Lake Fishing book advice needed

Discussion in 'Stillwater' started by generic, Nov 29, 2013.

  1. Old406Kid

    Old406Kid Active Member

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    Phil Rowley, another B.C. Stillwater guy has some good info as well.
    Another good source is the Stillwater section of the B.C. fly fishing forum, FlyfishBC.com.
     
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  2. Krusty

    Krusty Krusty Old Effer

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    I hope you let the forum know when it's out...if there's one area of stillwater flyfishing I'm deficient in (among many others!) it's vertical presentation technique. It came along so long after I started that I never managed to catch up on it.

    It's rare nowadays that I fish with anyone else, so most of the improvements in my technique have their origin in books or magazines.

    I see those patient guys sitting there, waiting, and sometimes doing pretty well when everything else is slow. I think I've got the requisite attribute of patience down ok....but my old lady says I'm just lazy.
     
  3. Sinkline

    Sinkline Active Member

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    If you want to learn more about vertical presentation buy Chan & Rowley's new DVD, "Conquering Chironomids Vol-1". If you have been fishing vertical for a while you probably won't learn anything new, but if you are fairly new to the technique you will enjoy this DVD. If you are brand new to vertical presentation I would say this DVD is a, "must have"!

    Even if you know the vertical technique well, you will still enjoy the DVD for all the bobber-down footage!

    Conquering Chironomids Vol-1
    http://www.stillwaterflyfishingstore.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=74


    Randy
     
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  4. Drifter

    Drifter Active Member

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    I myself felt the book I thumbed through of Chan - Morris was way to basic. It would be nice if someone actually came out with a book that covers it all - chiro - intermediates - dries - deep sinkers and all of there uses!

    I like how you wrote your question as in almost stating anyone can catch fish dragging a bugger and you want more than that! Well, so do I....

    From using good color fish finders to running motor boats for big water, the lake game is so diverse!

    "Matching the hatch bullshit" Hmm this statement kinda shocked me since almost everything I do trout fishing is about matching the hatch! If it wasn't - I wouldn't do it. to me it's the blood line of trout fishing, the tradition so to speak but we all have our own preference and reasons why we fish.

    From calibeatis hatches, to chironomid hatches, to stickleback minnows and traveling caddis, like troutpocket mentioned, on water time will teach you more than any book. I have researched many fisheries just to find that I did better doing what the lake told me, not what anybody else said or wrote. From fishing a great chiro lake in Oregon and finding the biggest fish in the area were crushing flying ant patterns on the surface - which I did not have in my 10 fly box's ( lesson learn - got plenty now) to 5 and six pound trout stuffed with stickleback minnows - when everything I read on the fishery said the trout did not feed on them!

    The diverse lake fisherman will have at least 3 rods ready and armed for 3 different techniques if not 4! A dry fly rod, an intermediate, and a full sink. I like a dry fly rod and a chiro rod both with dry lines so I don't need to change techniques when that 1/2 to 1 hour time frame of sippers comes only once a day on that lake I'm on. Yes your boat will look like a porky pine, they will get in the way, I wouldn't have it any other way!

    I don't know if Chan and Morris wrote any "ADVANCED BOOKS" but that is the only book I would buy on any technique with the time and years I have fly fished.

    I like the direction you want to go. I like big water so I have to have a motor boat to take for long distances and big waves so I have a drift boat to row around smaller lakes and 8 horse motor for bigger water. You will find investing in a personal small rowing craft will hinder you, or limit the lakes you can actually fish. some of the biggest trout are in non fly fishing only lakes and are much less crowded or fisherman that fish them rely on power-bait or worms and a schooled fly fisherman can have a blast!

    As mentioned a lot of information and good fisherman on this forum. I love the fishing reports of people having to "figure a lake out" and sharing that info! These kinds of post have the info I'm looking for even if it's a technique I rarely use it's information learned every time.

    I myself would suggest posting more on this section and trying to fish with one of these guy's who are dedicated lake fisherman like Troutpocket, Ira, Lockhart, Clayton and many more. In one day it would be like reading 5 different books if you ask me and than you can take it from there!

    People used to ask me how to get into fishing and catching steelhead and I would tell them to "find the best fisherman you can and get in there back pocket" But like a pheasant trip a couple years ago I was invited on in eastern Oregon. I brought the guy some of my grandfathers old paper wrapped Winchester shells and an old rubber decoy of my fathers from the 60's to give him in respect of the invite. Most times a warm smile and bottle will do though ;-)~ -------- welcome to the dark-side!!!
     
  5. Krusty

    Krusty Krusty Old Effer

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    Rickard's stillwater books articulate many of the same things that I have observed in over a half century of lake flyfishing; that most
    of the time there is no 'hatch', that where and how you present a fly is critical, that larger trout tend to focus on larger subsurface prey to maximize caloric intake efficiency, that weather/barometric conditions have a huge impact and, finally, that a large collection of diverse fly patterns is unnecessary.

