RE: Lake Lenore Poachers

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by miyawaki, Jul 28, 2013.

  1. Eric Denny It's summer time I'm fishing!!

    Posts: 664
    Spokane, WA.
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    I like that idea think its the best one yet!!!
  2. freestoneangler Not to be confused with Freestone

    Posts: 4,129
    Edgewood, WA
    Ratings: +791 / 1
    You are sooooo insennnnsitive ;)
  3. Charles Sullivan dreaming through the come down

    Posts: 2,313
    bellingham wa
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    You know what my point is. In fact, you reiterated it. Harsher penalties have limitted effectiveness in preventing most crimes.

    Now there is more than 1 reason we punish crimes. Justice is one reason we do. If you feel that the punishment in this case does not represent justice, I'm not gonna argue. It may feel good to you, the victim, to know that they will recieve a harsher penalty (if that was the case). Making a victim feel better has vaue too. There are other reasons we punish crimes as well.

    I just feel that it's important not to fall into the trap of believing that harsher punishments will deter these sorts of crimes.

    If it were up to me the punishment would be derived by factoring in the cost to society per fish, the cost of enforcement and by taking away the "tools of the trade". I would like to see a harsher penalty as well, but not because I think the harshness of the penalty would play any role in a poachers thought process as to whether to comitt the crime.

    4-4 (10),
    cds
    Richard Olmstead likes this.
  4. bennysbuddy the sultan of swing

    Posts: 2,352
    m-ville
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    These days we assume that everybody is just like US. They're NOT. They may have the same hopes and dreams, but the path to getting there is based on their 'home" culture.

    maybe they should read the rule book,and if they don't like the rules they should go back to where they came from!!! You are only allowed to steal your way to the top if you are CEO everybody else is supose to work for their living thats the American way
  5. bennysbuddy the sultan of swing

    Posts: 2,352
    m-ville
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    "Dead people don't become repeat offenders"..... Now thats insensitive.
    10incher and freestoneangler like this.
  6. 10incher Active Member

    Posts: 210
    Coupeville, Washington
    Ratings: +92 / 0
    The death penalty is probably the ONLY penalty that actually works to decrease occurrence of a crime. I just can't see putting most poachers in "the chair". Most poachers are bait fishing where only artificial lures are allowed and keeping a fish or two illegally. I don't care how much anyone loves the fisheries or the cause, killing someone for killing a fish isn't reasonable. And no amount of ranting or extremism is going to change that fact. Talk about killing people for killing fish gets us nowhere. In fact it's only value is entertainment. And then only if the post is intended to be funny. Any serious considerations of killing anyone that kills a trout illegally is a waste of time.
  7. Alex MacDonald Dr. of Doomology

    Posts: 3,336
    Haus Alpenrosa, Lederhosenland
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    We're discussing crime and punishment, right? And how to deter criminal activity. You might read up on the punishments meted out for poaching, or any other criminal activity from, say, 1200 to 1800, then come back and tell us it's a waste of time. Anyone who thinks rehabilitation is a workable solution to criminal activity is wasting their time. I'll use the example of pirates in the 17th-18th century. Once their activities began to be a problem rather than a nuisance, the fuckers were all hunted down and hanged. There were even two women pirates, one of whom was pregnant. The authorities hanged the non-pregnant one, waited until the other one gave birth, then hanged that bitch too. You'll notice that there are NO more Caribbean pirates. Another case in point: highwaymen in the 1700's in England. Yes, there have always been criminals. Some did escape the law, but most didn't. Highway robbery wasn't common in England, because they hanged the ones they caught. For some insipid reason, the general "consensus" today is that we should try to learn their motivation; understand why they choose to commit crimes. I don't give a rat's ass about the "why". I want scum removed, as in eliminated from the gene pool. I don't want to spend any time or resources "rehabilitating" them. Humans aren't an endangered species, and we can stand to lose a few without dooming the species. And none of the precious little snowflakes currently in the graybar motel are going to discover the cure for cancer, either. Hang them-you can reuse the rope. It's harsh: it's even Draconian, but it works. You can show me NO period in human history where the coddling of criminals resulted in less crime, but I can show you plenty of times where harsh methods resulted in vastly reduced criminal activity. I understand there are some who feel that being hanged for stealing some fish is over the top, and while I'd agree that it's not appropriate for taking a few fish to feed your family, selling hundreds of fish at a time (what the hell else were these Ruskies gonna do with them, eh?) should result in substantially more than a slap on the wrist. Hang one, "pour encourager les autres".
  8. 10incher Active Member

    Posts: 210
    Coupeville, Washington
    Ratings: +92 / 0
    See! That was funny! And to be sure, your not wrong. And I'm not saying that the death penalty for poachers wouldn't be effective. But our "insipid" and criminal "coddling" culture is NEVER going to go there. That's why it's a waste of time. Not because it wouldn't work. Not even because it's a bad idea, but because it WILL NEVER HAPPEN. So ranting about it offers nothing... Unless it's funny.
  9. Irafly Active Member

    Posts: 3,678
    Everett, Washington, USA.
    Ratings: +1,090 / 1
    See first post in this thread on page 6: http://washingtonflyfishing.com/forum/index.php?threads/lenore-poachers-get-theirs.88307/page-6
    10incher likes this.
  10. freestoneangler Not to be confused with Freestone

    Posts: 4,129
    Edgewood, WA
    Ratings: +791 / 1
    Anyone want to bet that next years WA Fishing Reg's Pamphlet won't have instructions in Russian? :eek:
  11. Vladimir Steblina Retired Forester...now fishing instead of working

    Posts: 734
    Wenatchee, WA
    Ratings: +240 / 0
    I can't understand the damn thing in English....think Russian will help??

    A new employee transfered into the office a couple of years ago. He just laughed when he saw the Fishing Reg's Pamphlet!! Then he realized it was THE REAL THING and not somebodies idea of a joke.

    Actually he was right on both counts.
    freestoneangler likes this.
  12. shadowcast Member

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    I gotcha. I can agree with that.
  13. 10incher Active Member

    Posts: 210
    Coupeville, Washington
    Ratings: +92 / 0
    English OR Russian, I don't imagine the poachers in the OP even know what the cover of the yearly book looks like!!! Poachers don't care what the rules are. They KNOW there ARE rules. They just do what they want and ignore them. I don't know what the protocol is when a poaching report is called in to the WDFW but there should be at least a little more emphasis put on fast response. As mentioned by Charles, you need to increase the odds of being busted or the penalty is moot. I feel a certain sense of stewardship with regard to fish and their habitat. But there are plenty of unrelated laws that I willingly break because I know I can get away with it and therefor will not be penalized!!! I would be more judicious with my considerations if I thought I might actually be caught.
  14. John Read New Member

    Posts: 29
    Moscow, Id
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    The problem with capital punishment is that it tends to thin out the losers (those who get caught), leaving the smarter to continue. Survival of the fittest at its best.
  15. Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

    Posts: 2,568
    Quesnel, BC
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    That judge is clearly a bait fisherman...
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  16. zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

    Posts: 3,239
    Moses Lake, WA
    Ratings: +1,031 / 1
    I think what we should do with poachers is send them to a 4 hour class on the proper way to fish and behave at lakeside. I believe Bradley Smokers would sponsor this class.
  17. 10incher Active Member

    Posts: 210
    Coupeville, Washington
    Ratings: +92 / 0
    They'd just skip out on the class for a day of poaching and end up with a bench warrant. If/when they're caught up to, the judge will go easy on them because it's just a fishing misdemeanor from a year or two ago.