(NFR) I-90 Toll Proposal

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by 509, Jul 1, 2006.

  1. 509

    509 New Member

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    I don't know if this issue has gotten much press over on the west-side of the state. The state of Washington is proposing to convert I-90 over Snoqualmie Pass to a toll road with a four dollar toll.

    You remember when we had the great gas tax debate there was a lot of anger in western Washington about sending gas tax dollars for roads in eastern Washington. One of the solutions to this was to implement toll roads so that the user pays. This will get eastern Washington to pay their fair share.

    There have been editorials over here supporting the proposal even though it will cost people from here to travel to Seattle. But it is fair and hopefully will end the debates about gas tax dollars going east.

    The problem with the proposal is the toll is to small. Four dollars. It should be at least 5 and maybe 10 dollars. I-90 would be the only cross-cascade toll road, shifting even more traffic onto Highway 2. Other passes would also be impacted as drivers shift to avoid tolls. All cross-cascade routes should be turned into toll roads.

    Here are two links....one for a survey site to express your opinion.....hopefully support for the proposal. The other link is to a Seattle Times article on the proposal.

    http://www.watollingstudy.com/

    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/cg...ion_id=2002111777&slug=tolls20m&date=20060620
     
  2. BigBill

    BigBill Banned or Parked

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal


    Are you joking? You want to voluntarily give your money to the state? Very surprising to read a post like this, especially at a time when gas prices are so obscene. Be careful what you wish for. After living a few years in Boston I can tell you that tolls really add up. Plus they cause huge traffic delays. Even the electronic "fast track" ones! And once the flood gates open with 1 toll route, others will follow.

    Also, isn't it a bad idea to divert traffic from a 37-lane super highway to a 2-lane state route? I can think of all sorts of reasons why it is better for the average Seattleite to take I-90 from a conservation/sustainability viewpoint. DONT JERSEY WA! LOL

    Personally, I feel the government does such a crappy job utilizing our tax dollars it is my personal goal to make sure they get as little as possible. I am definately going to be proactive in opposing this.
     
  3. speyfisher

    speyfisher Active Member

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    If you like toll roads, Florida has a lot of them. All major highways leading into and out of International Airports have toll gates. And once you get on, there is no way off except through the gate. :beathead:
     
  4. newcaster2

    newcaster2 New Member

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    It would be terrific as you said to have the locals pay for local roads. The problem is, there's little trust I have in the state's limiting the toll revenue to strictly local/regional road maintenance. In other words, you can't be sure that money is going where you think it should, and more likely than not you'll end up paying just as much tax elsewhere. Tolled AND taxed.

    You give in to the toll and watch the state gov's promises vanish.
     
  5. o mykiss

    o mykiss Active Member

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    Cripes, there's enough traffic going in both directions on any normal day that a toll would make the traverse over the pass miserable. I can barely tolerate traffic jams in the Seattle metro area; having to sit in a half-hour line to get through a toll after a day of fishing on the east side would tend to kill the afterglow. And having to wait in traffic just to go skiing would suck. Also, the absolute last thing they need to do is encourage more traffic on Highway 2. No one in their right mind goes that way to come west on a weekend anyway, because all the population growth in Monroe and environs often makes Highway 2 from High Bridge down more constipated than many urban freeways during weekday rush hour. A toll on Snoqualmie would just make that worse.

    As someone who grew up east of the mountains and lives west, I'd like to think we are all in this together.
     
  6. 509

    509 New Member

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    The proposal is to have so sort of fast pass system to pay. So only those without a pass would have to stop. Unfortunately, the current proposal is only for I-90. I think all the passes should be converted to tolls. Otherwise your right.... Highway 2 will turn into a parking lot with all the eastsiders heading west.

    In all fairness to the state they are just trying to respond to public demands. Remember last time the gas debate went on....the folks west of the Cascades were very angry about paying for roads in eastern Washington. The toll proposal if you go to the web site is an attempt to get the user to pay and refining that to a region.

    It all might be mute in 20 years. Oregon is heading towards a system where a GPS keeps track of where your driving and charges you accordingly. The problem is that most of us couldn't afford to pay a lump sum at the end of the year. So they are talking about a gas tax....and then an accounting adjustment at the end of the year when you file your state income taxes. That would be tough in Washington for obvious reasons.
     
  7. Jim Jones

    Jim Jones flytosser

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    Didn't we just pass a $0.03 tax gas that just recently went into effect? I would consider that a use based tax.

    I am not necessarily opposed to tolls, but in most cases they are implemented to pay for a new service. In WA it was most recently used to pay for the addition of bridges. How many of you remember having to take the ferry across from Biggs, OR? (Not me, I am not that old!) But ferry service in Entiat was still running as late as the early 70's I believe.

    CA has implemented tolls on Express Ways in order to create a premium service, i.e. the ability to drive on less crowded tollways. Although so many people in So Cal use the service I am not sure how much faster it is anymore.

    We certainly have a conundrum in WA with the fact that we pay no state income tax. It becomes difficult, given population growth estimates, to have a clear picture of where the money is going to come from for infrastructure expansion.

    And, frankly, this is not just a Westside problem as I believe that the Spokane area is growing nearly as rapidly as Metro King County.

    Jim
     
  8. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    It's not to bad in the summer time as if you did some checking things out you can make it over Snoqualmie pass with out driving the Freeway. I know as I did it last summer. I had to check a lot of maps but in the end I found a way.

    Jim........Just a back road driver:hmmm:
     
  9. NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    Hwy 2 will turn into a parking lot?:confused: It already is.
     
