Steelhead outlook

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by papafsh, Nov 30, 2005.

  1. papafsh

    papafsh Piscatorial predilection

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2002
    Messages:
    2,243
    Media:
    197
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Camano Island, WA, USA.
    Home Page:
    Saw an interesting story in the Seattle Times-On Line edition about the projected Steelhead returns for this year. Can't get it to copy right, or would post it.

    If someone could look it up and copy here, others might think it interesting also.

    LB
     
  2. Almost Dun

    Almost Dun New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Kent, WA, USA.
    Fishing Notes: Olympic coast offers good winter steelhead fishing
    By Mark Yuasa
    Seattle Times staff reporter

    While turkey dinners are the hot topic today, many anglers are deciding where to go winter steelhead fishing.
    The northern and southern Olympic coast will offer the best opportunities.
    "The Quillayute river system is looking really good, and it will provide plenty of opportunity for wild and hatchery fish," said Bill Freymond, a state Fish and Wildlife biologist.
    The hottest river tends to be the Bogachiel, but anglers shouldn't overlook the Calawah and Soleduck.
    "The Hoh is not going to be a bright spot," Freymond said. "We will have about 600 harvestable fish, and we're probably going to have to do something to restrict fishing because we haven't made escapement for three years in a row."
    The predicted Hoh run size is 3,000 winter steelhead with an escapement goal of 2,400 fish.
    On the southern coast, winter steelhead run sizes look fairly good.
    "I think we'll be OK in the Queets," Freymond said. "Since it has such a restrictive fishery, we'll be able to harvest a run of just over 6,000 fish."
    State and tribal fish managers are still working out winter run sizes for the Chehalis and Humptulips river systems.
    "It looks like there will be some surplus of wild fish in both, but we haven't harvested wild fish in the sport fishery for those rivers in several years," Freymond said. "We'll have to sit down and figure out what to do in those systems."
    Closer to the Puget Sound region, most rivers aren't expected to meet winter wild steelhead spawning escapement goals, and hatchery runs are predicted to be ordinary.
    "The unfortunate thing is we don't have tons of hatchery fish in all Puget Sound rivers, and wild fish are under-escaped everywhere except the Skagit," said Bob Leland, a state Fish and Wildlife biologist. "The Skagit catch-and-release wild steelhead fishery will happen again this year."
    The Skagit expects a return of 1,300 hatchery and 6,600 wild fish. The Stillaguamish is predicted to get 2,100 hatchery and 643 wild fish, with a 1,800-wild-fish spawning escapement goal.
    Despite the Snohomish system being stocked with 437,792 hatchery steelhead smolts, only 6,500 hatchery and 2,300 wild fish are forecasted to return. This means slightly more than 1 percent of the hatchery fish will be returning this season.
    In South Sound, the picture doesn't look much brighter.
    The Green River should get 650 hatchery and 1,700 wild fish, with a 2,000-wild-fish escapement goal. The Puyallup is predicted to see 182 hatchery and 635 wild fish, with a 2,000-wild-fish escapement goal.
    In southwest Washington, the once promising Cowlitz River won't see a very good return of hatchery steelhead this season and should be considered just a fair run. The better bets will be the Kalama, Grays, Willapa, Elochoman, Washougal and Lewis rivers.
     
  3. Stonefish

    Stonefish Triploid, Humpy & Seaplane Hater

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2003
    Messages:
    3,863
    Media:
    189
    Likes Received:
    1,258
    Location:
    Pipers Creek
    I would bet there may have some type of closure on the Hoh this year. That won't stop the netting and will increase the pressure on the other OP rivers.

    As far as the Chehalis system goes, you can tell by the biologists statement that the state would like to open it up to a native kill fishery. The Chehalis system was netted five days a week last year. The tribal quote was meet nearly two months before they stopped netting. The state needs to do a better job of monitoring in-season catch rates for both tribal and sport catches. How they would do it I'm not sure, but to continue fishing once a quote has been met is bad news for the fish. The season should stop once the quota is met, no matter how long the pre-season netting schedule is.
    Bad news all around for wild steelhead.
    Brian
     
  4. papafsh

    papafsh Piscatorial predilection

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2002
    Messages:
    2,243
    Media:
    197
    Likes Received:
    67
    Location:
    Camano Island, WA, USA.
    Home Page:
    Thanks Brian,

    The article speaks for it's self...(if it's to be believed)...as to the quality of fish management...:mad:


    LB
     
  5. Piscivorous

    Piscivorous New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    46
    Media:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    could someone point me to numbers of wild and hatchery steelhead for north sound rivers for the last two seasons. Also, can anyone tell me why the cascade hatchery is putting out only 1,300 steelhead this year?
     
