"Super trout, mega-trout...

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Roper, Jun 8, 2005.

  1. Roper

    Roper Idiot Savant

    ...monsters, double-digit meat eating bull trout, mega-rainbows, 25 inch trout..."

    Just a few descriptive quotes from a recent article in a "local" fly fishing magazine about a Northwest river. The article goes on to tell how this river is rarely fished for trout. It shows a map of all the "hot spots". It generally gives us the "deep throat" on this fishery.

    Now, how long do you think it will stay that way? Do these authors ever think about what their hype will do in the long run?

    Better rush before the crowd gets there... :hmmm:
  2. Willie Bodger

    Willie Bodger Still, nothing clever to say...

    Sounds like the same article Salt Dog brought up in 'Name that fish...'

  3. alpinetrout

    alpinetrout Banned or Parked

    No, I don't think they do. They're too excited to see their name in print to think about it.
  4. creekx

    creekx spent spinner

    Sincerely, Greg Thomas, Steve Probasco, et al.
  5. Spawned Out Boot

    Spawned Out Boot New Member

    I will make sure to let Steve know how you guys feel. Thanks for all the input.
  6. D3Smartie

    D3Smartie Active Member

    same thing has happened to a lot of hunting areas. Its very sad to see.
  7. Roper

    Roper Idiot Savant

    My apologies, this is the same issue being addressed in the "Name that fish" post...guess I should read 'em all, huh?

  8. Wayne Jordan

    Wayne Jordan Active Member

    I guess in a way this site has the same effect...that's why I very rarely post reports anymore.
  9. ray helaers

    ray helaers New Member

    I want to say something about fishing writers. I've taken money to write about places to go fishing. I have actually made an effort not to piss too many people off. I do not know that I've always been successful at that, but I have actually turned down opportunities, in order to avoid being the guy who gave it up. Most writers I would guess, especially the ones who would like to get paid, don't want to piss everybody off, though it's true enough that some have been more and some have been less successfual than me, and a few guys do rub me the wrong way.

    But the writers aren't the issue. They are just very little cogs in a big machine called the flyfishing industry, a machine that burns rivers for fuel. It needs new and better places to send you and I fishing in order to grow and this is America, free and strong; grow it must. Most of us are part of it to one degree or another. I guess that doesn't excuse the writers but at least I would imagine the people who sell fishing stuff or take people fishing for money or accept sponsorships or get "pro" discounts through their buddies would keep their pieholes shut about it.

    Well, now that's behind us, I'll say the rest of you are probably right; it sucks. I do hate to see an article about how great the fishing is at river x (see, I aim to please). The damned thing shouldn't even be open! There are Endangered steelhead and spring chinook swimming around in there, gettin' between you and your trophy cutthroat.
  10. creekx

    creekx spent spinner

    Good comments, Ray

    Have you ever noticed that it's rarely the locals giving it up? Typically, they know better. That's why its usually a non-local mercenary writing the kiss-and-tell articles and books.

    A writer that lives one-day's drive away from a Montana river takes a couple floats on it and writes a book. Those who fish it regularly forget more about the river than he'll ever know, but he's an expert, I guess.
  11. Kent Lufkin

    Kent Lufkin Remember when you could remember everything?

    Ray's exactly right. While some of us might moan about fishing writers who rat out our favorite water, we're the same ones who get all excited when some manufacturer introduces a new reel or rod. To the extent that we are all consumers of flyfishing goods, information, and experiences, we're all a part of what the industry calls 'the market'.

    The market spends its money on the industry's goods, information and experiences. Thus rewarded, the industry obliges with a never-ending stream of new and improved whiz-bang products; magazine articles that point out the obvious for those who are otherwise oblivious to it; and guides, lodges and outfitters who provide ready-made experiences for those who lack the time or the knowledge to do so on their own.

    It's tempting to think that through our patronage we can subdivide the industry into areas we like and those we don't. Someone has a problem with a magazine that publishes an article that outs his honey hole. But at the same time he waxes euphoric about how great some manufacturer's reels are and how that's what everyone should buy. Even though he may choose not to buy the magazine in the future, a portion of every dollar he spent/spends on those reels goes in the form of advertising to the very magazine he's decided to boycott.

    There's no getting off the flyfishing merry go round until you actually put your rods down for good. Otherwise, every cent you spend on something flyfishing related makes you a part of the market and thus fair game for everyone in the industry who's got something to sell. The only questions then is, how many of the industry's pitches are you going to fall for?

  12. chadk

    chadk Be the guide...

    Is this an issue of someone blabbing about a zipper lip or honey hole? Is this an issue of marketing and fly fishing industry ethics?

    I thought it was about irresponsible sensationalizing regarding a sensitive fishery that many feel should be shut down due to endangered species.
  13. Greg Thomas=Giant Hack
  14. Michael Brady

    Michael Brady New Member

    I would say revealing information about good fishing on any river is a good thing. If the fishing is good, it will raise awareness, and in turn raise its protection.
    People will pay attention to whats going on in the watershed, mainly deforestation and human developments. Most fisheries are not endangered because of over fishing by sport fishers. They are endangered because of over fishing from industrial fishing, pollution, and manmade obstructions (dams, tunnels, etc). The only way to raise protection, is first through public awareness...I dunno
  15. Griswald

    Griswald a.k.a. Griswald

    You know, I agree with Ray and Kent...

