Just build better biting steelhead

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by GAT, Apr 27, 2014.

  1. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,236
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,706 / 0
    FinLuver likes this.
  2. Nooksack Mac Active Member

    Posts: 1,965
    Bellingham, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +121 / 0
    I think it's a wonderful idea!:p The only downside I can see is the need for electrified kevlar armored waders, which will cost several thousand dollars. But we have four years to save up.:cool:
  3. Darthmonkey Active Member

    Posts: 198
    Tacoma, WA
    Ratings: +154 / 0
    This is why we can't have nice things.
    Tyler Sadowski and Derek Young like this.
  4. KerryS Ignored Member

    Posts: 6,768
    Sedro Woolley, WA, USA.
    Ratings: +1,785 / 0
    LOL. I was wondering what the heck you meant, then it struck me. Cross breeding with great white sharks should do the trick and increase the size also.
  5. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,236
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,706 / 0
    So how do the hatchery jobs survive in the ocean if they're so passive and non aggressive?
    FinLuver likes this.
  6. Charles Sullivan dreaming through the come down

    Posts: 2,318
    bellingham wa
    Ratings: +566 / 0
    At a lower rate. The massive amount of smolts dumped in is the reason we get some back.

    Go Sox,
    cds
    John Hicks likes this.
  7. Chris Johnson Member: Native Fish Society

    Posts: 1,796
    Bellingham Wa.
    Ratings: +320 / 1
    Hatchery fish, it's what we've always done, right?
    KevinLS and Phil Fravel like this.
  8. jake-e-boy Banned or Parked

    Posts: 507
    Ratings: +227 / 0
    waste of time and money, odfw strikes again! it makes no damn sense for the state to spend $25 million on hatcheries. money would be better spent going towards conservation efforts for the remaining wild runs.
    GAT likes this.
  9. FinLuver Active Member

    Posts: 444
    Mid-Willamette Valley
    Ratings: +98 / 0
    Gene...ya beat me to this post.

    Ironically, the brood stock program already uses "wild fish" that are caught by anglers on the Alsea and have been for quite some time.

    Lets see...

    In WA they manage their steelhead in units (PS, OP, etc) and some wish they were managed as individual streams; in Oregon streams are managed as individual streams, but are now being considered for units (CMP).

    In Oregon, hatchery steelhead were dumped from other streams (in state or out of state), but had a poor return rate due to their "foreign nature"; so "wild brood stock" from natal streams were used and had a higher rate of return. Then is was deemed - these fish were somehow "inferior" and detrimental because of their hatchery raising.

    Now, in Oregon, it's being considered to have a better biting hatchery fish; on top of that, Washington is considering a "wild brood stock" program, getting rid of Chambers Creek hatchery fish - yet if I not mistaken, brood stock fish are hatchery fish.

    Two things come to mind...

    • Seems to me, the hatchery fish is pretty "smart" for surviving all that it has had to face in the wild- and still not bite something that is not natural for them to eat; wild fish need to "smartin up".
    • Is it the fish that need the help or is it man?
    ;)
  10. fredaevans Active Member

    Posts: 3,131
    White City, Oregon, USA.
    Ratings: +126 / 0
    Add just a bit to what FL posted above. The Chetco (that I know of for sure and I think two more-Elk and the Sixes?) all the 'hatchery fish' are netted from wild stock and taken to the hatchery, milked, etc., and then returned to the river they came from. Eggs to fry from each river are kept separate so what goes back in are all 'Native Fish' to that river save for spent time in a hatchery. Don't know if that also applies to the King Salmon runs.
  11. David Dalan 69°19'15.35" N 18°44'22.74" E

    Posts: 1,997
    Walla Walla, WA
    Ratings: +783 / 0
    Its a good idead. Forum keeps tossing my replies, so this is short.
  12. Cruik Active Member

    Posts: 468
    Seattle, WA
    Ratings: +142 / 0
    Maybe they'll start forming and dying their pellets to look like jigs, plugs, flies, and corkies. Maybe feed them sand shrimp once in a while.
  13. Klickrolf Active Member

    Posts: 600
    Klickitat, Washington
    Ratings: +166 / 0
    A logical impossibility, this is a fallacy, waste of effort and coin. If they could make hatchery fish more aggressive they'd just scoop up more of the wild fry, parr or smolts, and they'd die sooner because of that aggression, caught once and done (that's what they're made for). Outmigrants might go after a little smallmouth, trouble is the little smallmouth has a much bigger mouth...that's how little fish work, if they can get it in their mouth they will eat it!

    The entire problem lies within the hatchery environment, make stupid fish and you get stupid fish, make aggressive fish and you'll get dead fish. There is only one way, eggs must be left to become fish in the wild, raceways will never work...egg boxes...egg boxes...egg boxes.

    Fish managers can fertilize eggs and choose for obvious traits like run timing and size but choosing for aggression is a very dangerous choice and I doubt they can even do it. An aggressive fish is a fish reared in the wild and left to it's own choices.
    Ian Broadie and GAT like this.
  14. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,236
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,706 / 0
    In Oregon, they keep raising the price of the fishing licenses and tags because they claim the ODF&W is not receiving enough revenue.

    So their idea is to spend a ton of money on hatchery steelhead to make them easier to catch? ....which sounds like some Frankenfish attempt with little chance of success and quite possibly will cause even more damage to the wild runs.

    That is no way to run a railroad...
  15. Olive bugger Active Member

    Posts: 2,505
    Woodinville, WA
    Ratings: +439 / 0
    I don't think the railroad is in trouble, Gene. But you point is valid.
    When it comes to spending the tax payers' money, anything goes.
  16. FinLuver Active Member

    Posts: 444
    Mid-Willamette Valley
    Ratings: +98 / 0
    Gene...did ya know the same guy who's in the article, Stan Steele, is also on the ODFW External Budget Committee??

    Makes ya go...Hmmmm?
  17. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,236
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,706 / 0
    Well THAT'S a surprise.
    FinLuver likes this.
  18. FinLuver Active Member

    Posts: 444
    Mid-Willamette Valley
    Ratings: +98 / 0
  19. FinLuver Active Member

    Posts: 444
    Mid-Willamette Valley
    Ratings: +98 / 0
  20. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,236
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,706 / 0
    I suppose if hatchery steelhead were easier to catch they may not end up spawning with wild steelhead but what if they do? What happens when one of the Frankenfish spawns with a wild steelhead? I don't know and neither do they.

    This is one of those plans that looks good on paper but someone is missing a problem that will only show up on down the road.

    I'm all for reducing the numbers of hatchery steelhead in wild steelhead rivers but I kind'a thought a better idea was to slowly stop planting the hatchery fish.

    Obviously, that ain't going to happen. Maybe folks aren't fishing as much as they once did because they're doing something else, not because the fish are too hard to catch. They must really believe if steelhead are easier to catch, more folks will buy fishing licenses and tags to catch them.

    The masses will most certainly give up playing computer games, updating their Face Book page, golfing and surfing The Internet to rush out and buy a fishing license once steelhead are easier to catch.

    No doubt about it.