  6. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Messages:
    22,422
    Media:
    29
    Likes Received:
    1,940
    Location:
    In a comfortable chair
    Go to the WDFW page and look up fishing and then steelhead plants.

    Jim
     
  7. DaMurph

    DaMurph Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2004
    Messages:
    115
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Graham, WA
    The Cascase may only put out 1300 fish but look at other sites on the Skagit. The total for the system is far more.
     
  8. ncitrez

    ncitrez Too many hobbies.....

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2003
    Messages:
    350
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Gig Harbor, Washington, USA.
    I try to take these "forecasts" with a grain of salt. I still don't fully understand how they come up with these projections, but it's obvious that our steelhead are hurting right now in a lot of areas. Only 1% return on the Snohomish system, and only 643 wild fish returning on the Stilly - that's pitiful. Close to home, the Puke-allup doesn't look good either.

    Worst of all, the glorious Hoh is only 600 wild fish above the so-called "escapement" goal - assuming the crystal ball used to estimate the return wasn't too dirty when they looked at it. It's been below escapement for the past few years, but it's still treated as a "harvest opportunity". :beathead:
     
  9. Zen Piscator

    Zen Piscator Supporting wild steelhead, gravel to gravel.

    Joined:
    May 7, 2004
    Messages:
    3,076
    Media:
    551
    Likes Received:
    13
    Location:
    Missoula, MT
    Home Page:
    I serously can't beleive that. We get more summer steelhead in the walla walla river system than the Hoh does winter steelhead. Thats amazing...and discusting. The state of salmonid fisheries in western washington is appualing in my opinion.

    Peace,
    Andy
     
  10. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2004
    Messages:
    7,826
    Media:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1,897
    Location:
    Your City ,State
    Picivorous,

    The Cascade, as part of the Skagit system, release from 300,000 to over 400,000 winter steelhead smolts per year. Unfortunately, the Skagit hatchery steelhead have one of the lowest smolt to adult survival rates in Puget Sound. I don't know why. The 1,300 forecast is for returning adult steelhead, which is about the lowest I can recall. I remember some projected hatchery returns down around 4,000, but never 1,300 before. Maybe Smalma has more info. Perhaps a lot of juveniles were lost to disease or hatchery accident or something. Those things do happen.

    Sincerely,

    Salmo g.
     
  11. Smalma

    Smalma Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    865
    Location:
    Marysville, Washington
    Here is a link to the smolt plants that will be contributing to this years two-salt returns.

    http://wdfw.wa.gov/fish/harvest/04-05/smolts.htm

    Salmo G. was correct in that the Skagit hatchery steelhead survive at low levels. Several factors likely contribute -

    Through out Puget Sound the best survivals are found in the Snohomish basin as one moves either north or south of that basin the survival rates of the hatchery (maybe even the wild fish) drops pretty sharply.

    Many of the smolts are released further upstream on the Skagit than what is typcial for many of the Puget Sound streams. There are indications that the farther hatchery smolts travel on their out the lower their survival. More predation?

    The hatchry return rates used in the pre-season modeling on the Skagit are likely artificially low. There are decent estimates of hatchery returns to the hatchery, to the tribal fishery and the sport fisheries. However there are not good estimates of how many fish are uncaught that don't return to the hatchery. Because of the heavy and fluctuately flows of the main stem Skagit I have long thought that the recreational fishery doesn't access the fish nearly as well as they do on say the Snohomish. This especially true when looked at over a longer time period where some years because of the prolong releases of stored flood waters there are significant stretches of time during the peak of the hatchery returns that the main river is marginally fishable -this is especially true below the Baker.

    Tight lines
    Curt
     
  12. Les Johnson

    Les Johnson Les Johnson

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2003
    Messages:
    1,590
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    .Redmond, WA
    Remember that the Hoh River was one of the remaining 16 healthy rivers (according to WDFW) just a year or so ago; down from the original 125+ rivers in Washington? So, now it must be 15. I wonder how healthy the remaining 15 are? This is really disgusting, particularly when the tribes continue to net the Hoh straight into oblivion. Closure of the Hoh should be done nowl; probably some of the other 15 as well.
    Good Fishing,
    Les Johnson
     
  13. Piscivorous

    Piscivorous New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2005
    Messages:
    46
    Media:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Since (H)arvest is likely the most important factor explaining the decline of steelhead escapement on the Hoh, I cannot help but wonder how last year's reduction in Steelhead harvest opportunity (From 5/yr to 1/yr) for sportfishers will impact future steelhead returns on the Hoh. Was there a net reduction in the number of steelhead harvested last year on the Hoh because of the reg. change (assuming the number of sportfishers didn't change from years past) or did the Hoh Tribe harvest what us sportfishers sacrificed? How does this scenario compare to the other rivers where wild steelhead retention is permitted and tribal netting takes place?
     
