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Casting the wooly bugger

16K views 22 replies 18 participants last post by  ak_powder_monkey 
#1 ·
I have an incredibly hard time casting the wooly bugger. Whenever I get a lighter fly on the line I can cast just fine, but when I attach the wooly bugger I can only cast about half the distance effectively. The line doesn't travel near as smoothly and keep getting it caught on my pole or make terrible wind knots. Does anyone have any tips for me to help my casting?
 
#3 ·
I struggled until a wiley old veteran decided to stop laughing long enough to show me an effective method. This works well with buggers, streamers, or if you have to put a ton of weight on to get your fly down.

When you pick up the bugger, instead of trying to pull it directly vertical (over your shoulder) change your arm to more of a side-arm pick up with the rod at about 20 degree angle with the water.

Keep your motion smooth, and when you feel the rod load, bring it forward and back to vertical.

The path the line follows, then, is more of a tear drop than the conventional backcast/forward cast.

If this isn't clear, let me know.
 
#4 ·
16 posts... Must be a newbie... Needs help... Time to step up...

The problem you're having is because you're working a heavy fly with the same sized leader+tippet that, meanwhile, works fine with a smaller and lighter (!!!or even a dry!!!) fly. No surprise there. You need a heavier leader that transitions to the same gauge or smaller tippet. Depending on the size of bugger you're tossing, you might think of swapping out to as heavy as a 2x or 3x leader, spliced to the same or next sized smaller tippet. The idea, here, is to have line-material tapered thicker, closer to the fly, so that it's easier to turn that fly over at the end of your cast. Think of "energy transfer."

Are you using a floating or sinking fly line? This is as important as the leader + tippet issue.

If you are using a sinking line, think of utilizing a 5 ft leader. In most cases, trout tend to be way less spooky around sinking fly lines, so you can get away with very short leaders. If trout are way spooky, you might consider flurocarbon leaders and tippets. Either way, having a short and stouter leader will grant you more control turning over your fly at the end of the leader and tippet.

Now, mind you (as a bonus thought), there are times when you might be to better advantage to be working a weighted fly and a long, thin leader. Think of less water-resistance allowing a less spooky presentation and deeper sinking fly. In times like this, you might just be best served knowing how to sling a heavy fly (lead underbody salmonfly nymph pattern) at the end of a 9ft 5x leader--without snapping it off. So you're worried about a Woolly Bugger? Skeelz, my Mon!

BTW, I ain't the prettiest fly caster. But there are lots of times when you actually can get away with crappy casts and still catch fish. Go figure.

--Dave E.
 
#6 ·
2x...3x? try boycotting all thing x's 10, 12, 15 lb maxima or fluoro should do the trick for buggers.
 
#10 ·
Even though i am nowhere near as good a fly fisher as Mark probably is, i heartily disagree. (Mark, you can't be serious!).
You do not need to go any heavier than 3X for trout, Unless you are targeting very large and heavy triploids or the like. 3X is plenty strong for any trout to 10 lbs or so in a lake, if you are any good at playing a fish, and should be heavy enough to turn over a wooly bugger. I use store bought 9' 3X tapered leaders and will often add some 6 lb Maxima for a tippet if necessary, or use 8lb and 6 lb Maxima to rebuild when the 3X starts getting eaten into.
I also use also use store bought 9' leaders tapered to 4X, and have landed most of the larger trout hooked, although it can get sketchy with an 8 or 10 pounder on the line. This is lake fishing, from a boat. Fewer, if any, snags to worry about, and lots of room for 'em to run.
I will often tie some 4X 5.5 lb test tippet to the 6lb Maxima, as it is much smaller in diameter (Maxima is kinda thick). This usually gets me more strikes than the 6 lb Maxima, all other things being equal. I use a non-slip mono loop on Maxima 6lb test and above, but just a clinch knot on the 4X, with a wooly bugger or streamer.

If its windy, I put away the 4 wt and use my 6wt so that I can actually cast. I prefer casting smaller buggers (size 10 and 12) for the 4 wt rod, anyway.

12 and 15 lb is way too thick, easily seen by the trout in lakes, and will cut down on your strikes considerably. I believe that is horrible advice to use such heavy leader for trout. I prefer 4X, and although sometimes I get busted off by a large fish, I can usually get them in reasonably quickly with that. If I think there are enough large fish around that I will most likely hook one, I'll use 3X for that "secure feeling" and to get 'em in quickly.

All the other replies to your quetion were great, but you certainly don't need anything heavier than your 8.5 lb test 3X leader. That will do just fine!
 
#8 ·
caseyweed, all the above advice is good. You didn't mention what weight line/rod you're using. If you're using a light line, like a 5 or less, it's going to be difficult. Woolly Buggers in larger sizes carry a lot of water when false-casting. Similar size flies are as heavy as some bass lures. I like a six-weight, or even better a seven, for easy casting of big nymphs and sinking lines in trout lakes.
 
