advice for scandi casting.

Panhandle

Active Member
#1
I've been skagit casting too long and found it really difficult to elliminate my top hand from the equation, which makes casting off the tip very difficult (scandi style). Is there a way to tape off my top hand so It will force me to use my bottom hand, or another approach? Second question. How does the muscle memory transfer when jumping from technique to technique?
 

speyfisher

Active Member
#2
I had a similar problem switching from long belly top hand to skagit style under hand. I had to keep reminding myself that so&so was an old man, with arthritus, and could easily cast skagit style. It aint that hard on you. Keep my arms/elbows in tight to my body. Minimal effort. Make the rod do the work. Someone I know taped a guys arms to his body with duct tape. And then said O.K cast. :D Try doing that with a three foot bungee cord.

Watch Henrick Mortenson do a single spey using body english only. Also try casting off your other shoulder. Not cack handed, but properly. Less muscle memory. Concentrate on the cast. The brain commands, the body obeys. Because it doesn't know any better than to do as told.
 

Slipstream

Active Member
#5
I've been skagit casting too long and found it really difficult to elliminate my top hand from the equation, which makes casting off the tip very difficult (scandi style). Is there a way to tape off my top hand so It will force me to use my bottom hand, or another approach? Second question. How does the muscle memory transfer when jumping from technique to technique?
I would suggest you try another approach. Since you are learning a new cast, why not learn with your opposite hand? It has no muscle memory or bad habits. When I got my first (and only) spey rod, I realized after the first lesson I had a problem with breaking the old one-hander habits. So I went to the river and just fished left handed. Its not that hard to do, I was surprised! Good Luck, Tom
 

Ian Broadie

Flyfishing is so "Metal"
#6
Make an "ok" sign when gripping with your top hand and maneuver the rod only with your bottom hand. Start the cast with your hips raise both hands (top hand stops about ear level) before starting your forward cast which consists of pulling the rod but in to your pelvis.

If you keep your top hand in an "ok" sign during this process you have little choice but to skandi cast as the entire cast will be based off of your bottom hand.

This can be incorporated back in to your skagit casting and all of a sudden skagit casting 10000 times easier than before.

:beer2:
 
#7
One important thing I learned with the Scandi lines is that they take to single speys very well, almost like they are supposed to be used for this. They can be cast with a double fine but it doesn't seem as natural to the line.

So try some touch and go single speys. Start with a foot of the scandi head inside the guides. That got me rolling with the different timing when I made the transition from Skagit belly to scandi.
 
#8
The most important thing in changing the emphasis of power and hands is to start the cast with the hand you want to finish with. In simple terms push out with the bottom hand this gives you room to use the bottom hand on the way back forward. If you start the cast with the top hand you are going to want to finish with the top hand. MK
 

Bert Kinghorn

Formerly "nextcast"
#9
Another Kinney lesson that worked for me:

Practice with your top hand down at the very bottom of the upper grip, right against the reel seat. Your top hand will be virtually useless there and you will be forced to cast with the lower hand.
 
#10
Try casting with your off hand. It will have no muscle memory and no bad habits. I did that when I first learned to spey cast and it was surprisingly simple.
 

Ed Call

Well-Known Member
#12
Hey Pan, maybe you can put your .45 in your top hand crossing over your upper grip allowing for "cool" points but all lower hand control! Just pulling your leg man...:thumb:
 

Erik F. Helm

Frozen in the river, speyrod in hand
#13
Pan,
Lock the upper hand elbow against the side of your body. That will eliminate the tendency to straighten the upper arm, and help to realize Mike Kinney's suggestion to begin and finish with the lower hand. It also makes body english more necessary. Also, at the end of the cast your lower hand should be near your belly button or even lower. It is all mental from there. practice SLOWLY while visualizing the cast through the entire stroke.
Hope this helps.
E.
 

yuhina

Tropical member
#15
The most important thing in changing the emphasis of power and hands is to start the cast with the hand you want to finish with. In simple terms push out with the bottom hand this gives you room to use the bottom hand on the way back forward. If you start the cast with the top hand you are going to want to finish with the top hand. MK
Thanks Mike,

Very insightful observation. Thanks! I guess this is the way to switch the pivot at the start point.
I have another question related to this one, I was wondering if the full flex rod are more difficult to get the job done (scandi)? I have tried some full flex action rods with scandi heads. I felt it is a bit awkward... have to open up the loop and exert longer stroke... not a very grace way to do it...