Recognize This Fly?

Discussion in 'Fly Tying' started by Jeff Dodd, Mar 20, 2013.

  1. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

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    I'm thinking there was a man and wife team in Mount Vernon or Everett, think their name was Roberts. According to Jack Davis of Jacks Sport Shop they would tie up a gross per day and distribute from Everett Northward, they did it 11 months out of the year then take a month off for fly fishing. Back then they were $.20 a piece and finally had to raise the price to a Quarter
     
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  2. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    Well, if they're going to raise their price like that, I'm sure they chased away customers:)
     
  3. Olive bugger

    Olive bugger Active Member

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    I believe it is Gene.
     
  4. FT

    FT Active Member

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    I don't doubt that this couple tied a gross of flies a day because that means they tied 12 dozen between them in a day. It isn't that difficult to tie 6 dozen flies in a day, unless you have a regular 40 hour a week job. And back in the day, there were quite a few folks around the USA that tied flies either full-time or as a side business. Remember that was back before the Umpqua Feather Merchants, etc. started their offshore fly factories which made offshore flies of decent quality available to the market in large quantifies.

    However, it is highly suspect that they would tie a gross per day for 11 months and sell all of them from Everett north. I mean, every 10 days they would have tied 120 dozen flies. Say they took 2 days a week off from tying, that means this 120 dozen would have been 2 weeks production. And since there are 48 weeks in 11 months, this means they would have tied (and sold) 2,880 dozen flies in a year. That is a lot of flies. And back in the day, there weren't all that many fly fishermen from Everett north. Plus, back then, you weren't allowed to fish year round in the low-land lakes and the creeks were only open from June to the end of September.

    To put it in another perspective, it means that if there were 1,000 fly fishermen from Everett north back then, each flisherman would have had to buy 180 dozen flies that this couple tied for them to have tied and sold that many flies. There were other folks also tying flies commercially back then as well.

    I would not be suprised if they sold a fair number of their 2880 dozen flies outside of the area from Everettt north. Like I said, it would have been easy for this couple to tie a gross of flies per day between them. Heck, they could have even each tied a gross per day if they didn't have a 40 hour a week job as well. But having sufficient market from Everett north to sell that many flies back then is a completely different story.
     
  5. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    I get bored tying the same pattern after 1 dozen. That's why I never could get into production tying.

    Plus, mine don't look exactly like clones of the original.

    I knew a guy who was part owner of a fly shop in Newport. He fished a lot with Shewey and showed me how to fish for surf perch... not that I ever caught any. We also scared the hell out of me one day in Newport bay while we were fishing for silver salmon... but that's another story that has to do with Great White sharks.

    Anyway, he tied all the flies for the shop. Bob Borden came up with a new steelhead pattern that used luminescent tubing. John (not Shewey) tied and sold the pattern at the shop. Somehow, Cabela's learned of the pattern and put in an order for 3K dozen of the patterns.

    He tied day and night to fill the order. By the time he was finished, he told me he never wanted to tie another one of the patterns for the rest of his life.

    Fortunately, the pattern never took off so Cabela's never placed another order.

    Nope, no way now how would I ever get into production fly tying.
     
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  6. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

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    You probably know Jack Davis, FT give him a call my muddled mind might be going. :)


    FT Active Member

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    I've been tying flies since age 9. Since I'm now 58, that is 49 years. I've also tied flies commercially 3 times in my life, and as a result, I've tied several million flies. I've also taught about 200 people to tie flies over the years, both in group classes and individual lessons. That said, here are my thoughts:​

    The Norvise is a very high quality vise. Be forewarned though that folks either love it or hate it. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground with it. Therefore, I suggest you tie some flies on it (like is a dozen or more) to see if you really like it, or not. If the answer is I'm not sure, be very careful about buying one for yourself. If however, you really, and I mean really as in "I can't believe I never used one before", like it, buy it because you'll love it. Otherwise, pass on it.​

    The Regal you mentioned is another great vise. If you don't really need a good rotary vise, it is an excellent choice that you will be very happy with. If you really need or want the rotary function of a rotary vise, a different vise than this Regal would be a better choice.​

    Griffin makes several excellent rorary vises and all of them sell for less than $200.00. All of the Griffin rotary vises hold hooks with a vengence, hold up extremely well, are well-made, and will last the average tyer a lifetime. Plus, replacement parts are readily available at very reasonable prices.​

