Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Steve Vaughn, Nov 4, 2010.
Yup my thoughts all the way
Even in alaska some people don't need fire arms! LOL
Not getting sucked into this one again... but I can't stop reading... I still like a healthy disagreement about what I think of as fundamental a American right. Carry on.
The places where you'd carry a fly rod are hardly ever danger zones, as regards humans. OTOH, the phantom who cleaned out all our tackle and gear from the back of a friend's vehicle could have been a close and dangerous encounter, had we come back a few minutes earlier. There are 300 million Americans; a certain percentage of them are recidivist thieves or psychopathic predators. (If you doubt it, read the one-page feature "The Armed Citizen" in every issue of the NRA's "American Rifleman" magazine.) Whether you ever meet such a creature is a matter of shear chance; whether you're able to deal with it depends on actions you take ahead of time. More important than choice of firearm is whether you're able to handle a handgun quickly and safely, a matter of fairly simple training. More important: your mind-set. Have you trained yourself to evaluate
and respond to a situation that goes from normal to dubious to dangerous, probably in a few seconds? It means understanding that you don't carry a weapon just to "feel more secure" or to solve all problems by brandishing it (illegal in normal disagreements; perhaps tragically inadequate when faced with the worst existential cusp of your life). Do you believe that you have a right to live, peacefully and unharmed? If the answer is yes, it means that you have a right and a moral duty to defend yourself.
Just a few comments.
In my conversations with Forest Service law enforcement their estimate is that 80% of the visitors to the National Forests are armed. If there is a terrorist attack in a National Forest campground they will probably find themselves outgunned.
That said in 40 years of fishing, hunting, camping and working in the woods on a daily basis I have never felt the need to have a gun.
In the past few years there are parts of Grant County that I am starting to feel uncomfortable. This fall we were bird hunting in Douglas County so far out that I PARKED on the county road and went bird hunting. Soon I had to move the truck for three Mexicans wearing brand new hunter orange wanting past the truck. The whole situation was odd, but I suppose agricultural work is agricultural work and it does not really matter if the crop is legal or not. I have encountered those folks on Forest Service roads. Those folks concern me. I suspect they are better with weapons than me.
Most of those folks are more afraid of dogs than guns.
That really is the crux of the issue. If you carry will it make it more likely or less likely that you will get into trouble?
It is a difficult decision and I respect people on both sides of the issue.
For me I will carry when I am hunting. At other times I am going to carry bear spray.
It has nothing to do with being "macho". If I have to use lethal force to defend myself or loved ones, that is the decision I have to make, regardless of "baggage".
WHATCHU GOT ON MY 40 STEWART?
edit: damn, that pic didnt pop back up.
I am way more scared of tweekers and their dogs than any wildlife
Yeah Stilly Stalker you got something! I just realized that most of you guys are packin heat on the water - that's more scary than the tweakers and the bears.
my answers to your quests:
1. No. Have not ever seen anyone with a holstered gun actually wade fishing, even in AK - the gun is on the bank, or in a boat - but more common than not, there is no gun at all. I do not carry a gun and do not know anyone who ever has while fishing anywhere, including AK.
2. Hardly any legitimate reason for animals (other than human). Bears rarely pose a threat; if they do - you will almost never have time to react with an appropriate weapon (minimum 7 pounds of large handgun) in a holster; if they don't - most bear-protection shootings involve a slow-moving target with some low-caliber pee-shooter that did nothing but mope around, maybe make a few grunts, perhaps slapped your dog around, messed up your camp because you slopped fish guts around before cooking up a meal at dusk. That's not defense of life, that's stupidity.
That said - there could be on-land situations where a gun may be effective and useful, albeit rarely even there for animals (humans threats are another matter and I suspect much more common). It's not practical in water, with waders, a fly rod, vest, clothing, and frequently, rain.
3. For bear, the recommended weapon is a shotgun with slugs. Many alaskans carry large caliber, high velocity, handguns which can effectively stop a bear (with a well-placed shot). Otherwise, the gun becomes a noisemaker only, or results in an angry wounded animal. Other threats, including human, can be treated with a smaller weapon.
having a cougar sneak up on me definitely made my butthole pucker up tight, but not as much as being cornered by two 100+ lb dogs in the middle of a creek with no escape route. If the owner hadn't come to my aid I would have maced the shit out of both of them, then probably beat the shit out of them with my wading stick.
Stewart, now that we know all the other flyrodders are packing heat, we can start more shit and know they will have our backs
Haha, I guess my grammar was improper on my post it should read, I carry while fishing in Alaska due to bears. But, I have had bears get very interested when they see a fish on the end of your line jumping and flailing about.
at least you guys can decide to carry...up here north of the 49th parallel, we don't have a choice...you can't carry period...it sucks...my 3 wt switch on the Skagit is no match for the cats and bruins that share that same flow me..have to suffice with the bear spray..30 ft,and hopefully the wind is at my back!
I carry an HK .45 auto just in case a cougar, bear or tweaker decides to get frisky. I think it is more of a piece of mind thing especially while fishing by my self.
Shit I need to pack just to protect myself from crazy fly-fisherman. Dang I need to get out of this thread!
I at one time carried a hand gun until I reliezed that I had better aim with a claw hammer. I like a 20 ounce carpenters claw hammer as the thing has no moving parts to jam and very little steel to rust. Plus if your out of my hammer range then you pose no threat to me. But best of all theres no noise if used profiecently!