Discussion in 'Stillwater' started by Wayne Kohan, May 22, 2011.
Now that is funny.
People ask me what I'm fishing with all the time but then they follow it up with something like, "Man, I'm glad I don't have any of those, you haven't caught crap. Here, try one of these....!" Anyway, I never have any problem telling them the secrets to my skunkings!
Yes. While I'm not often one of the hot hands, I don't have any issues answering questions about what I'm using and how I'm fishing...even offering up a fly if I have extras. I can't remember the last time someone took the attitude you described... but to each his/her own.
Basically the guy is a dick. Just cuz he fly fishes don't assume he isn't. Try open ended questions or jokes and get a feel if he is a talker or not. I admit at first I am little reserved but never put anyone even the most filthy gutter drunk off that hard. Try "Dude you are really pulling them in today. What are you using green or pink powerbait?" or at a C&R lake "Do you have any keepers on the stringer?" "Are you having any luck? I can't get a dam thing to bite these Gulp worms" "I see you pulled a couple of nice ones. I would have too but I keep my hooks pretty dull so I won't snag myself on the back cast." or Option #2 carry a pellet pistol and shoot a hole in his watercraft. just slap the water hard to mask the shot sound.
Fish Central and I share pretty much the same views. I too started fly fishing in the early 70's when it was considered somewhat impolite to ask questions regarding what a person was using. Even my teachers wouldn't tell specifics. They would hand me half a dozen flies and then let me figure it out.
Frustrating most definately but I did learn to observe and figure things out in time.
So once again here is a thread that shows polar opposite views. If you don't act how I think you should act then YOU are the jerk. Verses, take some time and observe and learn and figure it out for yourself.
I will coach someone if I see them really making an effort and not having success and they respect the water I am fishing. I enjoy watching people catch fish. I don't appreciate people who think that I have to tell them and it is apparent by the attitude that surrounds them. A lot of the stillwater I regularly fish took several years to figure it out and it only made me a better fisherman doing so. It is quite apparent what I am doing if someone sits back and observes what I am doing. So if I am asked a question like what type of sinking line I am using, I am more inclined to give specific info and how I am making my presentation simply because the person sat back and did some observation before approaching.
If I know you and trust you enough to sit still in the front of my canoe I will not only show you how I am fishing but where to fish and how to approach things, where and when to anchor up and where to drift through.
You guys certainly aren't wrong, and without your thought out and well explained views I don't think we have a discussion here. I found myself in the middle of this one. Wayne made it clear the guy didn't break any laws so to speak, and it's not anyone's place to judge him (chances are he's one of us). That part doesn't matter, but what does is there really are some real asses out there and I don't think anyone disputes that. It matters because of the effect it has out on the water. It dampens fun and, worse, discourages newer anglers. And I think all the reaction here proves how many guys have run across it.
I'm another who started in the 70's. I was a kid then but can remember that even books and magazines weren't what they are now. I also learned on my own after my single mom bought me some gear and took me out (the fly part came later but same thing, self taught). I understand the value in learning this way and a lot of guys still prefer it. On the other hand I've had the opportunity to help a lot of guys out who really enjoyed and appreciated it. I think different guys learn better in a variety of ways, some on their own, some with more interaction. It's like playing an instrument where some are better off self taught and others benefit from a lot of instruction. But the thing they all have in common is there's no such thing as a handout. All the help in the world, even the web itself, is useless until you sit for hours, days and weeks putting in the time, doing the work, being frustrated and sounding like crap before anything good happens.
I guess that's where I'm a little different based on my own set of experiences. The interaction and sharing of information are good for people, and handouts don't exist since a guy still has to spend countless hours making his own hands work the magic even if he was spoon-fed all the best information. From doing a lot of this, it's easy to tell a guy what he should do, but incredibly difficult getting him to do it successfully with his own hands. Realistically, a first attempt is made with rather dismal results, then hopefully he goes off and spends time practicing until some success comes later on. Just like playing the guitar or piano, this stuff will never come for free and there's only one way to get it. It has to be earned with commitment over time, but I think the smarter students seek help. Why wouldn't you learn faster and end up better at it if given the opportunity?