    If you wish to have a true high end vise, Renzetti has the P2000, a super value at under $300.00, the P4000, more expensive than the P2000, but they have the same jaw system, and the Master Vise, one of the most expensive vises on the market at over $600.00. The Renzetti Traveler is a decent, lower-cost rotary vise, but it isn't any better than the Griffin rotary vises, and it costs more. It's jaws (meaning the Traveler only) also don't hold up as well as the Griffin's jaws.​

    The Peak vise is another rotary worth looking at. It is a great value, so don't let its lower price fool you into thinking it isn't any good.​

    Dyna King makes my favorite vise, the Baracuda. They also make the Baracuda, Jr. These are among the best vises in the world with prices about the same as a Norvise or the Renzetti P4000.​

    The Nor vise, which I've already spoken about. Terrific vise if you like it after tying on it, otherwise, it is no more than an expensive boat anchor if you don't. Sorry about being so blunt, but this is the only vise I've found in all the years I've been tying that has that love-it or hate-it reaction with no middle ground from tyers.​

    HMH is another high quality vise that many folks love.​


    That works out to over 760 flies per day for 60 years If I did the math right ;)
     
  7. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

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    And that was at 2 million, several million My fingers would be bleeding , gotta love internet crap, I'm a French Model ;)
     
  8. Daryle Holmstrom

    Daryle Holmstrom retiredfishak

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    Would love to see a fly tied by FT, doesn't seem to be any in the gallery and some student flies
     
  9. FT

    FT Active Member

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    Daryle,

    Normally I just ignore post like these last two of yours, but your math is not correct.

    3,000,000 flies/30 yrs works out to 100,000 flies per year (3,000,000 flies/30 yrs=100,000 flies/year). This works out to less than 1,000 dozen flies per year since 1,000 dozen=120,000 flies. In other words, 1,000 dozen flies per year is not difficult to do at all.

    If you tie 300 days/yr, this works out to 3.3 dozen flies per day (1,000 dozen/300 days=3.3 dozen per day). And even pretty pedestrian tyers can manage to tie 3.3 dozen in a day. And if you tie 150 days/year, it works out to 6.6 dozen flies per day (1,000 dozen/150 days=6.6 dozen per day). And this is also well withing the realm of the average fly tyer.

    There is a reason I don't have any fies I've tied in the gallery, I don't need to "prove" my tying ability by posting flies in the gallery.

    I've been an invited demonstration tyer at shows and fly fishing fairs. I've been a featured tyer at the old Ed Rice Sportsman's Shows that were held in the Kingdome. I was invited last year to be a tyer at the FFF International Fly Fishing Fair (unfortunately, I couldn't make it). I was invite this year to be a tyer at the Eastern Idaho Fly Fishing Fair in Lewiston (unfortunately, it was held in March my job prevented me from being able to go over to it). I've had flies put in silent auctions at the FFF International Fly Fishing Fair. I've written a chapter on flies for a book on steelhead fishing in the Salmon River of Idaho (unfortunately, Frank Amato decided not to publish the book because he felt Tom's book wouldn't have the market the book on the Clearwater and Grande Rhonde (called Nez Perce something other) that Amato published at the same time. I've been mentioned in the old SALMON FLYER) magazine which was devoted to classic salmon flies. I've also been personally asked by Frank Johnson to become part of the FFF Fly Tyers Group (I just need to get the stuff on my bio, fly styles I tie and am willing to teach, tying class outlines, and what I'd charge for a class to him).

    And since you tried very hard to impune me, my tying skills, and my reputation, I'm justified in asking you these three things: 1) How many of these things have you done or been invited to do? 2) How many years did you tie commercially? and 3) How many people have you taught how to tie flies from beginners to classic married wing salmon flies? I've done all three of these. How about you?
     
  10. Jeff Dodd

    Jeff Dodd Active Member

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    FT and Daryle
    You two are both long time members of this forum and have contributed plenty to this web community of fly fisherman. However, whatever discussion you have going on here is way off topic.

    I did buy this fly in Everett, but it was just a few years ago and I could probably buy more tomorrow. Doesn't sound like the married couple tied my fly.
     

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