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Bringing a player back

Spey 
1K views 20 replies 18 participants last post by  ak_powder_monkey 
#1 ·
I've been reading Dec's book and one perspective of his has peaked my interest.
Dec states that the least important component of catching steelhead is the pattern, which I agree with. However, he states that when you get a pull you should change patterns and get back at the fish. This is pretty common practice in steelheading. If the fly doesn't matter, and you have a player, why do you need to change the color or profile to bring the fish back? The main reason I'm asking is because i'm really lazy. I get annoyed that I have to step back ten feet after the pull and bring the swing back slower. Now, if I know I have to change patters as well, I may just say screw it. :rofl:
 
#2 ·
Pan, a question that I'm not qualified to answer. Here are a couple for you. If you have a player, but no take or a miss and you bring the same fly back, presenting the same fly the same way, does the player return? If it does, why change your approach? If the player does not come back, would it not be worth the effort to try a quick pattern change?

I followed a guy through a run once. He had one fly on and another on his vest patch. He missed a player, swapped flies out, really fast too. He cast and then hooked that fish (or another fish in the same darn place). I don't know what I learned watching that, but I think I learned that sometimes change is good.
 
#3 ·
I've experienced both. Because it has been instilled in me that you step back and change flies; size, profile, and color-- I comply most of the time. I have also been lazy and brought the same fish back to the same pattern, probably as many times as the other. A couple weeks ago I had a mid swing pull, slack, pull, slack, pull. The kind that gets your hair standing on end and demands you to restrain from setting the hook as the fish follows and plucks. Fish never took solid. I went through the motions without changing flies and never brought the fish back. I even rested the run and went back through. Anyway........
 
G
#4 ·
I just keep working through since a fish generally will run up river or turn and hold downstream. After passing through the run I go through with a different fly and same presentation. I found that after a miss I generally pick up a fish or a pull roughly 15 to 50 feet downstream from the first take. That's my outlook take it for what its worth.
 
#17 ·
As would I Mike, as would I. Somewhat of a 'Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.' Or another way to put that is once 'pricked,' the fish will probably be a bit leery of going after the same thing quickly. Steelhead may have the brain the size of a pea, but that tiny brain works to its benefit, and has for 100,000 years. (Darwin sort of thing.)
fae
 
#6 ·
I don't think I have ever had a winter run fish come back. I have tried moving up after the hit, changing flies, changing tips to go deeper or shallower, just about everything and I can’t remember if I got a winter to come back. Summer runs a different story. I have had fish hit and miss then blast the fly again on the very next cast. I have changed flies, gone to a tip or to a floater, moved up, and continued on thru with every change has produced a fish. Except for those times where I have just repeated a cast and got the fish to come back the others could very well have been a different fish.
 
#7 ·
I have had scenarios where I didnt change flies, and the very next cast I came tight with the fish. I have also not changed flies and questioned if I am losing it, because I didnt get a bump for the rest of the run. I am getting better about switching (smaller, bigger, contrasting colors) to a different pattern, I think it has improved my hookup rate on those type of fish. My big problem is when I am skating dries, and I get boiled do I want to catch the fish....or do I want to keep trying with the dry. If I sink that muddler or whatever, I almost always nail that fish, but if I keep trying with the dry the fish seem to get lazier and lazier until they just stop chasing.
 
#8 ·
Good question. While skating I have had what I assume to be the ssame fish come up and play on four consecutive casts with the same fly. While skating flies it seems to me that the fish is willing to come back after the same fly more then once.

Swinging wets I have had luck both ways, by stepping back with the same fly and then stepping back and changing flies. I will change from a dark fly to a lighter fly. Why?? Hell I don't know other then they are steelhead and I will do anything for a grab.:cool:
 
#9 ·
Pan,

I can't answer the why. It's just that a change up can work. In my experience, most steelhead won't come back, winter or summer. But I've had both winters and summers be players that did come back. I'm lazy too. First I'll just repeat the cast that drew the rise, and then I will change up and try a smaller, duller colored pattern (assuming I wasn't fishing a Spade, which I usually am, and which is about as dull as a fly can be). I'll also back upstream 20, sometimes 30 feet to come through again. That usually doesn't work, but it has a few times.

When it comes to players, that is, steelhead that will rise more than once, it is the trouty September and October fish. These are the fish that will hit a fly as many as five times on one swing. I suspect that these are fish that have been stung before, but just cannot resist rising to the fly, but are hesitant to commit because flies with hooks sting. I'm not sure about that last part, but that's what the experience seems like.

When I was on the CW last September I had a fish rise three times before I broke it off. First rise was to my usual #6 Spade, then I switched to a #8 olive soft hackle, which it took once and then a second time. But for a bad turle knot - not sure why - I should have had that fish.

Sg
 
#11 ·
Interesting posts, and definitely some of the questions that i've been wondering all summer. This summer I've been exclusively fishing dries, and i have only been fishing the north ump. I am really lazy as well, so I'll usually go back with the same fly and cast. If nothing, then I'll switch up to a wet. This summer, my second fishing the NU, I've raised three fish, yeah it's been a slow summer for me. Two fish never came back, they were one time deals, not players. A third fish came up on four different swings and twice on one all to the same dry....never fully committed, felt some small plucks on two of those drifts, but nothing on the others. Then, I tried twitching the dry, which i think ended up spooking the fish because I then tied on a couple of different wets and nothing. Last weekend, as my buddy was watching from a bridge, I had a fish move 5-10 feet for my dry, but it never broke the surface, and never came back again, to a different dry, wet, and my buddy fished through with tips and nothing. Strange for sure. Last summer about half the fish I rose came back. Very interesting for sure. But almost leaves me guessing every time. Any one have any theories about these fish encounters?
 
