Your Opinion is Needed!!

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by obiwankanobi, May 1, 2007.

  1. obiwankanobi

    obiwankanobi Active Member

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    My Grandpa taught me fly tying at a young age when very few synthetic materials were available. When I look at his fly boxes today with flies that I will never fish, since this is his legacy to me, I don't see flashabou, synthtic dubbing, bead heads or synthetic hairs. I see feathers, hair and steel. When I was browsing through You Tube today, I saw a new fly tying product called Nuclee R. It is a synthetic dubbing, hair like material, that reflects UV light and you can heat treat it to mold into shape. I realized, being a traditionalist myself, that if fly tying and flies incorporate, hot glue, epoxy and heat treated plastics, aren't we just re-inventing the wheel and making lures?:confused:

    Let me know what you think?
     
  2. James Mello

    James Mello Inventor of the "closed eye conjecture"

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    In the most primitive sense, that's all a fly is anyhow. I've embraced synthetics as an alternative to other more costly natural materials. What you decide to do is fine by me, just as long as the material isn't illegal.
     
  3. Richard Olmstead

    Richard Olmstead BigDog

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    I'm with James here. Your grandfather's hooks were metal, right? not hand-carved bone. Also, the genetically bred hens that provide today's hackle are not anything that would have been found in the barnyard in your grandfather's day. I certainly respect your choice to 'go natural,' but I enjoy tying with a broad range of materials and what makes fly-fishing special for me is where I am and what I'm doing/learning on the water.
    Dick
     
  4. Gary Thompson

    Gary Thompson dirty dog

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    I've been tying for 30 years and I have found that the simplest patterns with the least amount of materials make the best fishing flies.
    All natural is good, you don't want to support the oil co. any more than possible. Some stuff is just going to be synthetics to make the best bugs.
    I don't believe in killing protected animals to make flies, but if you found a flicker dead in your yard?
    Don't ask, Don't tell.
    The most important thing about fly fishing for me is catching a fish on something that the fish would not ever eat. Fur, feathers, yarn, glass beads, copper wire. I made that bug and I made that fish bite it.
     
  5. David Prutsman

    David Prutsman All men are equal before fish

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    I believe it's just the natural progression of the game. Take baseball for instance, in 1910 Frank "Home Run" Baker led the league with 10 home runs. Now, the record stands at 73 for the season, even though he had to be juiced to do it. Fly fishing is the same way, people will always look to improve on what came before. If you're a traditionalist, that's fine, as long as it makes you happy. Hmm....I wonder when people are gonna start "juicing" to land more Steelhead?
     
  6. obiwankanobi

    obiwankanobi Active Member

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    I just wanted to say that I am not against using synthetic materials at all. I find myself using epoxy, synthetic dubbings and artifical materials. I just wanted to see what wff members thought on the whole idea. You are right Crew about the progression of baseball and I don't juice myself to catch more steelhead, but I do use a a spey rod on steroids............T&T 1509!!!!!
     
  7. Porter

    Porter Active Member

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    It doesn't hurt that the mound was lowered giving a more advantageous angle to hit the ball better. No more Bob Gibson and 1.12 ERA's.

    Sometimes going back keeps you ahead. Perhaps that's why spey has had a resurgence. :confused:
     
  8. David Prutsman

    David Prutsman All men are equal before fish

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    If the flies my grandfather's fly box from the 30's didn't have such sentimetnal value, I would fish them. Sometimes old school is the way to go, give the fish something other than a parachute adams or wooley bugger. Flies like the royal coachman and the hornberg are still very effective patterns that just went out with the times.

    How about Walter Johnson and Chrity Mathewsons 1.09 ERA, now that was baseball!
     
  9. klintd

    klintd Member

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    I think one of the things that makes fly fishing a lifetime hobby is the amount of variables that make up the equation. Species of fish, different water types, fishing techniques, equipment, equipment building, entomology, fly tying techniques, fly tying materials, traditions, innovations, etc; the sport can be as complicated or as simple as you want to make it.

    Everyone seems to find an area in which to specialize or something that they connect with. It seems like everyone has different experiences.

    I enjoy new experiences and learning all I can about anything that is related to the sport so yes I tie flies with anything legal that I can affix to a hook. However I also enjoy tying traditional patterns with traditional materials.

    I try to keep an open mind about the sport, never hurts to listen and learn. Heck, if you are lucky you might even learn something that will further your passion for the sport.
     
  10. harry

    harry New Member

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    We had the same argument on our local forum recently. The general feeling was that as long as the fish wasn't harmed, the fly or lure and the way it was constructed should be matter of personal choice. Ipurposely put myself into the traditionalist camp and I guess some of the lads were a bit peeved. I suppose its a matter of personal preference and some people enjoy the journey more than being at the final destination. Is the fishing more important than actually catching the fish? I think its also a matter of progression (or learning, that can at times bring forth the good things of older traditions). In a way its about the rules you set for yourself.

    The killing of endangered species for fly tying materials is a no-no.
     
  11. kodiaksalmon

    kodiaksalmon Jeff B.

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    You know it's a fly or it's not. You just know. The Alaska fishing regs has a statement concerning fly fishing only as using a lure "contructed by a means commonly referred to as 'tying,'" or something to that effect. IGFA defines flyfishing as fishing in which the fly line carries the lure to the fish, and not the lure carrying the line. Beyond that, it's up to you. That's why I say, you just know. Most of what I tie would make alot of traditionalist's heads explode. I tie big flies for big fish, and most of my flies are 4/0 with tandem hooks, spinner blades and even skirts for pike, muskie, halibut and off shore salmon. But I'd never use scent or make a fly so heavy that I couldn't cast it with fly rod.

    You just know.
     
  12. wolverine

    wolverine Member

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    My grandfather taught me to tie using strictly traditional natural materials. When he passed on to that great fishing stream in the sky he left all of his gear to my dad. Dad was a gear fisherman who only fly fished for panfish in the spring so he never used any of grandpas gear. When dad passed on 5 years ago all of his gear (and grandpas) made it to me. When I look at grandpas fly wallets & boxes, fly tieing box and compare them to mine, its a night and day comparison. If you dropped one of his flies on the ground you'd have a hard time finding it as everything is in muted shades of brown, grey, green, etc. Mine are much brighter due to the plethoria of synthetic materials available and my now non traditional outlook of what should be used. Basically if I can cast it with a fly rod its good to go. Like Kodiak I draw the line at using scents. The same with heavily weighted flies. Actually I don't use heavy flies because they hurt too much when they hit me in the back of the head.
     
  13. kodiaksalmon

    kodiaksalmon Jeff B.

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    Another thing to remember is that even our "natural" materials weren't normal 20-20 years ago. How many guys back then used 14" lengths of chartreuse yak hair, or even colored bucktail and hackle. Flyfishing as a whole has changed. Back then if you told someone that you flyfished for makos, ling cod, pike, or even salmon from a boat eight miles off shore they would have thought you were crazy.

    So yeah, keep it castable, fish it like a fly (don't jig it in 60' of water), no scents, no flashing lights, no live bait hooked onto it, and you're good to go.

    Jeff
     
  14. Be Jofus G

    Be Jofus G Banned or Parked

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    I started adding orange juice to my vodka years ago. It didn't help me land any more steelhead. Actually it made drinking eaisier and casting harder.
     
  15. seanengman

    seanengman Trout have no politics

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    I like the idea of traditionalism... but in the end I've found that the fish just don't care. Bamboo, fiberglass, or graphite it is all just how you present yourself.
     

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