    I rarely fish dryflies anymore unless I want to maximize fish hookups for a grandchild or new flyfisher. Little trout are greater in number and focus on smaller floating insects...while the big boys, being apex predators, are much fewer in number, and tend to cruise somewhere in the water column below. Finding them takes more time, patience, and a subtle touch for feeling and responding to strikes. Large trout are opportunists, and often take a variety of flies presented in a manner suggestive of prey that don't necessarily resemble a particular prey species.

    I know I blaspheme, but I remember a time when fishing anything less than a dryfly wasn't really considered flyfishing...and remnants of that bloodline remain to the faithful.... who believe 'matching the hatch' is sacrosanct and all-important.
     
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  6. Jim Wallace

    Jim Wallace Smells like low tide.

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    I'm reading this one right now. I've had it for years, but somehow it got lost in the shuffle, and only recently re-emerged.
    Lake Fishing With a Fly, by Ron Cordes and Randall Kaufmann, Frank Amato Publications, 1984.
    I'm also finding it to be informative. Filling in some of the holes in my knowledge, and turning on the lightbulbs in my head.

    Next on my lake fishing list is Tim's book.
     
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  7. Sinkline

    Sinkline Active Member

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    The great majority of very large Stillwater fish caught by avid Stillwater anglers I know are caught on small patterns. I'm pretty sure Rickards regrets saying that big fish don't eat small flies. Rickards is wrong in that regard, and Chan is correct when he says certain food items are imprinted in older fish as they have eaten so many in their lives, and they won't pass-up those mainstay food items.

    Rickards would have you believe these two Browns are meat eaters and won't waste energy hunting small prey. I caught both these "meat eaters" on the same day using #14 pupa hung vertical.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Here is a large (spawned) Bull I caught this year on #14 pupa hung vertical. Bulls are notorious predatory fish, yet they still eat small patterns. Many Bulls between 22"-28" came to the small pupa this season.
    [​IMG]



    Randy
     
  8. Irafly

    Irafly Indi "Ira" Jones

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    Randy,

    The idea of imprinting is extremely important to remember. Even anadromous fish returning to rivers will find themselves remembering their younger days. Kings have ben caught on size 12 hares ears.

    Nice browns by the way.
     
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  9. IveofIone

    IveofIone Active Member

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    Amen Randy and Ira. The biggest trout I ever landed was a 13#+ monster on Sheridan Lake in BC. It took a #14 caddis pupa in about 20' of water on a Type VI sinking line. And the biggest trout I ever hooked which probably went almost 20# was hooked on another size 14 caddis pupa near the base of the dam on the Kootenai River in Montana.

    In recent years my lake patterns have become smaller and smaller. By season's end trout have seen about every style and color of wooly bugger imaginable and small natural looking patterns have worked very well for me. At Coffeepot Lake which is heavily fished nowadays I do much better on #12 and #14 Halfbacks fished deep and slow than I do on the bigger stuff.

    Ive
     
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  10. Krusty

    Krusty Krusty Old Effer

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    Are you implying salmonids remember prey species by imprinting? It's been well demonstrated they are incapable of remembering much of anything at all. Anadromous fish 'remember' water chemistry of their native river, but the idea they remember particular prey species from their youthful days is preposterous. Most everything they do is programmed and instinctual, developed through eons of natural selection.
     
  11. Krusty

    Krusty Krusty Old Effer

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    That's almost as silly as thinking trout grow tired of seeing the same old patterns during the season, and yearn for something new!
     
  12. Krusty

    Krusty Krusty Old Effer

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    And, if you know Denny Rickards, I suspect he's highly unlikely to regret anything he's ever said.
     
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  13. Sinkline

    Sinkline Active Member

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    Ira, if you are writing a book I will certainly purchase a copy. I bought Mr. Lockhart's book this year to add to my collection of Stillwater publications. I'm always on the hunt for new Stillwater literature. :)


    Randy
     
  14. Jim Wallace

    Jim Wallace Smells like low tide.

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    I am enjoying the divergence of opinion in this thread. Myself, I know nothing for certain, and am always striving to keep an open mind. 2014 might just be the year that I go "micro and vertical," instead of dragging around stuff that resembles a huge chunk of meat.
     
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  15. troutpocket

    troutpocket Active Member

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    The great majority of very large Stillwater fish caught by avid Stillwater anglers I know are caught by spending most of their time fishing waters that hold very large trout. I'm not sold on the importance of fly size. I don't fish stuff much larger than a #6 bunny leech . . .which is certainly huge in comparison to a #14 chironomid pupa . . .but I limit my pattern size based mostly on my tackle and what's comfortable to cast with a 5 or 6 weight rod.

    I was fishing a lake in Montana in September with a mix of rainbows and browns. Over three days I caught a bunch of both but there were differences between what the browns wanted versus the rainbows for both patterns and presentation. When I fished smaller stuff vertical I caught mostly 'bows. When I stripped bigger stuff, I caught mostly browns (and an interesting side note: I caught huge whitefish doing both). Just an isolated case but there aren't many hard and fast rules in stillwater trout fishing.