Fluoro tippets too weak for steelhead?

Discussion in 'Steelhead' started by junebug41, Jan 29, 2007.

  1. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    Nope. Sorry. Seen the hard data, it's more abrasion resistant. HOWEVER, if you are fishing 10 lb fluoro that has the diameter of 8 lb mono, it is more abrasion resistant, but it is finer so the damage it takes is pretty heavy. And Maxima? I too love the stuff, but it is the THICKEST shit out there for it's pound class, and tends to be underrated. Meaning 15 is the diameter and breaking strength of some 17s or even twenties! Good stuff, but it you compare fluoro of the same diameter as your maxima, it'll blow the maxima away... remember mono absorbs water and gets weaker as the day goes on.
     
  2. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    I realize it is the "thickest" out there but only when compared to flyfishing specific tippets. Compared to Trilene and the like on big spools it is only slightly thicker while still beating them all. I just say this because I am tired of hearing people diss Ultragreen saying it is "only" thicker. This is BS because I have fished all these lines for bass, salmon, trout, catfish dadadadada in all sorts of conditions with spinning, plunking, fly dadadada gear and Maxima Ultragreen is better. Less memory, less abrasion, good strength all day but mostly PEACE OF MIND. I have pulled HUGE bass out of the brush with only 6lbs UG and could not believe it. I still break off more on fluoro rated WAY higher than I do with Ultragreen. It is my personal experience.

    I have a HELL of a time breaking off my fly on snags with Ultragreen over 10lbs. and no problem with fluoro of similar diameter. This is why I don't believe the "numbers".

    Anyway, hey ZEN what brand of 18lbs fluoro you use? I should give it a try.
     
  3. junebug41

    junebug41 Junior Dave Monti fan

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    Thanks for all the thoughts, gentlemen! I will certainly be a smarter impostor of a steelhead fisherman next time I head out there.

    I definitely did not let the rod get anywhere near straight on him, that's for sure. It was bent to what had to be very near the breaking point. The butt was pointing in almost the exact opposite direction of the tip. As for the break -- it was a clean snap. The knot didn't pull through and curl up.

    You're absolutely right, though. It was a great day on the river. I hooked my first, netted the one that my buddy caught, and the third steelhead of the day... well, I kicked its ass...

    No, literally. I was casting downstream into a wide, slow back eddy that looked a few feet deep. I threw off the clip-on indicator I was using on a backcast. After looking around for a minute, I noticed it was floating by me downstream. Just as I was reaching for another one, I saw it was going to hit the backup current and head back around the outside toward me... not wanting to litter, I walked into the pool (and the water I had been about to fish) to meet and retrieve it. Just as I reached it and went to pick it up, I happened to look down... there, inches in front of me, was about a 5-6 pound steelhead, just hanging out. It was too late to stop my foot, which basically swung right into him and sent him bolting downstream.

    Just another day in the life of an idiot on the river.


     
  4. rainbow

    rainbow My name is Mark Oberg

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    "I use 18lb flouro for nearly all apps" Wow, Zen You the man. What brand were you using junebug41?. I use 10lb Seaguar, and don't have to many problems. Except for the trees on the other side, Ha Ha. I'm going to try the 18 lb like zen for the Natives, and see if it helps.
     
  5. Jim Kerr

    Jim Kerr Active Member

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    I run through about 60 yards of "tippet" a week. I only use floro when I have to, that is when I am fishing clear water bright light of fish that have seen a bunch of presure. Floro, like mono, varies a great deal from brand to brand. I go with Vanish because in totaly unscientific tests I got way more bites on it, seagaur is tougher, stiffer and more abraisen restant but I don,t think it fools as many fish(totaly unsuported personal opinion). The frog hair, Rio, SA stuff is of course insane because they won't sell it in a reasonable size spool. YES THERE IS A DIFFERENCE between line and leader, sometimes. Some brands of floro sell line and then offer leader in the same breaking strength but a smaller diameter, but as others have said they only offer crappy little spools so screw'em. Maxima is of course the cure.
    PS.
    Salmo G. I met a couple of steelhead just this week that would argue your point about 10 pound being enough.
     
  6. Steelie Mike

    Steelie Mike Active Member

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    I honestly think it comes down to checking your knots and tippet after every snag, tangle in tree limb and rod tip, location the where weight is added and before each use. Also if your knot is not emaculate, then cut it off and tie it again. We have all had a poor knot or knot that has been banged on a rock cause enough damage to loose on a fish. The more often you get into the habit of checking your line, the less frequent the will break you off (In general).

