Steelhead reports

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by sinktip, Feb 10, 2003.

  1. troutpocket

    troutpocket Active Member

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    Dear Sinktip-

    I follow the postings of this site quite regularly, however I rarely reply to what I consider "issues" or "political" posts and prefer to concentrate on what this site has become a major tool for - planning my fishing trips. In this case, I am feeling the barb of your sarcasm and am compelled to respond.

    Though I have fished all my life, I 'discovered' steelheading quite recently, I guess my first outings devoted to pursuing steelhead have been in the past year. I am certainly one of the new faces on the river you seem to take issue with and I take your remarks personally.

    I took part in a steelhead school over the weekend. It was one of the most enjoyable days I have spent on the river. Sharing time and comparing notes with a few others whos skill ranged from 'never cast a fly' to 'taking this trip because I like the guide and want to rediscover the fundamentals' was just great. It certainly wasn't a party and we passed up several (occupied) holes without stopping due to the volume of traffic on the river. Our fishing success consisted of one hooked steelhead and one dollie brought to hand for 6 fishermen.

    My point: fly fishers who are willing to accept such a catch rate are likely going to share a lot of your ideals. Take heart that the new generation is just as enamored with the fish and the environment that supports it as those who have been at it for decades. Maybe you have had personal experience with some new faces that 'haven't figured it out yet' . . .well someone has to give 'em a hint. Make the effort to speak face to face. I'd respect that a lot more than a mean-spirited online rant.

    Steelheading will thin its own ranks . . .it seems to be the 'new in thing' for fly fishers but there just aren't that many people who will devote the effort to be successful.

    See you out there.

    Rod
     
  2. Nailknot

    Nailknot Active Member

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    I guess I was confused about exactly where your anger was directed Sinktip. If it was at the internet generally, my only advice to you is: make peace with it, because it ain't goin anywhere. I'm sure many folks were angry at the pictures on the bait fridge door back in the day, but it didn't ruin fishing now did it? Only ruined the day for those who couldn't move past it. Same with the magazines, same with the grapevine, same with the damn Rockport Store fer christsakes. You've been fishing for a long time. You should know better.

    I assumed your enemy was this "new and lazy breed" of steelheaders. If it is, I stand by my statement that the enemy is in your head. Maybe you're not connecting with new steelheaders that offer character you admire, or maybe you are, but can't get past the internet thing. Either way, I assure you there are many newbies practicing the path you admire. I hope you are fortunate enough to meet them.

    >>"Where I personlly take exception is the "we fished this run and used this fly and the fish hit 2/3 of the way through the swing behind that boulder and I had 12 pound Maxima and the frigging Smoozley line system that Joe Blow sold me and my 22 buddies and I all got our picture taken with it. By the way, this steelheading thing sure is fun and easy, hope to see you all out at the run next time.">>

    There's a lot of baggage in this line, but for the sake of argument, can you point me to a post like this? If it's happened on this board, I haven't seen it. If you're going to indict large groups of people with perceived "stoopid practices" at least provide some specific cases. You're not going to win friends and influence people with such high and mighty talk, at least on the internet. As one who hasn't committed any of these "crimes against steelheading" (at least the ones you identified here-- i.e. no steelhead school, no location/hole posts, and no river parties) I don't take your post personally. But sheesh, your first two posts sure came off as self righteous and pompous BS.
     
  3. Coho

    Coho Member

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    Steelhead reports - The Dozen Top Secret Hot Spot...

    Hi Sinktip:

    I have been flyfishing for steelhead for a little over 20 years, and yes I have been a little frustrated just like you.

    Hang in there - you'll catch fish. To speed the process along for you, I will share all... perhaps just in defiance of those on the board who are more selfish with their closely held information.



    My Top Dozen Steelheading flyfishing hotspots: :thumb
    ----------------------------------------------------------

    These rivers and specific drifts have produced many many steelhead for me and a select few friends. They are relatively unknown so share this information sparingly and with discretion:


    1. My number one secret spot has been consistent summer, fall and winter. You want to fish this little jewel in the upper stretches just above the town of

    (Hold on - my phone is ringing. I'll finish this post in a few minutes...)









    Hope you will have a fishing experience like the one in Luke Chapter 5:6-11 ! :)
     
  4. Matt Burke

    Matt Burke Active Member

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    Wow, this post sure got busy

    I don't know but a couple names along the Sky; Monroe, Sultan, Goldbar and Two-bit. But through my own exploring, I have found 20 or so spots to access from the bank. I wouldn't know Buck island from Camano Island and I was born here in 1960. I just like to fish it knowing I'll hit after X number of hours. I feel the same about the other north sound rivers and know them pretty well too. If you fish with me, I'll show you what I know. After that, you're on your own, as it should be. I can't cast the line for you, you'll have to do the work. Anyway, I thought this started out on a funny note, but now it's too many words and not enough fishing. I'll be on the Sky tomorrow morning. Don't ask where, I don't know the name of it. Good luck you guys and take it easy, would ya.