  14. john wells

    john wells New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    36
    Media:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    la conner wa
    does anyone know if any numbers of hatchery fish are released above the cascade? obviosly I understand that these fish could only be taken out the system by recreational means being above the hatchery but those planted below would seem too fall into the same catagory. As too mixing with the wild stocks are ther returning stocks above the sauk [mmn I ponder ] living down on the lower river I daily see the condition of the main stem, this last summers salmon runs are a perfect example of flows and color below the baker eliminating oppurtunity to target skagit fish with flies
    just a thought and a question
    john
     
  15. KerryS

    KerryS Ignored Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2001
    Messages:
    6,900
    Media:
    8
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    1,938
    Location:
    Sedro Woolley, WA, USA.
    The reason the Skagit is above escapement is they keep lowering the escapement levels. It has been several years since the last time they lowered them but I think that if the number of fish returning falls below the current escapement levels they will just lower them again.
     
  16. Stonefish

    Stonefish Triploid, Humpy & Seaplane Hater

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2003
    Messages:
    3,863
    Media:
    189
    Likes Received:
    1,258
    Location:
    Pipers Creek
    Piscivorous,
    Last year 79 wild steelhead were harvested out of the Hoh based on WDFW creel surveys. Four of those fish were kept illegally in C & R waters. Over 600 wild fish were released by anglers. The total number of anglers surveyed was over 2,800.
    The previous year 262 wild fish were kept and over 600 released based on creel surveys of over 2,700 anglers.
    It looks like angling pressure was about the same. The number of wild fish kept was reduced but the number of fished released was nearly the same. Also remember that creel surveys don't always count every angler or fish taken on a given river.

    I still don't like the fact that this state allows folks to keep wild steelhead. They caved in to pressure when they overturned their decision on state wide C & R for wild steelhead. If the Hoh is closed this year, you can bet the Hoh tribe won't reduce their netting schedule.
    The state also needs do a better job of monitoring in season catch rates. They need to work with the tribes to schedules net fisheries based on quotas, not seasons. Last year the Quinault tribe reached their quota nearly two months early on the Chehalis, yet continued to fish do to the fact they had a season netting schedule in place.
    Based on the way things are headed, the future of wild steelies in Washington doesn't look real bright.
    Brian
     
  17. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2002
    Messages:
    22,422
    Media:
    29
    Likes Received:
    1,940
    Location:
    In a comfortable chair
    This thing about closeing rivers to fishermen on the OP. When they closed down the Wenatchee,Chiwawa,Entiat,Nason creek,and numerous rivers and creeks. Those people over there didn't complain and they didn't lose anything that I heard of. But they left it open for Whitefish, which is something I don't understand. Those fish over there will hit whitefish flies.

    Just had to add this and get it off my chest.


    Jim
     
  18. Smalma

    Smalma Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    865
    Location:
    Marysville, Washington
    Must be December - steelhead seem to be on lots of folk's minds.

    John -
    Currently there are no hatchery steelhead planted above the Cascade River.

    Stonefish -
    I could not agree that more that inseason steelhead monitoring would be very desirable however that is very expensive information to get.

    Do you have any ideas for money sources or other programs that should be reduced to pay for the creel census?

    Fishing on quotas are not with problems. Immediately following the Boldt decision managing on quotas. The 1976/77 winter season provided a clear indication of the potential issues with quotas. The pre-seaon numbers were generated using the recent catches and a quota was established for both the tribal and sport fishery (there was a creel census in place so that in-season info was available for the managers). By late December the tribal fishery had caught its "quota" and was closed. By Janaury 9th the sport fishery had also caught its "quota" and the harvest fishery was closed though a CnR fishery was allowed to continued - for many the first time sport anglers had a chance to fish such a fishery though effort was very low (not many interested in that type of fishing then).

    In this case the actual run size wasin roughly twice the pre-season forecast and many hatchery fish were left uncaught to spawn in the wild. The black lash from the fishers quickly lead to developing alternate management approaches. As I have mentioned before most management approaches have some risks and what one is comfortable with is a risk management question.

    Tight lines
    Curt
     
  19. inland

    inland Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2003
    Messages:
    605
    Likes Received:
    60
    Location:
    .
    Curt,

    Since the Green is listed at making 80% of the target (unless the 1700 is a typo), is it going to be open for the C&R season?

    William
     
  20. Smalma

    Smalma Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,942
    Likes Received:
    865
    Location:
    Marysville, Washington
    William -
    There hasn't been CnR seasons in the past on the Green (King County) so would not expect one this season.

    Tight lines
    Curt
     

Share This Page