Skagit to Skagit

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by _WW_, Feb 2, 2008.

  1. Anyone think that a Fishing Education Course requirement would be helpful least in curtailing the sportfishing impact by:
    1. Teaching people what the regs are and how to read them. ( I can personnally attenst to the education I have received from this forum alone as far as understanding some of the regs)

    2. Educating people in how there actions impact various fisheries (i.e using barbed hooks, or how to safely release fish, etc)

    3. Bringing to the forefront the current state of our fisheries and what has been impacting them.

    As far as a course, I am refering to the same as the hunting Safety course that is required prior to getting a hunting licence. Although it is more firearm safety geared, I am sure it provides first time hunters with some new info to consider while hunting. Anyone think a fishing eduction would be benificial, or would have an impact?
  2. Just a FYI -
    Sounds like proposed regulation change # 41 passed -see

    We'll probably will not know for sure whether there was a last minute "tweak" to the proposal (I did not hear of any on Saturday at the Commission meeting).

    At various meetings WDFW staff thought that in areas that were to be managed as proposed under # 41 there would not be any hatchery fish. I see option of the proposal as a major step towards wild fish management on an ecosystem scale.

    Looks as if we own a big thank you to FT!

    Tight lines
  3. Curt,

    This is good news in my opinion. But I thought you had made the same or very similar proposal too. In fact, I got the idea for the making all three proposals from you 2 years ago instead of just limiting it to the Sauk, but didn't propose them at that time because of the huge outcry the statewise C&R on wildsteelhead was producing. You rightfully took me to task for not doing so then, so this time (as I told you then) I wasn't going to let it pass without submitting the proposal.

    Thanks for you help with it as well.
  4. Todd,

    I know that having a no fishing allowed from a boat (or other floating device) on the Sauk would get many folks angry, just like many got angry in Montana when it banned fishing from a boat (or other floating device) on the Madison. People adapted pretty quickly there and I see no reason they wouldn't adapt here as well. Many of us have experience someone in a boat on the Sauk coming down, parking opposite us in the boat, and casting into the same water we are fishing. Very maddening to say the least. A no fishing from boats rule would put and end to this dispicable practice.

    I'm also away that if the no fishing while under power were enforced on the Skagit, it would get a lot of folks (especially locals) mad because they like using the boat's motor for backtrolling instead of doing the work themselves with oars. And like I said previously, I have no problem with fishing from boats on the Skagit, just not under power while fishing. I'd also like to see no fishing while under power enforced on the Sky.
  5. "Many of us have experience someone in a boat on the Sauk coming down, parking opposite us in the boat, and casting into the same water we are fishing. Very maddening to say the least. A no fishing from boats rule would put and end to this dispicable practice."

    Need I even point out that this is a blatantly anti-anything that's not flyfishing reason to do this?

    I promise you that for every boat that has anchored on your water, I have floated around the corner to see two flyguys standing up to their tits right where the fish would be, were they not standing there...or have them lowhole me or others just as badly as any other type of angler...not to mention the blatant snagging of chums up at Swift Creek, which seems to be predominately practiced by dudes dudded up in $1000 worth of Patagucci...with fly rods.

    Fishing assholes with no respect for other anglers, or their water, show no bias for what type of gear they use...they are out there using everything from $1400 spey rods to $25 UglyStiks...

    For every ridiculous reason to ban boat fishing (like the above), an equally ridiculous reason to ban shore fishing could be made...the answer is not banning legal behavior, it's continuing to educate our fellow anglers on what is proper, and what is not.

    Fish on...

  6. Jbuehler, canadians continue to allow bait on the Thompson of all rivers where the escapement has been down around 1000 fish in recent years. As far as the theory of only being caught one time that sounds a little hokey to me.

    Rayne Rivers, your logic is fundementally flawed. Yes if there were not hatchery fish natives would only be able to target wild fish, but it is written no where in the boldt decision that natives are entitled to hatchery produced fish. Additionally they can only harvest 50% of the allowable take. On the skagit the allowable take is extremely low on wild steelhead and consequently the state probably wouldnt let them take many more than they already are.

  7. Huh, things have changed at Swift Creek. Not that many years ago you couldn't find enough room in between the "Ugly Stick" crowd to throw some expensive cloths line out and snag a chummie.

    At any rate I agree with you somewhat Todd, there are assholes out there using all types of gear but from my vantage point there are more tossing mono then PVC.
  9. Yes I know that.

    The Thompson is only one of many rivers in BC that are all manged differently so your point is?

    As far as bait is concerned, the thoery goes that steelhead will hit bait over and over until they are pretty much worthless; probably because they are trying to feed and get energy back. This isn't the case with flies because they have no scent among other reasons; steelhead get picky and pass them up, who knows why exactly but flies certainly aren't "bait".

