Wanting to hear all about your Delta Spey set ups and casting tips.

Discussion in 'Spey Clave' started by James Waggoner, Mar 21, 2011.

  1. James Waggoner

    James Waggoner Active Member

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    Philster, I always value your opinion and expertise...I use a about 2' of overhang, but To be clear: Large loops aren't a problem, my tight loop comment had to do with the fact I was generating tailing loops when doing so. And as far as shooting, I can shoot 40' or more, it just doesn't have that zip through the guides I'm used to when using shorter heads I suppose. The issue is tailing loops, as the line rolls out it wants to foul on itself or collide with itself on the final roll out. I agree with earlier posters, this is a power issue caused by slack, lack of smooth acceleration or bottom hand timing and application.

    So with the above symptoms clearly in mind, what do you think Dr. "Phil"ster...Can you help me?"
     
  2. Leroy Laviolet

    Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    iiiiirrrrrttttccchhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Don't cut it !!!!! The line designers probably got it right, Wink wink !!
    Keep learning how to cast that line , stay with it awhile befor you think of chopping that line--------------------------------!!!!!!
     
  3. fisshman26

    fisshman26 Member

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    Go ahead and cut it but leave the head intact and splice in or loop the head and use 20lb ridge running line, I do this with all of my looong belly lines, you will regain the line speed that you like so much. But remember to leave the head intact and cut where the running line starts to meet the rear taper, you hang this outside of the tip for maximum speed and distance.
    Guess I should read the full post before I post lol, James you are on the right track.
     
  4. Leroy Laviolet

    Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    Based on this, if I'm reading it correctly, you want to cut it based on thinking you'll get better turn over with a lighter running line, correct??
    If so, DON'T CUT IT !!!!!!
    It'll have nothing to do with turn over-
    If my reading is correct, you are NOT on the right track if this is the motive:ray1:
     
  5. James Waggoner

    James Waggoner Active Member

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    Bruce, thanks for the vote of confidence. I know you would be quick to straighten me out if I was on the wrong track, so this means a lot to me.

    James
     
  6. fisshman26

    fisshman26 Member

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    No Worries James, now as far as turnover problems it usually is associated with the anchor not being lined up 180 degrees and not starting the forward cast with the bottom hand, try checking these 2 out, video of course would be helpfull
     
  7. Nooksack Mac

    Nooksack Mac Active Member

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    One way you could probably smooth out the turnover is to use a tapered leader, even though you stay with a short one. A single-strand short leader is practical enough in that it's all right if it drops to the water in sloppy coils, because it allows the fly to begin sinking immediately. But it doesn't make for smooth transition in flight. Even a short leader can be tapered to allow the energy to transfer mostly smoothly, from tip to leader to fly. A simple leader that I use a lot in the winter is a 4-foot OX, made with 15" of .017" butt, 15" of .015" and an 18" fleuro tippet of .011".

    Try casting a small, light fly or a tuft of yarn with the same tip and leader. If it turns over better, the problem may lie with casting big, heavy flies. Of course a big MOAL or Intruder is an impediment to smooth casting.
     
  8. Nooksack Mac

    Nooksack Mac Active Member

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    One way you could probably smooth out the turnover is to use a tapered leader, even though you stay with a short one. A single-strand short leader is practical enough in that it's all right if it drops to the water in sloppy coils, because it allows the fly to begin sinking immediately. But it doesn't make for smooth transition in flight. Even a short leader can be tapered to allow the energy to transfer mostly smoothly, from tip to leader to fly. A simple leader that I use a lot in the winter is a 4-foot OX, made with 15" of .017" butt, 15" of .015" and an 18" fleuro tippet of .011".

    Try casting a small, light fly or a tuft of yarn with the same tip and leader. If it turns over better, the problem may lie with casting big, heavy flies. Of course a big MOAL or Intruder is an impediment to smooth casting.
     
  9. Nooksack Mac

    Nooksack Mac Active Member

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    Arrgh! I can't find a way to remove my double post. Sorry, folks.
     
  10. Leroy Laviolet

    Leroy Laviolet Aint no nookie like chinookie

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    ............................
     
  11. T Dave

    T Dave Member

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    The 6/7 Delta should be fine for your rod,, if anything a tad on the light side. If you are getting tailing loops, you may be hitting it a tad hard with a weak D-loop. Try focusing on generating a stronger d-loop, and make sure the rod is loaded well before hitting it smoothly.

    Been fishing Deltas quite a few years now. IMO, they may be the best all-around do everything line out there. :thumb:
     
  12. James Waggoner

    James Waggoner Active Member

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    Went out to day, for a couple of hours to practice. Really took time to note, my technique and gear. What I found:
    • Bad line management
    • Running line sinks and gets caught in current
    • Black head marker, provided my Airflo slid to far up head. 47' instead of around 51'

    So lack of line speed is quite apparent when looking at this list and the fact I was casting with 3 1/2' of the head inside the tiptop may explain some turnover issues. What I did find was, when I was careful to keep the 180 degree rule, accelerate into my d-loop with a low rod angle and slow up during the flip all the while raising my rod into firing postion, line speed and turnover improved greatly.

    Tomorrow, I'll be back on the water with a new running line attached and should have the correct amount of overhang...I'm expecting a good day casting.

    By the way, I have a Meiser 11' system 4 Highlander switch (350-500 grn) I'd like to get ready for summer. Could anyone recommend a full floater that's not 30' long? I was thinking something in the 45' range and about 330-350grns.

    Thanks, James.
     
  13. fisshman26

    fisshman26 Member

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    James when casting properly you should be able to turn over the line with 20ft of line outside the rod tip, dont get caught up in line speed as a cure all.
     
  14. James Waggoner

    James Waggoner Active Member

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    I agee, line speed isn't a cure all...but at the same time I really like having it when shooting line. Today as I floated the Kalama, things turned out pretty well. Still a few little casting quirks to work through, but all in all, shoots very nicely now. When fishing close quarters, this line casts well at short distance with the head pulled in at just about any length. Over all well pleased with my progress and this time I'm doing it right...as I change river banks I'm changing hands too.

    So all you, who have said time and time again, "learn to cast a mid or long belly, you'll be a better caster for it" I'm now a firm believer in that statement.

    Thanks, James.
     
  15. shotgunner

    shotgunner Anywhere ~ Anytime

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    I guess your looking at Delta longs then :)
     
  16. James Waggoner

    James Waggoner Active Member

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    I'm hoping by summer it'll be a Delta Long floater.

    So what is the longest head I can realistically cast, with a 7136 Z-Axis?
     

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