WDFW Announces Puget Sound river closures for 2012

KerryS

Ignored Member
#61
I couldn't agree more about how discouraging it is most of the time with regards to state policy. It's frustrating and at times seems impossible...but there are still steelhead in rivers. They ain't extinct (yet).

But why did you give up? Obviously you and others that have called 'uncle' still read and post forum threads that discuss steelhead closures. Why is that?

What would it take to get you and others back in the fight? Unless you've all given up on steelhead fishing entirely...

Almost as discouraging as losing our fish runs is hearing fellow anglers that just say 'fuck it.'

Bellows said it best: take a long hard look in the mirror if we want to see why our runs have collapsed.

I hope I never become jaded and give up.
When I started fishing the Skagit River over 20 years ago I met people that were involved with issues dealing with steelhead and other fisheries. As time went on I started to get involved and I watched as many of the ones that were involved before me threw their hands up in disgust and walk away. I wondered just as you how could they just walk away like that. As more time went by I realized they gave up because they saw the challenges were insurmountable. Now, with steelhead all but gone from the Skagit and the likely hood that I will never be able to fish for them again I walk away disgusted with how the river and its steelhead runs have been destroyed. Too many issues and too many problems. We the people of Skagit Valley and the State of Washington will never be willing or able to make the changes that need to be made. Good luck.
 
#62
I agree. The fish are not coming back. All closing the fishing will help is to make fisherman change hobbies sooner.

Get a fuel-efficient vehicle and drive to the peninsula and be happy.


BTW, how's the fishing on the Quinault with it's 8 hatcheries or whatever it has?
 

Ringlee

Doesn't care how you fish Moderator
#64
I agree. The fish are not coming back. All closing the fishing will help is to make fisherman change hobbies sooner.

Get a fuel-efficient vehicle and drive to the peninsula and be happy.


BTW, how's the fishing on the Quinault with it's 8 hatcheries or whatever it has?
For how long? Shift pressure to the few remaining open streams until they are depleted?
 
#65
Curious in that King5 Video are those fish actually biting? Or being hooked via other methods? Doesn't seem like a lot of water and it's moving pretty quick. I've never been to Tokul Creek but that water doesn't look really fishy for traditional fishing.
 

Charles Sullivan

ignoring Rob Allen and Generic
#67
i find it interesting that one of the few organizations doing anything for wild fish is being attacked. i do not recall the wild steelhead coalition speaking out in favor of ending all hatchery plants in north sound rivers.

the question i think we should be asking ourselves is whether it is worth doing everything we can to attempt to bring back fishable numbers of wild steelhead or just give up and accept fishing for hatchery fish in early winter. for me, our late winter, spring fisheries are worth saving even at the expense of december hatchery fisheries. our sport would not exist without these runs of wild fish.

the wild steelhead coalition is made up of passionate anglers across all gear spectrums. we do not always agree on every issue but there is no doubt that the goal is to protect and restore wild steelhead fisheries. to blame a conservation group for the lack of fishing seasons is insanity with the total ineffectiveness of fish managers on a state and federal level.
Very well said.

Go Sox,
cds
 

freestoneangler

Not to be confused with Freestone
#68
i find it interesting that one of the few organizations doing anything for wild fish is being attacked. i do not recall the wild steelhead coalition speaking out in favor of ending all hatchery plants in north sound rivers.

the question i think we should be asking ourselves is whether it is worth doing everything we can to attempt to bring back fishable numbers of wild steelhead or just give up and accept fishing for hatchery fish in early winter. for me, our late winter, spring fisheries are worth saving even at the expense of december hatchery fisheries. our sport would not exist without these runs of wild fish.

the wild steelhead coalition is made up of passionate anglers across all gear spectrums. we do not always agree on every issue but there is no doubt that the goal is to protect and restore wild steelhead fisheries. to blame a conservation group for the lack of fishing seasons is insanity with the total ineffectiveness of fish managers on a state and federal level.
Sorry you perceive my comments as an attack on WSC -- not my intent. But, there does seem to be a consistent theme in simply dismissing the points myself and others have made about the issue. Subscribing to the noble ideal "bring back wild steelhead" is admirable. Not many will argue that is what we'd all love to see -- the question is at what cost?