    It is funny I often find I get sucked up by the marketing machine of our sport. Bigger, Better, faster, more...

    I sometimes forget why I fish...It is to relax and enjoy the bounty of nature's beauty and gifts. The fishing for me is about the experience of memories...Will I remember that day on the Missouri in 1999 what kind of rod I fished with or that I caught 40+ fish over 18 inches? Hell I can't even remember the guides name (He was good BTW) But I remember the sky, the water, the fish...

    I think that all of us have a responsibility as anglers to be stewards for the fish, and the rivers and lakes, and sea...Yes it is being sold out day in and day out, but ultimately the way WE treat the resource and how we support it through our $$$ expenditures CAN have a positive impact.

    Look at C & R. When I worked for Orvis in the late 80's in Lexington, KY NOBODY there was into C & R... Now it is the norm...even for warm water species.

    My point is that yes, the great spots will continue to be exposed and/or sold out, but it is how we consistantly, collectively treat the resource, regardless of the information that will help decide what happens to it...

    Ok, going to bed now....

    M. Grunwald
    a.k.a. Griswald
  16. Nooksack Mac

    Nooksack Mac Active Member

    I'm confused. If we're not supposed to go back to the secret hotspot that a friend took or directed us to (because that would be violating a confidence), if we're not supposed to use the recommendations of fishing articles and books (because in your perfect world, nobody would write such things), and if we're not supposed to drive around and explore at random (because that would be wasting expensive and air-polluting gasoline)... then how are we to know where to go fishing?
  17. Wayne Kohan

    Wayne Kohan fish-ician

    I think there are a couple of issues here. First off, I agree there needs to be articles and postings about where to fish so we can all learn of new and different places. Most reports on this site are about well known places, such as Lenice and Dry Falls and the Yakima. I like to read those reports, mostly for enjoyment and for future reference. If people post a report saying they caught 50 gazillion fish in two hours of spectacular fishing, I certainly don't believe that will happen to me if I grab my rod and head out the door to that place immediately. Articles such as fishing the lower Yakima for smallmouth opens new water for flyfishers and reminds us of the other possibilities for fishng out there.

    The article in question seemed to raise several ethical issues as well documented in the previous post. By the way I spent a few days in Winthrop last summer, and I found the fishing slow though that was not the purpose of my trip and so I didn't spend a lot of time on the water. I also didn't use the tactics suggested by the author. However, there weren't fish everywhere.

    I think this site does a good job of giving out details during reports without being too specific about our "honey holes." Members seem to be sensitive to such things. I have found members willing to share more info about places either by using the PM feature on this site, or by taking others to their places. (I still need to hook up with Zen to see where he goes all the time!)

  18. Roper

    Roper Idiot Savant

    Let me share this in a effort to refocus my statement. It's about HYPE! BULLSHIT! EXAGGERATION! SUPER! MEGA! ETC....!

    I'm not saying it's a bad thing to report on a fishery, but keep it real.

    Those of you that have fished the Methow, didja catch any monsters of 20 to 25 inches? Did that mega-trout spool you and generally kick your ass? Or did you catch trout in the same general size as say, the Yakima?

    Think about it while I go wax poetically about Ross Reels... :clown:
  19. Ken Hunter

    Ken Hunter Member

    You know that river is hardly a secret. The fish are not that easy to catch. It will attract the one time fisherman. After a good long drive, an expensive room and meal at Sun Mountain Lodge, and a good skunking, that will be it.
  20. jackchinook

    jackchinook Member

    There are valid points all around....but I particularly agree with Roper on this one. The fishing in the Methow is good. There are cutts in the mid-20's, I've caught A FEW, but that's been over many days on the water fishing for steelhead.

    The bottom line is that the article is full of hype, it's cavalier, and it's irresponsible. It focuses on and glorifies the exceptions to the norm, not the norm. It promotes tactics that will bring to hand ESA-listed species more effectively than the resident trout (which, remember, are the focus of the open season) and, I believe, promotes targeting steelhead outside of the steelhead season. It also fails mention good fish handling.

    I find it particularly interesting that these so-called 'mega-trout' are most successfully encountered towards the end of the summer....I believe the author says "late August through the end of September" right before the end of the season. Then, magically, as the steelhead season opens in early October, these resident 'chromers' magically disappear and only steelhead are caught? Right...

    Also, nobody mentioned the fact that two of his co-conspirators in the article are (1) one of the few local flyfishing guides on the river (phone # conveniently provided) and (2) a local business owner who ties the magic fly that will get you your trophy fish and "scoffs at state and federal attempts to rebuild native stocks. Note also that the owner of the Carlton store has been trying to sell his store for YEARS. Motives, anyone?

    oh well, just the disgruntled ramblings of a locals who's river has gone to the dogs...