  10. roadhog

    roadhog professional freight relocator

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    NFR-I-90 Toll Proposal

    why dont we just take eastern wash. and north idaho and make our own state that way us dry siders dont have to worry about the wet siders bitchin' about "all the dry siders" using up your tax dollars to fix our roads. What about our tax dollars used to fix your roads? the d.o.t. is a state office and most of the tax dollars go into a general fund for roads. the toll on the pass is the worst idea that our crook of a govenrer has ever come up with to pad her pockets some more. she stole the election why not more of our money. washington already has one of the highest gas taxes in the country, where is that money going? just my $.02!! ok maybe more than $.02. just one of the dry siders, roadhog :thumb:
     
  11. jessejames

    jessejames Flyslinger

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    Roadhog:
    If we could make our own state here in the inland empire we would have one of the most beautiful places around, but alas I think we would be bankrupt. Unfortunately your comment about our gas taxes going to the west side is only correct in this last year and the next couple of years to come. For decades we in the dry side have consistantly been the recipient of more road tax money from the state than we have ever paid in. The facts are in the population base the westside has way more people than roads we have more roads than people. We can cry the blues all we want but we need to play nicey nicey with the left side of the state so we can exist over here.
    As far as the toll goes I think it will happen the pass needs millions of $$ in repair and maintenance and the entire state will resist another gas tax increase to pay for it.
    By the way there Mr. Hog it was nice fishing with you over the weekend,too bad you left early I found a spot even you could have caught fish:p :p .
    You better get a little more serious about fishing, with your wifes zeal she is going to be a way better fisher than you.:thumb:
    Blessings
    jesse clark
     
  12. Dipsnort

    Dipsnort New Member

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    It's a funny thing. I have relatives in Eastern WA who think they are subsidizing Western WA with all of our new stadiums we have to keep building and that sort of nonsense.:confused:
     
  13. o mykiss

    o mykiss Active Member

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    There's one problem with that. Eastern Washingtonians don't pay to subsidize the public cost of sports stadiums on the West side unless they come over here to stay in hotels in King County and/or go to sporting events, since the taxes used to repay the public bonds that were floated to pay part of the costs of building places like Safeco and Qwest, as well as the cost of retiring the Kingdome debt, are all LOCAL taxes on lodging (i.e., hotels/motels) and admission to the sporting events themselves (i.e., tickets). So tell your relatives that if they don't want to pay taxes to support these stadiums, don't stay in King County and don't go to any games. ;)
     
  14. Itchy Dog

    Itchy Dog Some call me Kirk Werner

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    Seattle needs to be it's own state. Most of the outlying areas in Western Washington would takes sides with central and eastern Washinton when it comes to matters of government and politics. King County, for example, is a miniature view of the state as a whole. We in eastern King County are not well represented by the County Council bureaucrats in Seattle. If you guys east of the Pass cecede, take me with you!
     
  15. jessejames

    jessejames Flyslinger

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    Mr Snort:
    It is true we Eastern Wa residents do support those on the West side in the areas you mention the two super stadiums, the behemoths of lavish sporting life in Washington. But over all it is we dry siders who benefit the most from the population and mega buck salaries you'all have there in the left side;) ;) . I spend some time on the road and it doesn't take much to realize that I can often drive on a state highway from somewhere to nowhere here in E'Wa and see only a few hundred cars all day. We can't build these highways in the palouse and down into the southeast part of the state without revenue from somewhere else. So I want to thank you for building that nice road that gets me to the Grand Ronde every fall to catch those beautiful steelhead.:thumb:
    Just don't go gettin' the notion that just because you help support us you can come over and catch all of our fish.:ray1:
    Blessings
    jesse clark
     
  16. Mike Colagrossi

    Mike Colagrossi Whammo!

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    So everytime I drive to Cle Elum I have to pay $10 bucks... screw that and screw Gregoire and her "I will not raise taxes platform" get someone in there to audit all the waste and then after everything is shaken up come talk to me about a damn Toll road.

    I am sure Traffic would be a breeeezeee with a toll both on I-90 as well...

    Show me the ballot and I vote no..
     
  17. o mykiss

    o mykiss Active Member

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    Thank God there's more of us than you.:p

    Kind of an interesting observation when less than half of the council is comprised of residents of Seattle. Shall we restructure so there is a seat reserved for "redneck hillbillies"?:p

    Don't let the door hit you on your ass on the way out, you little midget.:p

    (in hoc signo . . . ;))
     
  18. flybill

    flybill Purveyor of fine hackle, wine & cigars!

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    One of those "blue lines" in the WA, MT,
    iagree - Guess the park fees didn't work, so now our state wants to try something new. Something other than these regressive types of taxation needs to be done!
     
  19. BigBill

    BigBill Banned or Parked

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    Ahhhh, Now it's starting to make sense. When I first read this thread I was a bit surprised to read that somebody supported a bill to build toll roads but now it's pretty obvious what is going on here.

    Eastern WA=red state; Western WA=blue state...right?

    So basically this thread is nothing more than some E.WA conservative, god/gun loving, Republican symbolically putting up a "no trespassing" sign for W.WA forum members wanting to go east for fishing and other recreational opportunities. And in fact, a toll booth wouldn't affect him and/or other E. WA supporters of this bill very much since they probably dont plan on making many trips to Seattle.

    Gotcha, thanks for bringing me up to speed regarding WA state politics 101 as it relates to highway travel among popular interstate fishing destinations...

    Bill
     
  20. Where does god/gun loving or republican or democrat come into this? I do agree with your post from "no trespassing" on though.
     

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