies tossing beads from a boat and outfishing said veterans and thinking they are the next "living steelhead legend" after their first season. If I didn't see so many guys posing like they are the most badass fisherman on the planet I wouldn't care but last time I was on the OP I saw one every 100 yards and it isn't much different up on the Skauk either. These guys can fish however they want but don't smirk and purse your lips and ignore the guy saying what a beautiful day it is to you, trying to build a community/ make a connection, because that would be me and I am getting sick of all the stinking fly asses on the steelhead rivers. At least up on the Skauk those poseurs swing flies and catch very little like said veterans, though they probably are planning a career of being a professional fisherman if they aren't already one (thanks dad!). That would be a career guiding the Skauk after having a stellar season of 4 or so...... (I am in no way claiming to be a veteran but I fish with some and echo their thoughts, or maybe I just got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning)
  11. Jergens AKA Joe Willauer

    Posts: 2,141
    Twin Bridges, MT
    Ratings: +19 / 0
    iagree fly fishing is no fun if you can't maintain a moral high ground over somebody else.
  12. Brett Angel Member

    Posts: 532
    Sammamish, WA
    Ratings: +16 / 0
  13. Ringlee Doesn't care how you fish Moderator

    Posts: 1,858
    Somewhere you don't know about, WA
    Ratings: +52 / 1
    If you swing flies, your shit doesn't stink.
  14. Big Tuna Member

    Posts: 1,965
    Wenatchee, Washington
    Ratings: +44 / 0
    This was kind of bizarre even for you. In the end, it's just fly fishing and not worth getting your blood pressure up. Take a few deep breaths and try to go to your happy place.
  15. Charles Sullivan dreaming through the come down

    Posts: 2,317
    bellingham wa
    Ratings: +565 / 0
    I have read Jason's post several times. I can only assume that he had a bad day and drank all night until 11:51 AM when he posted that. That was truly an outstanding post. I pissed in my pants a little bit while reading it. Now, it makes no sense and the grammar could use a little help, but on the entertainment scale it rates way up there.
    Serenity now Jay! Serenity now!!!

    Beckett tonight,
  16. Coach Duff Banned or Parked

    Posts: 1,272
    Kailua Hawaii
    Ratings: +6 / 0
    Can you imagine telling the Deer Creek boys years ago or any of the old timers on any steelhead river that there would be a winter day where every run is jammed with fly anglers up and down the river? They would have laughed themselves silly. Tight lines Coach