#11 ·
Jim i believe u are correct when it comes to lake fishing. I have very limited experience with still water and spooky fish. On rivers however, It doesn't matter what size tippet you use, if a fish wants to eat your bug it will. And the strikes are often hard. A couple years ago a friend was fishing a 3x-4x 9' tapered with a pretty good sized streamer, througout the day due to losing flies, windknots, etc, the leader was down to probably a little over 3' and i would estimate 30lb. He needed to cut the line to a point just to be able to thread it through the eye of the hook. And guess what, he continued catching as many fish just as before with this "horrible" setup.
 
#12 ·
. . . A couple years ago a friend was fishing a 3x-4x 9' tapered with a pretty good sized streamer, througout the day due to losing flies, windknots, etc, the leader was down to probably a little over 3' and i would estimate 30lb. He needed to cut the line to a point just to be able to thread it through the eye of the hook. And guess what, he continued catching as many fish just as before with this "horrible" setup.
Wonderful example Mark and one that illustrates perfectly the difference between stillwater and skinny water fishing.

In streams, the water moves right along taking possible food with it - a sort of moving buffet. To be well-fed, fish must make a snap decision about whether or not to take a chance on a potential morsel. To hesitate is to risk seeing the food swept downstream and possibly into the mouth of a less-picky competitor.

Lake fish have the luxury of being able to inspect potential food at their leisure and will decide to eat it only once they're satisfied it looks legit. It's not so much that they're spooky as that they have the option of being less impulsive about what they decide to put into their mouth.

K
 
#13 ·
Caseyweed didnt specify wether he was fishing lakes or rivers, but one can probably assume a lake because of his location and wooly buggers tendency to be a go to lake fly. But in summation if your fishing lakes go small 3x as Kent and Jim pointed out. In rivers its ok to go much larger. Disregard my earlier posts i was 3 fortys in when i wrote that last night.
 
#14 ·
That is a correct assumption Mark, I am fishing lakes. I have a 5wt rod and have been using size 8 wooly buggers. I'm having a hard time letting the rod load, I've tried slowing down my backstroke but the fly just drops like a rock and next thing I know it hits the water so I have to make my forward cast. I'm probably trying to cast too much line at once for what my pole can handle being a larger fly. Maybe I'll pick up some smaller buggers...
 
#17 ·
Here's my guess.... Are you sure you've pulled in all the slack line with your rod tip low before starting your back cast?

Maybe the extra weight of the bugger and slack means you aren't really starting your back cast until it is too far back. Then you will have the line casting downwards and risking wind knots. Lefty Krehs casting book talks about how the cast doesn't start until you get the end of the line moving. If you dont start with the rod tip low and all the slack out. You aren't starting the cast until perhaps the fly rod tip is too far back. I think there is more leeway with light dry flies than weighted flies in this matter

Joe
 
#18 ·
Keep slack out of your line on both foward and back casts. Let the line drop on the back cast and use the tension on the line created by the water load the rod on your foward cast and let it rip. Using the water tension to load the rod creates a "haul" affect without actually pulling the line.

If this actually works you owe me a :beer1:.
 
#20 ·
A 5wt is more than capable of throwing a size 8 streamer. Slowing down your stroke is not the answer, as you discovered. It sounds like you might be trying to aerialize too much line. Remember to just cast the head of the line, then shoot on the final stroke to achieve distance. Trying to cast too much running line will result in the dumped casts like you're describing. Overall though, it sounds like you just need practice and maybe some casting lessons.
iagree

Learning how to double haul will greatly increase your line speed thereby allowing you to shoot line much further. The double haul is one of the esiest casts you can add to your arsenal. I am not a great caster but I do have a good double haul giving me the ability to toss a weighted #6 bugger with my 3wt without issue.

This link claims the double haul is one of the most difficult casts to master, but I found it easier to learn than the roll cast, then again I had a great instructor. Check it out.

http://www.flyfisherman.com/skills/lkdoublehaul/index.html

David
 
#21 ·
I have only been fly fishing for about a year, so have been going through some of the same things that you are going through.

- as mentioned get the slack out of our line before you start the back cast and lower the tip
- on your back cast stop high and do not break your wrist, you loose all momentum and as stated your line drops behind. Practice in the yard or park with the point clipped off of a fly. Good golfers spend many hours at the driving range. Watch your loop on the back and try to feel the rod load. Have you actually felt the rod load? I heard this but untill I fished my 8wt last fall with a sink tip and a big fly did the light go on. That really made a difference. When you watch your backcast you will be able to see when you get it right and when it falls apart and when it falls apart the forward cast has no chance.
- double haul is great but hard to master for awhile. Try a single haul when starting the forward cast. This will help speed up the line and will really get the fly moving forward. once you master this you can try double haul.
- try to get out with someone else who is a good fisherman/caster.
 
#22 ·
This is just a guess but, with the heaver fly you my be subconsciouslytrying to "throw" the fly to hard,trying to muscle the cast. no wrist, let the rod do the work.

Chris
 
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