You can't have it both ways!

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Bob Triggs, Jun 6, 2012.

  1. to add to this thread my experience today actually... I was in the market for a spey set up on the lower end of the price range for my first one. Red's fly shop on the yakima had a echo set up for $500 out the door. just to price around i could order online and save a bit more. a step further and i could have bought the same rod on this forum WITH line for $150... i went to pacific fly fishers in mill creek and asked if they could atleast match reds price he thought about it and agreed. BUT this is where supporting your local fly shop comes into play. In 5 minutes i had the very rod i wanted to buy spooled up with the employees personal reel and was casting in the pond out back. Another 5 minutes and he was out there teaching me how to snap T and got me casting 70 feet in 20 minutes. Then proceeded to give me a better line than reds, AND recommend and throw in 5 steelhead flys with know local success.... Won't get anywhere close to that on the internet
     
  2. The point being you would like for your shop to be open in 5 years. BR
     
  3. Exactly, lets hope it happens. BR
     
  4. I am curious, I think coffee is big in your area of the country. Say Starbucks, people are willing to spend 50-100x the cost of brewing a cup at home, however with fly shops they are willing to waste an hour of their time to go to a shop and "try" a product on to go home and order it on line to save sales tax. Also on this site, people praise Simms waders, willing to spend a premium for their waders even though numerous other brands would perform for the most part the same. So what is the issue? Could it be Starbucks, Simms know what they are doing? People are always willing to spend the money if you provide value. BR
     
  5. Now you are talking apples and oranges.

    Simms isn't a fly shop - it is a product. Many products have a fan boy following that keeps them going even if the only value in the product is the name (at least Simms provides a great product too).

    And as for Starbucks - some people go into the shop to sit and bullshit, but they don't waste the employee's time by doing it. And the other 95% go to the coffee shop to BUY a cup of coffee. The whole goal of the trip is to get the product, not shop around and see if they can get it cheaper than the shop down the street or on the internet.
     
    Bob Triggs likes this.
  6. Done a little time? If not you have no idea what being someone's bitch is about.

    You make some good points here and there. In between the few good points it seems you just like to be contradictory. Don't be your own bitch.
     
    Bob Triggs likes this.
  7. Yes BR, be careful not to contradict a certain few on the forum...they're a bit sensitive to that I've found.
     
  8. I'll take some of that popcorn
     
    Bob Triggs likes this.
  9. What's the problem there loosestones? Got some freetime and nothing better to do with it? Try fishing. I hear it is very theraputic. Might help you with your delusions.
     
  10. Starbucks is successful the same way McDonald's is: Familiarity. Most people don't want to have to try something new. They know what they're getting, even if it is the exact definition of mediocrity. There's also a convenience factor. While I can hand press a few shots of espresso at home in 5mins, it's tough to do when I travel, and other parts of the country rarely have good coffee places, so I am stuck with patronizing Starbucks to feed my caffeine addiction.

    Not thinking this is 100% applicable to the fly shop world.
     
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  12. This is the most reasonable and accurate post that you have made in this thread.
    If this would have been the your reply to the OP we would have probably avoided much of the flaming rhetoric.
    You see BR in the first comment you castigasted fly shop owners because they could not make a sale to visitors to the shop that had no intention of buying something. You put all of the blame on the sales team assuming they did nothing to easn the sale, yet did not acknowledge that some folks are just inclined to not buy in brick and morter environments, Then you went on the lump all fly shop owners in a group that needed to learn to close the deal. Most fly shops don't have a little room where they take potential buyers and then bring in the professional closer to make the sale. This is not a car dealership. Most of us fly shop owners know that sometimes it takes a guy two or three visits (and permission from a spouse) before they drop a grand for a rod, reel line etc. Having a goal of trying to get a sale before the customer leaves the shop is good but the real goal for our shop is to give everyone an experience that makes them want to come back, because we can't make money and keep the doors open if people are not going to walk in the door.
    Your insight that not all fly fishers make good business owners is correct although not revolutionary. When my son and I began the process of of opening a fly shop we had years of small business experince in our background. Then we enlisted the help of additional small business owners to counsel us. We have a CPA, a banker, a former fly shop owner, a couple of regional manufacturer reps and a an MBA in marketing as a part of our overall management. In addition we have two very supportive and hardworkoing spouses.
    Will this guarentee success? No, it will however give us a better chance, the rest is up to market conditions, weather, river flows, the Euro crises and the price of Starbuck coffee.
    What pissed me off BR is your arrogant attitude that we shop owners were, as a group, just a bunch of guys who stumbled into the business expecting that the fly fishing world owed us a living.
    I hope that in your consulting business that you adopt the approach in the post above rather than your first few posts, I am sure that it will be more palatable to your prospective clients.
    The fly shop business is no different than any other retail service business, there are good ones and bad ones the good ones generally succeed and the bad ones do not.
    jesse
     
  13. Well said, Jesse.
     
  14. I haven't been there, but I suspect Leland and the Bellevue Orvis shop are creating a good brand by having musical guests, cigars and scotch testings. If I lived a bit closer I would definitely be going there often.

    Matthew
     
  15. Thanks Matthew but it takes more than music, cigars and whisky. These are rewards to our customers as well as attracting new people
     
    Derek Young and Bob Triggs like this.
  16. Any way you want it...
     
  17. "Not really, been to Cape Canaveral and the Deschutes in the last month...and you? I see you're back to attacking all who don't share your point of view...you are at least consistent, I'll say that much."

    Oh please tell me whom did I attack? BRsnow? If you think what I had to say to him is an attack then you are the sensitive one. What the hell does my conversation with him have to do with you anyway? You bored or something? Looking for someone to start an argument with? Are you some sort of crusader coming to the rescue of those unable to defend themselves? What is your game?
     
  18. Yesterday I neglected to submit a post very similar to this. Well said, Jesse.
     
  19. Well - I like to buy at fly shops; and my consumer world does not revolve around comparing prices on-line or even between local stores. This doesn't mean I'm wealthy - but +/- 20%, a couple hundred bucks here and there - is meaningless.

    My time is worth more. It does make a BIG difference if I get service, meaning, if I'm there at the fly shop - and looking at rods - go to counter with intent on casting said rod, and the counter dude is in midst of chitchatting about some lodge in the cayman islands for 10 minutes (or worse, just answers the phone in the first place - without putting the phone guy on hold!!) - I shall walk out and go to another shop. If the dick head at counter puts the guy on hold and hands me a reel and says go try it out, and goes back to yapping, I walk out also. If it happens at second shop, I won't go driving around to a third; I then go on line. Of course, I'd rather not. I like to see what I am buying, inspect the cork, the blank, maybe buy a package....but if lame service keeps me waiting....forget it. It is as if they are doing me a favor by letting me listen to their phone crap, or worse, some asshat who walks in and does the 30 minute fish/story exchange to tie up (excuse the pun) the shop help. I could be standing there with $100 bucks in crap trying to check out - and nobody comes - or worse - he calls in the back for someone to help me? Fuck that - just cut the dude off and sell to me so I can get outta here.

    And you wonder why people buy on line? That's the only thing that pushes me there - not money.

    So smarten up - people who work at fly shops and think the business is primarily about shooting the breeze - please give your immediate attention - to others in your shop who are there to buy and spend money. If you can't tell the difference, expect your potential customeres to go elsewhere.
     

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