    Matt

    "Everyday that you wake up and decide not to go fishing...is one less day you'll go fishing." Forrest Maxwell
     
  5. skater

    skater New Member

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    I am with you 100%. There is some kind of sanctity in steelheading that is lost in this report to the masses crap. Still I like the sharing of fly paterns and casting. But I beg of you to leave the water to be discovered by others. "Don't ask and don't tell" :p
     
  6. Dan

    Dan Member

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    I agree with what you are saying. I guess I'm one of those "new breed" of steelheaders you are talking about that is learning about the game on the internet. I lived in Tacoma for 4 years and caught exactly one salmonoid in a river while I lived there. It wasn't because I didn't try. I talked to everyone that I thought knew squat about steelheading, including a brother-in-law that had been successful at it, and it didn't help me connect. I was young, recently married, had a new baby and a tough job. I couldn't afford a guide. I didn't get out very often. I had the wrong gear. I did my best. Twenty years later, I find this website. It points me to a guide that taught me more in a day than I learned in 4 years. I even had some success on my own. Is there something wrong with that? I haven't stood in the rain, or snow or sleet on the Stilly or Skagit year in and year out, but man, I feel like I have paid my dues. If you come to my river and ask me politely for some help, I'll give it to you. I might even share my spot and give you a fly that is working. Thanks to all those on the website that have helped in a similar way in a virtual sense. I read this site every day and I learn something every day. I'm not asking anyone to tell me exactly what hole they caught their fish in, or on what fly. Fish move; water conditions change. If you would just be kind enough to point me in the right direction once in a while, I'll get the rest of it done. And you can bet that I'll return the favor down the line.
     
  7. Marketic

    Marketic New Member

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    I'm a new guy and I appreciate the opportunity to post.
    I have read some of the "steelhead reports" over the last few months and it didn't surprise me to see the recent post submitted by this gentleman named Sinktip. It struck me as a good healthy reaction to what's happening to this "sport".

    Some of these reports are quite hilarious. In fact I felt compelled to copy a "steelhead report" I saw on this very Bulletin Board. I sent it to a friend of mine a few weeks ago so he could share my absolute disbelief and stupefaction that people would submit this type of information to a public forum (with a straight face).

    It was posted by a guy who caught a fish on a local river. The post included every possible detail about his outing (the river, the hole, the fish, the side of the river he was fishing from, the cast he used, the line, the leader, the tippet strength, the fly, the wind (speed and direction). I was waiting breathlessly for him to divulge the brand of oil he used in his SUV to get him to the river and the cut of his underwear he had on which enabled him to walk to the hole in such relative comfort in order to carry out his piscatorial coup. I'm quite sure I could have gotten this information with a quick e-mail if only he'd divulged his address.

    O.K. Just so you can see all the varied facets of this "sport" and how weird some of the players are who participate in it I'll tell you how I play the game. First, I fish regularly. I fish here and I fish there. I probably fish where you do. But here's the deal-- if someone sees me hook a fish then I never got that fish. It's like it never happened. I'm not disappointed. I'm not dejected. I just didn't get a fish because someone saw me. But when I go home that night I'm thinking like this: I didn't walk far enough. I didn't wake up early enough. I didn't hide in the bushes long enough for that boat to leave. Sounds weird, doesn't it?

    Actually, to me it’s love’s sweet song. Because if I get to count that fish I hooked (and I have my moments), it means that I was able to find the solitude I'd been searching for, my little piece of peace on a river, and a fish just happened to be part of the equation and boy, it sure was cool. That's steelheading for me. I had one of those moments yesterday but I confess, my dog saw me release the fish so I'm wondering if I really got it.

    I've been doing this for many years. I learned steelheading by the Braille method. What’s the Braille method? It’s shut up and pay your river dues. The internet is like electronics when it comes to navigating a ship. Radar and GPS are nice to have but you’d better have your sextant and chart handy and know how to use them when the batteries die. It's scary how few people are willing to look at a chart or put a sextant in their hands.

    I've never heard the name of a hole mentioned in relation to a fish caught until I saw this forum. Even the scummiest most egregious puker website over on the OP won't do that. He'll beat your brains with pictures and boast about his roe cure and his pink worm but you'll never hear the name of a hole he caught his fifteen “nates” in last Friday.

    What do we do about this? We need a UN resolution so it won’t happen again. If the French or Germans get in our faces and say the word “Buck Island”, we tie them up and leave them on a nameless gravel bar upstream from Monroe and wait for the next high water.
     
