illegal float plane coho fishing?

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Smalma

Active Member
#31
It is pretty clear that "guiding for salmon" on the salt without a charter license is illegal.

From quote from PT above is directly from WDFW's website and there is no mention of needing a vessel.

A number years ago the state placed a cap on the number of "charter license" (248 or thereabouts) so the charter/salt water salmon guide fishing is a limited entry fishery. With that cap on the license one interested in guiding in that fishery they have to buy a license from someone with an existing license at more than face value. This business of salmon guiding without the proper license has been a long time problem. It gets interesting on the lower Columbia where those "guides" leaving from the Washington side of the river would need one of those limited entry license but they can get a non-resident guide license in Oregon that has no limit on the number of licenses issued - the only catch is that they must leave and land their catches on the Oregon side.

From the FAQs section of the link provided in the earlier posts-


If I charge a fee to students for instruction in fishing techniques on the water, do I need a guide or charter license?
Yes, if the class includes on-the-water instruction with gear capable of catching fish.


Closing another common used loop hole.

Curt
 
#32
Don't you guys know this is America when you have deep pockets you can do anything you want. What ever happened to the fishing reports and cool pictures of places I haven't been 2 yet? All we have now is people crying because someone posted a report on pnp and Orvis seaplanes. Go fishing guys and gals there's plenty of salmon the seaplane didn't get them all
 

Chris Bellows

Your Preferred WFF Poster
#34
All we have now is people crying because someone posted a report on pnp and Orvis seaplanes. Go fishing guys and gals there's plenty of salmon the seaplane didn't get them all
i actually think the sea-plane is a pretty cool idea, although i would prefer going to secret spots not very accessible to the public which illegal bob has stated is not the plan. i would also like to go with guides who don't screw the legal guides by not being properly licensed for the fisheries they target.

there is no excuse for illegal guiding, and no excuse for supporting it.
 
#36
Jonathan, did you try contacting these guides privately (PM) before posting this possibly slanderous thread? If you are right or wrong aside, it seams calling someone's professional integrity into question, on a open forum, without getting their side of it first. Well, that would be just rude. Hopefully you did and this thread is do to a lack of response from them.
 
#37
No. I contacted no one. A company advertised it and I am simply making people aware of the legality (or lack there of) the endeavor. I have not named names or companies, just provided facts.

I would hate to see a fisherman book one of these trips and get mixed up in a legal issue because they have placed trust in the integrity of the company in question.
 

smc

Active Member
#40
A Salmon Charter*license is required if you accept a fee to take a person fishing for salmon, food fish or shellfish in Marine Areas 1 through 13 (including 2-1 Willapa Bay, 2-2 Grays Harbor, 8-1 and 8-2), Lake Washington, or the Columbia River downstream of the Longview Bridge.



This doesn't say anything about using a boat. Just accepting a fee for taking a person salmon fishing. Maybe they are only charging for the plane and lunch...
The document specifically states "This document describes WDFW license requirements for guides and charter boats."

You have to read the what follows in the document in context to that statement.
 
#41
No. I contacted no one. A company advertised it and I am simply making people aware of the legality (or lack there of) the endeavor. I have not named names or companies, (Really?) just provided facts. (That you're "pretty sure" of.)

I would hate to see a fisherman book one of these trips and get mixed up in a legal issue because they have placed trust in the integrity of the company in question.
Again, Really?
 

smc

Active Member
#43
"Mad slanders on mad ears do fall" William Shakespeare

All of this is plain to see on the same above quoted wdfw commercial licensing page. But somehow it happens here that certain individuals are reading only the words that support their own speculative, presumptive and rather vitriolic accusations. In my experience these kinds of personal accusations and attacks are never innocent. No one is trying to circumvent or skirt any laws. and no one is harvesting any fish, nor is anyone fishing from a "vessel". The states attorney general office has an adviser appointed for wdfw matters who has stated to me previously that this walking beach guiding is not an illegal activity under the law.

As regards "seaplanes", Kenmore Air is a licensed carrier for transportation. These people are using the seaplane for transportation only. They are not fishing from the seaplane. They are fishing from the beach. On foot. Under the Code of Federal Regulations a seaplane is only considered a "vessel" while underway upon the waters, ie; taxiing for take off and after landing etc.

The Salmon Charter license is for a "designated vessel".

There is no specific requirement or provision for a walking saltwater beach guide to have a salmon charter license.

Nor is there a specific restriction or penalty against a walking saltwater beach salmon guide. (Probably because the impact would be statistically negligible considering how few would do this).

The Food Fish License is for fresh waters only. From the same wdfw page:

AFood Fish Guide license is required if you accept a fee to take a person fishing for salmon, sturgeon or other food fish species in freshwater rivers and streams, except Lake Washington, and the Columbia River downstream of the Longview Bridge, which requires a charter license.
Vessel designation required: NO
Thanks Bob. It's clear to me that using the seaplane to access beaches, and then to fish from those beaches, does not require a "Charter License".

However, Salmon are classified as "Food Fish". As regards the Game Fish Guide License, from the same page:

"Game fish guides can operate statewide, but are limited to offering services relating only to fishing for game fish."

This tells me that you cannot guide for Food Fish (Salmon), unless you have a "Food Fish Guide License".

Unless you can point me to something that specifically exempts a Game Fish Guide from the Food Fish Guide requirement when guiding in the salt (which would make no sense), your argument that the requirement for a Food Fish License is for fresh water Food Fish only may be deficient.
 

Irafly

Indi "Ira" Jones
#45
This is really confusing to me. On one hand it really seems strange that people who really know what they are doing wouldn't have already determined that what they are doing is legal or not. So in the case of Orvis offering this service, it just would seem to me that they have crossed their "T's" and dotted their "I's". Then again I tend to be too trusting so maybe not. I really want to give these guys and all guides for that matter the benefit of the doubt but it is becoming harder and harder to do so.
 
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