Outcast Frameless Oar Mounts

Discussion in 'Watercraft' started by SpeyFitter, Apr 14, 2014.

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  1. PT

    PT Physhicist

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    Sportsman, if your dealings with Scadden were the same as mine, you wouldn't be calling anyone a punk on this topic. Shady would be complimentary when talking about the issues I had with the company.

    I'm not the only person THAT I PERSONALLY KNOW who has been treated like shit after putting money down on one of their products. Used car salesman is a compliment.

    Back to your regular programming.
     
  2. golfman44

    golfman44 Active Member

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    I've heard this as well in regards to Scadden. I've also heard about bad quality products combined with shit service in regards to a watermaster incident, and that came from a more reputable source than I'd find anywhere on this forum.

    At the end of the day, nothing is indestructible and everything is bound to break if you jam an oar against a rock enough times. Arguing about it on a forum is quite useless.

    Hell, look at this:



    Do Kias have these problems? Yup. Do porsches? Yup.
     
  3. sportsman

    sportsman Active Member

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    PT, the topic was/is "Oar Mount Pads". A comparison of the different styles referred to the "Issue Prone Scadden Versions". I just wanted to make it very clear that any number of failed oar locks, while a bummer for those who experienced it, is an extremely small PERCENT! Talk facts, not falsehoods, which is what was posted. # 1. What is the percent of total failures compared to total number of rafts sold?? # 2. What % of documented faiulres were from operator error or abuse. I doubt that it would exceed one in a thousand.....001% PT, when we met at the slough so you could buy the items I posted for sale, didn't you say that your personal dealings with Dave was 10-12 years ago?? You were also somewhat coy about letting me know who you actually were on this site, because we had just had some disagreements online....did you think I would not sell them to you? Anyway, it was a good transaction and we had a pleasant chat,
     
  4. skitterbug

    skitterbug Member

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    Hey Sportsman,

    It's one thing to get your perspective across, it's another when you become insulting. What gives you the right to wish people to bounce their head off a rock, or calling them punks.
    I'm sure if you were face to face you wouldn't talk to people in that manner. You lose any credibility when you're disrespectful to members on this board.
     
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  5. psycho

    psycho Active Member

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    The only use that I would put any product with that type of rowing system on would be as a pool toy. I like my rowing system to be brass and other types of material either welded on or bolted on with stainless steel bolts and nyloc nuts.
     
  6. sportsman

    sportsman Active Member

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    Fair enough, I see where you are coming from, but I stand by everything I wrote. When an blatanty false statement is posted, without any facts to back them up, I have always come out firing.....it has nothing to do with what boats I own. # 1. We all get it, the canucks on this site are whitewater guys, you have beat the frameless raft style to death. So don't buy them! # 2. As for the other guy I referred to, well, he has earned it. You can go back and read his posts, what he has written and you will see that many others feel the same as I do. Sorry if your sensibilities were offended, so you won't have to worry about me and any other posts....on this subject.
     
  7. PT

    PT Physhicist

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    I don't broadcast who I am to anyone on this site. Only PM and personal meetings. Nothing was different with that transaction in those regards. I have no issues with you and respect your opinion. You've been around the block and know your boats. We all have different experiences with products and I respect that many have high regards for NFO and their boats. Me and many others have not had that same positive experience and shouldn't be trashed on this forum because of it.
    I know what the topic is. When you bash a guy because of his personal opinion about this subject, it's fair to point out yours isn't the only opinion that matters.

    No big deal either way. Scadden has a loyal following but has also earned the lack of respect from many others.

    To be clear, stuff breaks. And, I think it's usually pilot error rather than which company they buy their boat from.
     
  8. skitterbug

    skitterbug Member

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    # 1. We all get it, the canucks on this site are whitewater guys, you have beat the frameless raft style to death. So don't buy them!

    Can you elaborate on this statement? I've seen plenty of post( not just this forum), and from other countries that have voiced their concerns.

    If you've had a bad experience with a member, why not take the highroad and not publicly engage them on a forum? You have nothing to gain, and you have the potential to lose any credibility in doing so.
     
  9. Steezn290

    Steezn290 Member

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    I just want to say that if you had received the 20+ private messages about poor customer service from Scadden you would be skeptical too. People straight up saying that they don't want to post a message in the forum because of backlash and warning me about the validity of Blues customer service experience due to her past "relationship" with Scadden. (the reason that is in quotes is because i'm not sure how close they were or are.)

    The point of the watercraft forum is to inform people about rafts, drift boats, personal watercrafts among other things. If it takes a battle to inform future readers from making a mistake then the battle is worth it. Blue knows that I think her opinion on customer service with Scadden products is not valid. I do on the other hand think her opinion on the craftsmanship and quality of the product is completely valid. I don't think she has hard feelings towards me and neither do I (correct me if i'm wrong Blue). I have apologized for some things that I have said and we are at a truce on that topic. (I've let it go, she's let it go, can you let it go?)
     