  8. o mykiss

    o mykiss Active Member

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    Jaysus, Mary Mother of God - if I have to read one more post from one of yous "I fish in solitude and never breathe a word of my angling success" hermits, I think I'm going vomit roe and pink worms myself. If folks aren't supposed to post fishing reports, what are they supposed to post? (Oh, I know: "I went fishing. It might have been today, or it might have been yesterday. It might have been somewhere on a river in the State of Washington, but it may have been on a lake, in Puget Sound or even the ocean. I may have been fishing for steelhead, trout, salmon, rockfish, perch, lingcod or great whites. I may have been using my 7 foot bamboo 3 weight or my Sage RPLxi 9 foot 14 weight. If there was anyone around, I didn't catch no fish. If I was reveling in my solitude, I caught a bunch - at least if my dog didn't see me. Even though all y'alls got to pay your river dues, I just thought you'd like to know. Oh, and a most distressing thing happened - I actually saw, from a bush I was hiding behind, a group of fellows fishing together and having a good old time. It was so, so pathetic.")
     
  9. circlespey

    circlespey Member

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    I had seen so many reports of woe on this site (where are the fish, where are the fish, etc.) that I just wanted people to know that a few are around.

    And no, I won't say exactly where I caught it.

    Circlespey
     
  10. BOBLAWLESS

    BOBLAWLESS New Member

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    When there's few or no fish like this season, the boys get restless. It's sort of like no fish on a factory ship: people start to fight, go nuts, jump overboard, fall into depression etc.
    Maybe those with a lot of anger should take up golf? :dunno
     
  11. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

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    I used to know it all---but now that I'm older I seem to forget it all.

    When I read the first post of this thread I thought it was a joke and I went along with it. Boy did it ever get out of hand. I don't think that I have ever heard so many people down this thread. I go fishing to enjoy myself and IF I ever do catch anything I'm going to gloat about it. I have caught a few summer fish but I'm afraid to say where as everybody jumps on you if you open your mouth.:dunno

    Jim
     
  12. pwoens

    pwoens Active Member

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    WOW!!! :beathead :beathead :beathead

    I have put in thousands of hours and thousands of casts just to bring my first steelhead to hand....you better believe im going to have my partner snap a quick pic and with no doubt am I going to post it and gloat about it :thumb. I have worked hard, read every book, posted every question, asked every direction, fished in every condition known to man, and you know how I caught my first steeli ===> only by the advice and kindness of a drift fisherman I met on the water who openly suggested a few things and even pointed me to the correct water....these are the people I respect in this sport....and heck he even used a baitcasted????

    Cant we just go fishing??

    ~Patrick ><>
     
  13. CofO

    CofO New Member

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    Looks like a lot of people are thinking about their actions on the rivers. With so many fly fishermen and women on the rivers steelhead fishing and with limitted runs to fish it is important for all of us to to act with respect for the others who fish the same rivers.

    The two greatest abilities of a good steelheader are instinct and observation, period. The funny thing is all the schools and spey claves in the world can not teach instinct and observation. What you get bottom line with any type of lesson that has a profit somewhere down the line for someone is basic monkey see monkey do. The important factor is to get out and learn on your own or with a good friend. By developing your own personal technique you will in the long run become a better steelheader. If you take all these ideas people are selling you it will be hard to develope instinct and observation. I've yet to meet a great steelheader that went to some type of fly fishing school. They may be out there but I'm not sure where. Can anyone tell me a great steelheader that needed to go to a how too school to become a well respected steelhead fly fishermen?

    Whitey,
    You have the hang of it. Golf balls, good observation you must have been looking for good stucture. Ever notice that the guy who hits the golf balls has a pink poodle, really, there is even a fly named after that pooch.

    Marketic,
    Good to hear your still out there. Last week Pat and Gerry told me you were out and about and hard to find. With steelheading just the way it should be.
     
  14. sinktip

    sinktip Guest

    This has been an interesting post. About 1/3 of the responses agreed with me, 1/3 think I should shut the hell up and sadly enough, 1/3 thought my original sarcastic post was right on and supported its requests.

    Whitey has accused me of starting this to foster debate and he is right on. If these 670+ views and 32 responses have caused anyone to stop and think about the impact they have on both the resource and peoples enjoyment of it, then it has not been in vain.

    I will not waste anyone's time responding to each little barbed response however I would be happy to address these off the board if you desire. If you are curious as to why I said something, drop me a pm or an e-mail.

    There are a couple of points though I want to clear up before I stand back form this thread.

    Gloating: I am not against it and especially not for one's first fish. As I said above, go ahead and gloat, snap a pic and say "look at me, I caught one". Detailed reports including specific location, fly, etc. are not needed.