#12 ·
My theories are....show um something different.Like Poppy and some other said,usually something smaller and darker first.Then something drab. Then often back to what got them going first. I have hooked a bunch of fish after changing up and then going back to the original fly. No rhyme or reason to it, it doesn't always work.

Some additional thoughts are, we encounter players relatively rarely, and I think it is worth throwing them a few different flies when we find them. I have hooked enough fish on a change up that I still go that route almost all the time. I do get lazy too. Like on the D and you know there are a couple dozen fish in the run you are in. In that case, I may shorten up and send the same fly through slow a couple times and then move along.

A good story from last winter concerning players. A couple of friends were fishing a long run one at the top and one down a ways. After they both fished their areas, Jeff the lower guy walked up to Mike the top guy who had reeled up,and asked what if anything had happened. Mike says "there was one in there, I could feel him picking it up and playing with it, I changed flies he wouldn't eat." Jeff says" did you stick him, did he feel metal?" Mike says "no he never got pricked" Jeff who is older and wiser looks at Mike and says with a laugh"Mikey, Mikey,Mikey......never leave a player!"

Jeff marches Mike back up to the top of the run and has him fish the same fly the fish first screwed with. He makes a couple of swings and gets in the exact zone of the fish and BINGO a 38 inch North Umpqua buck smashes the fly and proceeds to take out a bunch of kite string and he eventually lands the fish.

Don't know if there is a moral here because as we all know this doesn't always work. My take is if you have the chance to catch a fish like that, I'll spend a little more time doing it. Winter fish are so few and far between. I have found those big aggressive bucks will often come back

A great story that has us in stitches every time we talk about it.

Mikey, Mikey, Mikey...never leave a player!
 
#13 ·
In my experience the most important factor is PATIENCE. Whatever it takes for you to rest a fish do it. Stand there and twiddle your thumbs. Retie your leader. Or go back up 50 or more feet (if possible) marking the EXACT location you were standing, length of line, and swing speed and work your way back down.

Once I had it drilled into my head to wait I would guess my hook-up rates on these players quadrupled. You won't win them all. And you will certainly go on a streak or three of one-time charlies. But the overall conversion rate will go up if you wait an extended time between casts. Even without changing your fly.

My standard method now is to wait about thirty or so seconds for a quick recast. Unless the fish is hooked I will then wait at least 5 minutes. Especially if it boils/pulls a second time. Wait. And wait some more. You will get more fish back more often and hook more of them.

William
 
#14 ·
I am not qualified to answer this question too. I wanted to add one point. If summer runs are trouty, one thing I noticed in summer when small trout and smolts are present is that I will get hits on a swing. After that first hit, they never come back. If summer steelhead are trouty, why expect them to come back?

I've always wondered how others decide if a slight hit is a small fish or a steelhead. I have been working on the idea that if you feel something like multiple quick shakes, it isnt likely a steelhead. My experience, small trout wont come back and time to fish on down the run. wrong?

Also, love to know how others decide a fish has been pricked or not.

Joe
 
#15 ·
Over the years I've not had any one strategy work consistently enough to settle on it. Every situation seems to be different than the last one and I usually go with my gut feeling at the time as to what my next move should be. It seems that at one time or another I've had both success and failure with the ideas already mentioned.

As for knowing if a fish has been pricked - once again it is a gut feeling derived from what just happened.
 
#16 ·
I have used all of the above with some degree of success. If I don't change to something smaller I will change the presentation. I think my lowest rate of success comes on summer fish moved during a deep swing. This could be late in the season (colder water) or when the sun is on the water and I am fishing deeper. The best success has come running a bomber, turd, or OC behind rocks and in slots on smaller waters. This technique works in larger rivers like the Deschutes also, if you can resist the casting.
 
#18 ·
I too am not qualified to answer, but will chime in anyway. I've found that with fishing in general if I get some interest in a particular fly, lure, bait etc... then my confidence in that particular method soars. If I know that a fish found it enticing enough to investigate then I at least know I'm in the general ball park. In turn my senses tend to get sharp, and I really get down to business when fishing it. When I do change up I often find myself wondering if I just made a big mistake, and in turn my confidence starts to dwindle as well as the quality of my efforts. I do realize this doesn't necessarily apply to steelhead since there really isn't a rhyme or reason to why they strike a particular offering in the first place, but its just a thought.

When I was a gear fisherman I caught 90% of my steelhead with Mepps Algae spinners. These are fine spinners no doubt, but no less so than countless other brands and methods. I always chalked it up to the fact that when I tied a Mepps on I fished it with the confidence that came with many past hook ups. Since it seems to be fairly well agreed upon that the fly itself is a rather small part of the equation when it comes to hooking steelhead on the fly, so in my mind it makes sense that if I was to get any sort of interest in a particular fly then I would be fishing that fly with much confidence there on after, which with me means I'm most likely fishing as well and thoroughly as possible.
 
#20 ·
Yeah...changing your presentation can be (ad) a pretty effective method at times.

P.S. I like your new avatar.
 
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