Looks like one retailer's finally had enough of being undercut by Costco...

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Alosa, Aug 6, 2013.

  1. Danielocean

    Danielocean Steelhead Virgin

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    In my opinion and my opinion only. I feel that fly shops in general would do much better if they geared a lot more of there rod, and reel inventory to novice anglers. Shops like Cabelas, Basspro, and other big name stores will always hurt small fly shops because they offer more options for novice anglers. Even a 300 hundred dollar outfit scares the shit out of a new guy, and especially his wife. If I ever owned my own fly shop I would stock much more affordable gear, that appeals to a much wider customer base.
     
  2. Kirk Estlick

    Kirk Estlick Active Member

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    IMO That won't keep you in business. And I say that because a majority of novice anglers don't understand the difference between a BPS and a local fly shop.

    I work in a shop in Arizona and I will tell you that your statement was my belief when I started and as I have gained experience in the industry I no longer feel that way. Now maybe that is just the Arizona market, but I can't get novice anglers in my shop to buy the inexpensive, made over seas, Redington outfits. Even those cant compete with Bass Pros white river series or Cabelas prestige series. So my shop thrives selling high end gear, because that is what has kept us open for the past 10 years in a Desert!
     
  3. jersey

    jersey livin' the dream

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    Just curious, if a manufacturer offered two prices, one with warranty and one without and an obvious price point difference, how would you spend?

    Oh yeah, what Costco is still housing those inexpensive sage rods??
     
  4. Danielocean

    Danielocean Steelhead Virgin

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    There could be a lot of reasons why your not getting the novice's in your shop. Are you by any chance implementing a good marketing strategy?
     
  5. Greg Price

    Greg Price Love da little fishies

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    I am happy to have Anil as my local fly shop. He has given me excellent council on all kinds of stuff. Anytime I get christmass, father's day or birthday money I take it to Puget Sound Fly Shop and come out with items that I have fun with. Anil helps me match my fishing gear to my fishing needs. Always satisfied. Support your local fly shop. Better to pay more and get what you want need. Don't go cheap on recreational gear.
     
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  6. Michael Morris

    Michael Morris Member

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    I am not 100% sure but I doubt Sage is making 60 - 70 % margins on their rods.
     
  7. snapt

    snapt New Member

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    Unilateral Policy is why it's legal for them and thousands of other companies.
     
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  8. Abomb

    Abomb Active Member

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    If only you knew.
     
  9. _WW_

    _WW_ Fishes with Wolves

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    Your missing a couple of zeros...
     
  10. KerryS

    KerryS Ignored Member

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    Well, please explain.
     
  11. Brian Thomas

    Brian Thomas Active Member

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  12. Michael Morris

    Michael Morris Member

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    Just because a rod retails for 775$ doesn't mean Sage gets 775$ per rod. More than likely, the fly shops are making a 20% or more margin per rod as well. Also have to take into account, Labor, BOM, Overhead..etc. these rods are most likely priced the way they are to make certain margins which every company does, it's not just like Sage goes ok umm 1000$ per rod. There's a guy out if Montana selling rods for 3 to 4 grand, I think anything that is handcrafted will be exponentially higher priced.
     
  13. Porter

    Porter Active Member

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    R & D takes time, time is money, thus you not only pay for the labor and materials but also the think tanks behind the product.
     
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  14. martyg

    martyg Active Member

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    X2. The general public has absolutely no idea of the costs involved in bringing a product to market. If fly fishermen have issues with Sage's pricing then I challenge them to leverage everything that they own (house, retirement accounts, vehicles, kid's college fund, etc) take out the big loan and bring a high-end, mid-price point product to market.
     
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  15. Michael Morris

    Michael Morris Member

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    I completely agree, I work in finance for a large merchandise agency(promotional items) and the amount of COGS to hit one item is amazing, from licensor royalties to art tickets to freight it eats into the margin. On top of that think about how many different people touch have their hands in selling 1 rod. From the designer to the person selling to fly shops to the customer service reps that answer inquiries. Plus all 175 employees take a salary regardless of how a rod sales.
     
  16. Lugan

    Lugan Joe Streamer

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    This is the same reason why pirating software and music is stealing. Even though unit cost of production is small, there is a huge up front engineering investment that needs to be paid off and...yes...profited from.
     
  17. dflett68

    dflett68 Active Member

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    the guy who brought up the issue of price point relative to this sage thread owns and operates a manufacturing business, and DOES understand all of these matters intimately. for that matter, the general public of the current population probably understands them better than at any other time in history. every rod manufacturer has the same lines in their P&L. all other things being equal, every premium manufacturer has similar expenses in development, materials, production, marketing, OH, etc. but it's a reality that if your brand value is #1 in your marketplace, you can charge more. sage is doing that, unless they are stupid. it may or may not be possible to demonstrate that their most expensive rod is actually better than that of their direct competitors, but there's little doubt that their brand is generally perceived to be the best in the industry. they are cashing in on that. and, i don't know this, but i doubt they are spending significantly more or less on their r&d (or anything else) than orvis or winston, et. al. as a percentage of their overall P&L.
     
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  18. Rob Hardman

    Rob Hardman Active Member

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    Yup. But I'm sure we all know, it's a double edged sword. You don't get to stay on top and just kick back and enjoy the profits rolling in. You've gotta get right back into the lab and start developing the "NEW" best rod. Then marketing has to figure out how to bullshit customers into believing it's worth replacing the "last NEW best rod" with the "NEW NEW best rod".
    I love Sage, and I love my One, but the last marketing campaign was borderline insulting. And it's only gonna get worse.
     
  19. Matt Paluch

    Matt Paluch Active Member

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    Just out of curiosity, what was so bad about the marketing of the ONE? Besides the name triggering assumptions by consumers that Sage was saying this was the best and only rod you'd ever need to buy again (they never did say that), I didn't see anything in the marketing that was even inaccurate. Maybe I missed it, but I don't think so.
     
  20. dflett68

    dflett68 Active Member

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    again, so does the competition. these are not costs unique to sage.

    and i'll say again that i don't see anything wrong with sage charging whatever they want for a rod. people got the money, they believe the product is worth it, there are enough of them to make it profitable for sage, so who cares? more power to them. if they push it past the tipping point the market will push back. till then it looks like they know what they are doing. at least they're definitely better at marketing than supplier management.
     

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