Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by flyfishmt, Nov 10, 2013.
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We all have personal standards. We must choose where the line needs to be drawn. For my personal standards..... if 99.9% of guys on the bighorn are "attaching" splitshot and bobbers to their line, they are not fly fishing...They are gear fishing with fly rods. To take it one step further, I usually do a three day float trip down the Deschutes fishing for trout every year. I take my floating fly line for "fly fishing", and my centerpin for "nymphing". Needless to say, I out fished all the flylines throwing bobbers and shot. All the boys laughed at me....in the beginning,.... then they were all asking for lessons on how to cast, and how much, and where to get one etc etc.
You should write news stories for MSNBC or Fox News. Nobody body tosses a half a chicken with any rod. In fact there are many that go as far as to limit the size of their hooks believing large hooks can cause unnecessary harm to the fish. Personally I won't use a hook larger than 1.5. No way to tie up a half chicken on a 1.5 hook. I know some that think 1.5 is to big. I won't use a stinger hook for the same reason. These are personal choices just as the way I prefer to fish is.
I will listen to others opinions and insights and make my personal choices on fishing techniques based on what I learn from my peers and how I personally feel about the methods available to me. If I were fishing with someone that uses a different method, even one that I might not choose to use myself I certainly would not condemn them for it. I might question their chosen method and even offer my own views. I certainly would not stop fishing with them and if they had beer I would drink with them if they offered to share. Well, I wouldn't drink it but for other reasons and not because of a simple difference in fishing methods or how we defined those methods.
To each their own. A day on the river is to rare for me to have it ruined by a simple difference in opinion. And that is all these discussions are; opinions.
...a kid learning to ride a bike with training wheels on it. 100% of them will say that kid is riding a bike. It's probably super cute too.
Your ridiculous metaphors and phantom polls are just as entertaining. Keep 'em coming and keep the laughs rolling in.
Gear fishing is cool. Fly fishing is cool. Bobbers are gear....and that's cool. Jeez.
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That's just my point, if you read the other posts....just as not all swinging is created equal, not all nymphing is created equal.
The guy throwing a 700gr head with a 4" weighted intruder (better?) on a 15, sink tip certainly isn't fishing the same way a guy with a size 1 Spey-style fly on a long leader...this any more than the guy side drifting his 7 split shot (where was the Fox/MSNBC comment when that came up? That sounds just as ridiculous as tossing a half chicken) and bobber vs the guy hiking in and fishing his lightly weighted nymph under a small float.
Just as you say there are plenty of guys who limit the size of their hooks and don't use stingers, there are guys who nymph who limit their flies, don't use split shot, use shorter rods that make it more difficult to reach certain water...I know I do.
These types of threads are always circular and go nowhere...but, they always provide some good entertainment.
It used to be only that people swing because of the take, people threw nymphs under a bobber because they enjoy the visual aspect of it and that was that. Now, it always turns into a pissing contest about why one method is sooooo much better than the other and held in much higher regard...
To each their own...I do know this, when I'm out on the river, I give everyone, Gear guys, swingers, nymphers plenty of room and would be happy to share a beer with any of them because generally speaking, once you get those guys away from the keyboard and out on the river, they're actually pretty cool.
....Attaching gear to fly lines = training wheels. ....take the training wheels off, and flyfish.
Yes bobbers are gear, just as an eagle is a bird but that doesn't make it any less of an eagle does it? (I tried to make it funny for you, but I'm a bit under the weather this morning, I'll try better next time.)
If people want to take the definition this far and suddenly an indicator/bobber is gear (if it is bobbing you are doing it wrong by the way), than so is every other thing we use, it is all "gear", everything is gear, your rod is gear, your line is gear, your backing, etc..., it is all gear. Under that definition, it is hard to argue, under that definition I am a gear fisherman and so is everyone else on here and we might as well call this WashingtonGearFishing.com.
It's funny, TallFlyGuy has a signature up above stating that anything attached to the fly line makes it gear, so leader is gear? Tippet is gear? Backing is gear? Florocarbon, because it sinks is gear? You see what I mean, ridiculous. An indicator, really? I've decided to try my current steelhead set up, just as it is on my spinning rod with my spinning reel, no fly line. I'll attach an indicator and two small flies, to the end and I will try to cast it. Then I will take one of swinging pattern monsters and I will try to cast that. I wonder which one will go farther? Hmmm. Ok, the swinging thing went farther, enough farther to indicate significance (about 10'), it seems like that pattern actually helped me cast where my indicator made it more difficult to cast. So I need my fly line to cast my set up with any form of efficiency and people throwing some of those other patterns don't need it as much. I imagine if I tried real hard I could eventually catch a fish on my spinning rod with my set up with no modification, maybe that should be my new standard/handicap, my new ethical high horse, you know make it harder for myself to catch a fish so I can claim that I'm a true fisherman and all those other folks are knuckle draggers.
We could of course take this back to the origins of the sport, and everyone not using an approximate 6' chunk of stick and the same approximate amount of line with red wool and waxed colored feathers attached to a hook are not fly fishing. Dang if the sport doesn't evolve and some people evolve with and others stoop themselves in tradition. I bet they still only listen to records of the classic composers and call other forms of listening something else, but it certainly isn't music. (Was that one better?)
No more leader for you! No more weighted patterns! No more backing! I like it TallFlyGuy, I like it. It will be interesting to see what you decided to use as "Fly LIne". Wait did you say ..."Attaching gear to fly rods..." Oh awesome, no fly reels either. I can't wait to watch this. When you get tired trying, I'll have a cold one waiting for you.
TENKARA!!!!! Oh wait, no....
The true origins of the sport! If you are not Tenkaraing, you are not truly fly fishing! If you haven't caught a steelhead while Tenkaraing you have not truly caught one as a fly fisherman!
Nobody is saying it's wrong, only that they don't consider it flyfishing. The regs don't consider a bobber and shot to be flyfishing, either. Within your entire argument, keep that in mind.
Someone also said indicator fisherman prefer the visual aspect of fishing. I'd say that's true with the hardcore vertical guys. Not so with the vast majority of steelhead "nymphers." They're just looking for a grab and that's the easiest way to get one. Nothing wrong with that but why get upset that many don't consider it flyfishing? It ain't.
You are right the regs do not specifically indicate that an indicator is part of fly fishing, but they also do not specifically say that it is not. If you are referring to the one part that talks about adding weight to the line, the state does not consider a floating indicator that does not include weight (to help with the cast) a weight attached to the line. In fact if you ask at the state level they will make it quite clear that there is nothing wrong with an indicator in fly fishing only waters, the state considers indicator fishing fly fishing, so keep that in mind.
I almost completely agree, in fact this is the point I keep trying to make adding an indicator does not change this definition.
Backing, tippet, leader, floro....all part of the fly line....Next
Edited earlier to add bobber and shot
Oh, so you buy it from the fly shop already attached, I see! So long leaders/line on a spinning spool is all part of the fly line. I get it now, my bad! So if I could buy a fly line with an indicator attached, Then I'm fly fishing again, cool. Oh wait they sell those don't they. I guess you don't consider those "fly lines" to actually be "fly lines". Must be nice to be Webster, after all that is what he ultimately wanted to do, manipulate the way people perceived their world.
OH thanks for pointing that out. I changed it to fly line, and in my definition, adding line to fly line is still considered fly line, weather it be t-14, or backing , or tippet etc.
Just admit it....Gear on your fly line is your drug...like crack...When confronted and having this online intervention of sorts....Its freaking you out... Relax.. Take a deep breath and embrace life without the drugs... You can do it!!