  10. Blue

    Blue Active Member

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    See and I get just as many pms if not more from people not posting because they have NFO and had no problem what so ever with the service and they don't want to be chastised. I know as I have been one. Plus I also know that we as forum readers, do not get "the whole" story. We are just taking people at their word. No reason not to, right.....
    Sorry, but you yourself have had no experience with NFO, you just go off what you are told, as do (in PT's words) MANY people. They have never owned or used any of NFO product. I know you will go off on the oars, and again, I still say that was manufacturers delays. Can't ship em if you cant get em.
    Walk a mile in their shoes before criticizing.

    Back to the oars pins subject, started off a very interesting observation. Hopefully we can get more info on the materials of the others.
     
  11. Steezn290

    Steezn290 Member

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    It's not the number of good reviews that matter it is the number of bad reviews. Why didn't they PM me to let me know they had good experience. 20+ people questioning NFO customer service and 0 people defending them in PMs. Kinda lop sided.

    Anyways it doesn't really matter. People will make theie own decisions based on what they read and i'm sure they will be happy either way.
     
  12. golfman44

    golfman44 Active Member

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    Why would someone waste their time pming you with a counter argument when you have clearly made up your mind? It accomplishes nothing.

    You all care way too much about arguing over these useless points. All oars break when you bang them into rocks enough times. Running to a forum blaming a manufacturer for user error is pretty weak
     
  13. Steezn290

    Steezn290 Member

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    Sorry for not being clear. I am talking about the old post I made about NFO vs Watermaster and which to get. I hadn't made up my mind when I received the PMs discussed.

    Lastly I have never blamed the a manufacturer for probably what is a user error. But if the user error is re-occurring it might just not be a user error it could be a manufacturer issue. I can't speak to this as I have not seen enough cases.

    Hence why car companies make recalls. Because what may have been thought to be a user error the first 100 times might not be a user error after the 10,000 time.
     
  14. golfman44

    golfman44 Active Member

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    I'm not trying to get in an argument so I'm sorry that I mis understood your last post, but at the end of the day, shit is going to break when you misuse it. Personally I have heard of more water master oar mounts breaking (2) than I have of NFOs (0). Given the vast disparity in #'s of WM vs NFO out there on the water, this would incline me to believe NFO is superior to WM. Am I going to run to a forum PMing everyone about this? Hell no. Does my experience make it a fact that NFO > WM? Hell no.

    Just get what boat makes you happy, go fish, and enjoy it. If it breaks? I'll be glad to have Scaddens lifetime warranty, but thats just me. At the end of the day, who gives a shit what golfman44 says on the forum? I sincerely hope nobody makes a boat purchase solely based upon what someone writes here.
     
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  15. ralfish

    ralfish Active Member

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    Somes peoples lack of respect, intelligence and decorum makes their posts so very predictable. Shame their loud and incessant voice doesn't bring anything worthwhile or intelligible to the conversation.
     
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  16. sportsman

    sportsman Active Member

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    railfish, just on the off chance you are referring to me it's Ok. Decorum,,,really? Intelligence, Boeing trusts me with their engines and I did spend 9 years travelling the world installing turbine powered propulsions systems in Mega Yachts and off-shore race boats, not Mensa , but I do OK. Lack of respect, for you I have none because of this quote by YOU: " Seems the Watermaster version are the cats ass compared to the issue prone scadden versions". So I consider that statement as being somewhere between totally misinformed or you are an outright liar. I really don't care which and anything you think of me I will proudly wear compared to what you have proven to be!
     
  17. Greg Armstrong

    Greg Armstrong Active Member

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    Not trying to be disrespectful here or anything - but I think somebody needs to get laid...

    This thread reminds me of way back in my Jr. High days (the Mustang had just been invented - just to give an idea of how long ago this was) - my buddies and I would have arguments of which cars were better;

    Ford
    Chevrolet or
    Dodge
    ....but we never got as wound up about it as some of you guys have on this thread.

    We're talking about flyfishing here folks, take a deep breath and relax.
     
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  18. Blue

    Blue Active Member

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    Not that it will move heaven and earth, but I have read the term "prone" and "many". I have read some oar holders have broke, but as mentioned I have also read WM breaks as well. I also read for every 10 NFO there are maybe 3 WM. "Many" do own NFO, more so that WM and that is a fact that has been pretty much proven.
    As far as the boat its self, I have read one complaint at the quality and I did get to see this complaint. It was self imposed. Kinda like breaking that Orvis rod to get a new one idea.
    I read maybe a hand full of people that have actually owned a NFO that have any kind of bitch at all, and those handful still admit they love their boat regardless.
    Steez "20+ people questioning NFO customer service and 0 people defending them in PMs ". Might not have been in pm's, but there was people defending them, you just chose to read what you wanted and to (again) chastise the positive. But you are happy with that choice and may never know the other side of the coin, but it does leave it one sided.
    With no disrespect for anyone, we are all different with different likes and needs. Just good there are different choices to keep us happy. I say HAPPY. I am going fishing.
     
  19. Patrick Allen

    Patrick Allen Active Member

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    I remember when we were just dam happy when the round donut shaped tubes came out and we were all stocked not to have to drag a boat to the water. We are lucky to have so many options and cool boats now. Only in America.
     
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  20. Ed Call

    Ed Call Mumbling Moderator Staff Member

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    We'll, I'm sick of reading the back and forth insults. Civility goes a lot further than name calling and bashing other members. You fun in this thread has just ended.
     
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