I do understand the sport in figuring stuff out, and even prefer for myself. I've just run across enough guys who are better off with more interaction. But they still don't wake up good at it the next day...not even Kerry :clown:
I don't think his reply was too unusual or he was being a jerk. Some of us guys tying our own creations don't have "names" for some of our flies because it could be a little different from some traditional tie or something. I can understand his response ... "well, it's a gray body thingy witha dohickie kinda thorax, bla bla bla. Maybe some variation of a callibaetis or something...
Personally, I take it as a compliment when I am asked what fly I am using. I always offer a fly if I have more than one. The worst fly-doosh I've encountered was on Pass Lake. A guy in a float tube was fishing his way down the bank on the far side until he came to where I was and said "you're going to have to move - I'm working my way down this side" I said "can't you go around me?" and he replied" I fish here all the time and I don't go around anyone"
Please say you didn't move? That guy has issues!
This is an interesting discussion. Was out on Lake Ballinger a few nights ago as I can walk the new float tube down to the water from the house now and didn't have much luck. A gentleman and his friend came out on the water and were really doing well. Caught some nice holdovers and everything. We chatted a bit on the water and then as it got dark we both ended up coming in at the same time. We got to talking about different places to fish and I happen to say that I should go pick up whatever fly it was that he was using. He gave me one of the flies which have since been recreated a few times. Wish there was a cigar or something in my pocket to share with the guy (will have to invest in a box soon). It's people like this gentleman that restores my faith in humanity and fly fishing. All too often we get a bad rap from others (gear guys) and to some extent it is earned by the few like the gentlemen on the lake. But like my grandfather says we all have to learn to get along.
I shared some info on a lake today. Then I shared a fly that was working for me with two guys that were struggling to get any attention, one for each of them. Then they said they had been fishing another lake where they were getting a rough go if it too, and I shared two flies each that I've had some decent luck at that other lake. I've never seen these guys before, and may not see them again, but I have no reason to be a jerk. I hope they fish those patterns and catch a fish or two.
Now that is a dick. I would have said screw you.
Sometimes. It all depends on the approach of the fly fisher, how I feel that day, and the water.
It sounds like your day was very successful, count-wise, and he may have felt he didn't need to give out info to someone else who is also catching fish.
It doesn't sound like he acted like a dick. I have a buddy who is a very good fly fish, mostly because he stays focused on what he's doing when he's fishing, and he's a GREAT guy and very social, but he could respond the way you just described just due to the extent he's dialed in. He's talkative, but when he's out on the lake, particuarly when midge fishing and his line in the water, there is some intense focus and he likes to keep to himself. You just noted the guy was focused and keeping his line tight even though he wasn't anchored down. He was multi-tasking, and doing a good job of it. I have no problem with it.
It's kind of like when you go to the gym. There are some folks watching others, some folks talking to others occasionally comparing notes, and then a small percentage of folks who are in great shape who are not talking and are focused on what they are doing. There are some similarities in any activity; some folks are just intense and focused, and sometimes private, and they are often one of the better or the best at what they are doing because of that focus.
It was me. Get over it
I used to be alot more forthright with info and still am free with info, but I did have an experience many years ago that really turned me off to giving away all my secrets. I was at a very popular eastern Washington lake, and was ripping lips pretty good....there were only 2 other guys in the section of the lake I was fishing and they were'nt get any love. I offered them a couple of my "secret flies" and low and behold they started to get into fish too.....which was GREAT. The problem came when I found out the next week, one of them was a sports writer for one of the westside newspapers. Well, he had to write his column about this lake.....the next week when I went back te place was crawling with westsiders....a real zoo......now I am much more selective in dispensing info.