    I quit using small package fly shop bought tippet dispensers years ago and buy large spools of P-Line 250yds. I went through a bunch of different companies until I found the one that I like. You save a lot of money by the end of the year. I also do this for mono and I also use Ultragreen. Mono is great for swinging flies because if you have the right presentation the fish cannot see the line in the first place. TL's
     
  7. greyghost

    greyghost Member

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    Same here.....maybe it's my knots, or my refusal to re-tie over and over, but maxima just plain works for me and I ain't changing....and I save boat loads of cash as opposed to flouro, which is nice.

    Pete
     
  8. rainbow

    rainbow My name is Mark Oberg

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    Yes, I agree The bigger spool saves a ton of money. I fish a awful lot and go threw leader like crazy. My big spool fit right in my top vest pocket and I can reel it on. Its great like a built in line dispenser.
     
  9. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    Well how about these numbers. That 10 lb ain't 10 lb. Like I said I LOVE the stuff, and in terms of spool to spool consistency, there is NOTHING better, but I've straigtned saltwater hooks with 15lb. Theres a reason you don't see it used for records. Back when I still had a boga grip I would test my knots, or should I say "knot tying skill" before going on a saltwater trip. With 20 lb berkeley big game on this very unscientific system I would pop my bimini knots between 17 and 22 lb. With maxima 20 lb would sometimes hit 27 to 30lbs before popping! I know that to some that sounds like winning situation, but if I wanted 30 lbs of break strength, I would have bought it. I did often use it off the beach in Mexico in the 13 lb test, and it absolutely rocked! But I don't need 30 lb break strength. Don't need it and definitely don't want it!

    As to knots in fluoro, they have to be tied TIGHT! and don't wet the knot before seating it. Oddly enough that INCREASES the heat with fluorocarbon and weakens your knot. I know it sounds weird, but it's true.
     
  10. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    :)
    Thanks Philster. I will have to give it a try. With my one trip to the Keys I am no big game fly fisherman. I know those tropical salt fish SMOKE steelhead but I keep it a secret around here in the PNW. Anyway, I will give this a try and see. I also don't personally care about actual tippet strength because I don't care about setting any records but I can see how Maxima would mess with this persuit. I will have to rekindel my fluoro romance. :)

    First, I will share my fluoro secret, this is the one fishing situation I use the stuff. In the dog days of summer when the lowland lakes are rapidly dropping and are super warm and clear, fishing bass in shallows, ABSOLUTELY use fluoro. Your hookups may increase 10 fold. Also try dragon nymphs on fluoro, BIG bass will eat them without thinking if they are on fluoro and NEVER touch them with mono. I have read many times that bass aren't leader shy and this is sometimes the case but when you have hot-low-clear-pressured-bass conditions go to it.
     
  11. Jeremy Floyd

    Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

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    For Steelhead I have never really had any noticeable amount of breakoffs using 15/12/10 (during winter) or 12/10/8 (during summer) green maxima. It isnt the most expensive and it doesnt carry a fancy name like fluoro but it works for me every time. Also I have never really noticed steelhead to be leader shy. That is of course all wild ass speculation based only on my limited and nieve experience.

    I can straighten the size 5 gamakatsu's on my leeches with the 10lb about as often as I break it off.
     
  12. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    Well I've personally witnessed some things that make me question the leadershyness of trout! I saw heavily pressured brown trout in Hot Creek in Cali rise to live hoppers with 30 lb mono superglued to them. But no drag since the mono wasn't attached to anything. Sensitive to drag and unnatural movement? You bet! thickness of tippet? Not so much! The fact that most of the time steelhead fishing is swinging the fly, I certainly agree with you that I don't sweat spooking steelhead with a heavy leader.
     
  13. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    Yep I agree......unfortunately those summerruns will get a bit too shy to hit a swung fly when there is a lot of pressure. That is when I dead drift princes and the like. Those little flies need the light lines to fish right. That is when I get borken off TOO frequently. Perhaps that is a good application for fluoro.
     
  14. luckybalbowa

    luckybalbowa Member

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    I have also been doing this for a couple of years and what mike says, is true. I use it rather than tippet. the diameter is .001" greater for the same lb test rating, but it doesnt really matter that much even to some pretty particular trout. P-line is great stuff, in fact they just came out with a new fluoro that I would like to try.

    I'm really suprised that no one has mentioned the fact that flouro is denser than nylon or mono, which helps it sink faster (less weight on the fly, or split shot etc affecting your casting).
     
  15. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    I see you mention that they just came out with a new fluoro... I don't know if it's still the case but originally PLine wasn't pure fluoro. It was mono with a fluoro coating. Did that change?