    Anger at the internet: Not me. I feel the internet is a wonderful medium to foster sense of community, strive for resource conservation, and to teach and educate. While I check in here from time to time to get the pulse of the board and especially the younger crowd, I spend most of my internet time moderating a steelhead forum on another site or maintaining the Wild Steelhead Coalition web site.

    Steelhead Schools: I have read back and I can only find one reference I made about steelhead schools: "(plus I read these boards and find another river to fish whenever there is a sleepover or steelhead school planned)". That was not meant as an attack on schools but there are a number of responses that infer I am school bashing. Truth be known, I have only had an issue with one school and that was one that was held on a small somewhat fragile tributary of an area river. Rather than join the bashing on the internet, I contacted the guide directly and stated my case. He is a class guy and gave me his word that this particular school would not be held in the future. His word is enough for me so case closed.

    One final shot across the bow and then I am out of here. Steelheading with a fly is about the quest. If you want to make it a numbers game, go throw bait as it is in most instances, more effective. It is not up to me, or anyone else on here to dictate how you fish as long as you respect the sport and the resource. You owe that much to not only the fish and yourselves but to the others that share the river with you. And while we are talking respect, let's show some class and get that assinine picture of a sucker being held up by forceps crimped to its tail off this site. I assure you the only message it conveys is ignorance.

    Respectfully,
    sinktip
     
  15. pwoens

    pwoens Active Member

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    #1: I personally would not do what the old man has done, nor do I condone it....however you were a beginner once your self and have done such "assinine" things yourself.

    #2: why do you point fingers at people??? ex: float trip, other post and threads, gloating pictures, ect... ????

    #3: lock this thread or get rid of it as it is only stirring irritation....no good will come of it...no one is going to quit pursuing steelhead because of one individuals comments, nor will less people take part in a gathering next time because of some unintelligent post.

    #4: go fishing with some friends...lots of them!!!

    ~Patrick ><>
     
  16. Nailknot

    Nailknot Active Member

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    The Quest thing has me uneasy Sinktip. This is fishing, not good vs. evil. And fighting evil seems to be your whole point here. Again, the enemy is in your head. If you must "quest" you don't need to create imagined enemies in order to justify your spin on the fishing thing. I know plenty of accomplished and experienced steelheaders with a positive outlook and positive impact on the resource. Ranting on an internet board like some born-again circuit preacher doesn't mix with fishing. At least for me. In other words: It's your tone, not your argument, that is grating on people. I doubt this thread has changed many minds, just made people angry (how they usually react when scolded by peers), and I feel sorry for the few who were indirectly attacked for their past posts. But fishing is far too much fun, to get worked up about this stuff. Agree with Patrick that this thread should be locked-- but not zapped. Should remain to show how this steelheading can drive us crazy. Literally.

    Not to stir up the Bull Trout/Dolly debate (Lawless! :) But here is a nice and mellow paper craft exercise to lower the BP while awaiting the nates' return to the N. Sound. In fact, the whole site is magnificent:

    http://www.itow.com/amago/papercraft/papercraft2.html

    "Where have all the Trouts gone? I can't find them.
    I wonder if fisherman had caught them or they had hidden in bubbles of streams.
    That's a wonder."
     
  17. sinktip

    sinktip Guest

    Thanks Chris. I appreciate that one being pulled. No need to give the "fishing is cruelty" folks any ammo.
     
  18. Chris Scoones

    Chris Scoones Administrator Staff Member

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    Patrick requested it be removed. I hadn't seen it yet, so I'm glad he did.
     
  19. Whitey

    Whitey Active Member

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    Sinktip, That was beautiful! well said. I think some of you guys are taking what he calls "the quest" too literally. My quest involves bushwacking, climing over boulders, enduring the cold, fighting off the wind and rain just so I can find a little piece to myself. Happened this weekend on the NF, I had to bushwack through some nasty brush and climb over some trees just to find a beauty of a hole. I fished the hell out it, rested the water for a few, and attacked again. I came up empty handed, but I had fun, and will try again. That's my quest. :smokin YT
     
  20. Bob Triggs

    Bob Triggs Stop Killing Wild Steelhead!

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    1)Lower Hoh River tidewater
    2)Spey Shrimp, Pink and Claret
    3)Rio Steelhead and Salmon
    tapered leader; 17 lbs test.
    w/ 15 lbs. Maxima tippett.
    4)3:00 pm, Sunday Feb 9th, 2003
    5)Didn't catch diddley....

    But I watched four gear guys catch six wild steelhead in about an hour, using pencil leads and corkies.They stood over a hole like herons.And they killed every one of them. All the fish were over 27", and one was over 37".They were all chrome bright, on their spawning run, and beautiful. Now they are dead.That's part of why we are having some difficulty catching wild steelhead.