    I can believe it would be damn hard for an exhausted steelhead to pass up a sandshrimp bouncing along the river bottom and if it bites it will be even more tired.
  10. not being able to fish from any floating device on oregon's deschutes r. is accepted by everyone, no problem. what it does is provides scantuary areas for fish as not every nook and cranny can be reached by the wade fisherman. great idea that should be commonly adopted.

    rule #41?? where is that posted in its full text version?
  11. We could also propose a rule change that would require only flies where the bottom portion of the hook is removed so that the fish could not be hooked.

    This was you get the thrill of the bite, but no fish is harmed with the subsequent fight.
  12. Is that supposed to be funny?

    I haven't been hearing ludicrous ideas being passed around in this thread so I don't get who or whom you are aiming your sarcasm at.
  14. Who said anything about sarcasm?

    It is ever bit a valid response as banning wading, fishing from boats, closing hatcheries, and most other suggestions that has been made here.

    The benefits of this would include:

    • Providing the fish the necessary protection they require,
    • Continue to allow people to fish and enjoy the outdoors,
    • Allow the fish and game to still collect revenue from license sales,
    • Increase the total number of wild fish,
    • Eliminate the commercial vs. sport harvest quotas which are argued every year, and
    • allow for the closures of fish hateries

    Why would you think I am being sarcastic when there are so many positive outcomes of this proposal?
  15. Okay great. You are SOOO right. Awesome man! :thumb:

    I guess banning bait is as ludicrous as making hookless hooks mandatory! We sure have a lot of people with too much free time around here.....

    I can't believe I have to defend the idea that banning bait will help save wild fish.

    ADDED LATER : PT, I never said it couldn't happen. I have heard of people catching the same steelhead on a fly repeatedly. However, many people have told me that with bait, repeat catches are MUCH more common. This was told to me from bait guys who have had to stop fishing a hole because they were worried about the vitality of the fish they were absolutely hammering over and over. Plus, with bait, the hooks tend to grab deeper in the mouth, causing far more damage than a fly usually does. But still, I never said you couldn't mortally wound a steelhead with a fly (I guess I have to cover EVERY conceievable angle when I post these days).
  16. Bait bans in specific fisheries make perfect sense. Bait bans in all steelhead fisheries seems misguided. I was just pointing out that your remarks regarding bait seem to be based on opinion not fact.

    I know it's a passionate issue.

    The fishing community is fractured enough. Alienating certain user groups will do nothing to restore wild fish runs, for example, banning folks from fishing from a boat on the Sauk. Personally, I see that as one user group trying to get rules enacted to enhance their particular pursuit while limiting someone else's.

    Again, this is just one person's opinion.

    "We sure have a lot of people with too much free time around here....." 835 posts since July '06?
  17. Banning bait and boat fishing in no way takes away ones ability to fish. I think that is the thing to remember.

    Fishing is still entirely possible with gear. Gear guys can still use the same corkies, lures et cetera, minus the bait/scent.

    "Fly Fishing Only" waters are where I would agree with you though. That type of stuff divides the fishing community BIG TIME.

    As for me having too much free time and my number of posts. I hope, and I admit I am not perfect, but I would hope that the vast majority of my posts were actually constructive in some way and not wasted energy. This is was what I meant by too much free time: net nannies, spelling nannies, joksters, trolls, plain old idiotic rants, worthless posts that get threads off topic, nitpickers, insignificant exception pointer-outers; that is the type of shit I was reffering to as being a waste of time; and people who usually add such stuff when they post are wasting theirs and our time in a failing attempt to be "right" whatever the hell "right" may be to them. I laugh at arguments around here where guys are trying to be "right", I am mostly here to help and learn from guys like Salmo G and Smalma. If it weren't for them, I would have stopped coming here long ago.
  18. There, I fixed it for ya'.;):clown:
  19. Each river system should have reasonable rules in effect so that the resource is not being exploited. That is a given IMHO.

    But, I don't see it as your responsibility or mine to dictate how other people should be allowed to fish. And don't take that as me saying that snagging, flossing, etc. is ok. I do believe in selective fisheries, certain rivers not being fished from a boat, power boats not used in certain rivers, etc. Reasonable regulations.

    The more "exclusive" we get with our regs the more divisive the fishing community becomes.
  20. I agree with you 100%.

    I still think that banning bait doesn't change up peoples fishing methods that much and this does help protect the fish.

    This is especially the case with a C&R fishery. I think it is idiotic to have bait fishing allowed in a C&R fishery and a C&R fishery will be what we have (hopefully) if they close all the hatcheries on the Skagit.

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