However, like many similar situations where past policies and resource management (more like mis-management) has resulted in negative changes, over a very long time, it may not be reasonable to expect things can be returned to the "golden era".

I still feel the tactics suggested will effectively end up eliminating the sport fisheries and do not agree with that.
 
#69
Freestoneangler:

How much time have you spent on the river systems in discussion, targeting these special fish? Or did you develop your opinion from what you've read on the internet? Just curious.
 

freestoneangler

Not to be confused with Freestone
#70
Freestoneangler:

How much time have you spent on the river systems in discussion, targeting these special fish? Or did you develop your opinion from what you've read on the internet? Just curious.
Sean, nice off handed challenge to my cred. To answer your question, I have fished nearly every river in western WA; some certainly way more than others. Also, as an active TU member (more recently TU Life Member) for the past 25 years, and having served on the board of the now decommissioned King County Chapter of NW Salmon & Steelhead Council, I have spent considerable time working on efforts to improve river system habitat and wild steelhead & salmon recovery -- the Green River in particular.

Ever been to Flaming Geyser State Park and the feeding ponds? -- I led the reconditioning of those and managed them for many years. Ever heard about the wild fish capture program, where fish are re-located above Howard Hansen Dam so they can use the watershed for natural rearing? -- I was on the team that help set that up. I also performed stream survey analysis and worked on fencing and culvert changes to Newaukum Creek for steelhead and salmon recovery.

...and you?
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
#71
If we are to lose our wild steelhead which seems to be the case I feel it is salt to the wound to allow them to be replaced with hatchery raised drones. Do away with the hatcheries. They are a blight on our streams. If this eliminates a fishing opportunity or two so be it.
 

freestoneangler

Not to be confused with Freestone
#72
If we are to lose our wild steelhead which seems to be the case I feel it is salt to the wound to allow them to be replaced with hatchery raised drones. Do away with the hatcheries. They are a blight on our streams. If this eliminates a fishing opportunity or two so be it.
And if you eliminate the hatchery programs and the native stocks keep declining?
 
#73
And if you eliminate the hatchery programs and the native stocks keep declining?
Then we will do what ever we can to help wild fish repopulate our streams and rivers. The hatchery experiment is about 150 years old, and it hasn't worked, so why not try something else? It comes down to what you value, the fish or the fishing. Don't get me wrong, I love to catch steelhead more than any other fish, but the idea of losing them forever in my own back yard, is to me, far worse than closing the local rivers. If we can take care of the things we can control and let mother nature do the rest, we have a fighting chance. Some things are worth fighting for.
Peace,

Chris
 

Freestone

Not to be confused with freestoneangler
#74
Don't get me wrong, I love to catch steelhead more than any other fish, but the idea of losing them forever in my own back yard, is to me, far worse than closing the local rivers. If we can take care of the things we can control and let mother nature do the rest, we have a fighting chance. Some things are worth fighting for.
Peace,

Chris
iagree Well said Chris!
 
#75
http://wildsteelheadcoalition.org/w.../01/Skagit-Wild-escapement-chart1978-2010.png


Ok some help here in 1779 we had about the same number of wild Steelhead in the Skagit - over the next 20years (let me add the "good old days") we had great returns -

Before 1979 what did our hatchery program look like?
Was it much bigger, the same or much less than 2000?
What was different from 2000 to 2004 - WOW would it be nice to just see 2004 numbers in her. Did we start to limit our hatchery production in 2000?
From 1981 to 1991 did the CnR fishery limit spawing and the health of the run? That has to be asked - as much as hate to say it. If I remember my history the Skagit closed in Feb up until 1980/81 somewhere in there.

Thanks to the WSC for posting that info on their new site - its a good new look.