Looks like one retailer's finally had enough of being undercut by Costco...

ozcast

Active Member
#61
Leland is a scab on the ass of every good, high quality fly shop and this is exactly why. Now, in Oregon, I'm getting calls to price match Lelands price on Sage rods that they were going to buy from me at some point. These are people I have spent some serious time with on helping them narrow down the rod choice that best suits their needs. All that time and service that my boss pays me for out of his pocket, out the window.... Just to be under-cutted by a mass e-mail blast from a sniveling San Fran fly shop that has the same marketing skills as a middle school pre-teen who just got their ball taken away by a 7th grader.

Way to go champs, your not hurting Sage. You are hurting every good Sage dealer in the nation with your little temper tantrum.

Yes..Sage in Costco is an issue, but every Sage dealer has had to deal with it.

I would tell anyone who is/was in the market for a new sage...buy it, but buy it from the people who have taken the time with you, and buy it for retail. Labor, lights, rent, and product all cost money for fly shops and selling rods at discount and price matching don't keep fly shops open. If we all support the discounting crap, next time you need true expert advise on casting, tying, knots, lining your rod, fly selection, directions, quality materials, fitting waders right, fitting boots right, etc...etc...etc...list goes on and on... hopefully you can find it online, because that's the only place you'll find it.


.....rant over...thank you
 
#62
Wow, what an interesting thread! It makes me reflect on what a very happy man I am because Anil and his awesome team at Puget Sound Fly Co. consistently exceed my expectations regarding fly fishing products (quality, variety, prices, etc.), and good old fashioned customer service! I'll echo the savvy fly flingers who already said it: find yourself a local shop (who prove to you that they know their stuff, willingly share their wisdom, want and value your business, and personally care about your success on the water or on the vise) and support them. It's like spoiling yourself . . . my fly shop is much better than yours. Absolutely no disrespect to our brother who shared a sale tip, but Leland has not earned any loyalty from me and can stuff their 30% discount!
 

Alosa

Active Member
#63
. Absolutely no disrespect to our brother who shared a sale tip, but Leland has not earned any loyalty from me and can stuff their 30% discount!
Just to clarify: I've made the mistake of buying from a big box store before, and learned the value of purchasing from small/local fly shops. I provided this link b/c 1) Leland is not a big box store, and 2) Leland is local (for me anyways). I wasn't aware of all the politics surrounding the dispute between Sage and Leland. If I had been aware, I probably never would have posted this thread. If nothing else this thread has exposed some interesting politics between companies and their retailers. Good on Sage for dropping Leland.
 

Benjy

Active Member
#64
Seems to me that a warranty program that specifically denied service without proof that the rod came from a certified dealer would pretty much stop any serious buyer from considering buying from Costco.
 
#65
Seems to me that a warranty program that specifically denied service without proof that the rod came from a certified dealer would pretty much stop any serious buyer from considering buying from Costco.

It would only stop a serious buyer if the price wasn't a "discount" at Costco. The difference in the price is the cost of the warranty. That difference in price plus the probability of using the warranty + replacement cost is what a serious buyer should be considering when buying "grey market" from Costco(if only considering the economics).
 

dflett68

Active Member
#66
All true and a very insightful analysis. Yet the one thing missing from any of this discussion so far in this thread is the role Sage plays in continually setting the high bar for price.

Maybe the news travels slowly across the water to Bainbridge Island, but the US has been in a recession for the last 4-5 years with unemployment rates only now beginning to return to pre-recession levels. Unemployment in narrower age, racial or geographic subcategories is still as high as 25%. I know several folks with substantial skills and experience whose unemployment checks ran out last year.

Yet Sage is asking $1325.00 for a Method Elite with what seems like a straight face. Really?

Smack me if maybe I'm missing something obvious, but aside from the rare software zillionaire, I can't imagine how many real people are gonna spend that kind of money for a brand-new, tubular plastic rod.

It seems to me that Sage is being more than a tad unrealistic about the market for their products. IMHO, to the extent that they push the upper end of the price envelope, they end up doing themselves and their retail partners a disservice by creating unfulfillable expectations.

K
Good point Kent, I think we got into that in the last sage/Costco thread. A component of what makes this possible is the massive margin built into the brand (and sorry, but it's not equal to the price of the warranty). But it's a premium positioned brand, and there's obviously a market for it. Far bank has the price points covered for folks like me with Redington, et al and I don't begrudge them the right to go after the upper crust with one of their brands. Still, everything which makes this breakdown possible points back to sage. They are getting victimized on some level by their distributor, but that's preventable and it's on them to do the preventing.
 

_WW_

Geriatric Skagit Swinger
#67
Sage needs to protect their MAP dealers. When those rods hit Costco shelves, Sage should have bought them all up before dark...or...authorized their dealers to make the same deals, on the same rods.

After doing one or the other, then you can slap around your misbehaving dealers as you see fit - with a clear conscience...that is...if a clear conscience is even important to them. :)
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
#68
Sage needs to protect their MAP dealers. When those rods hit Costco shelves, Sage should have bought them all up before dark...or...authorized their dealers to make the same deals, on the same rods.

After doing one or the other, then you can slap around your misbehaving dealers as you see fit - with a clear conscience...that is...if a clear conscience is even important to them. :)
Slap that bitch....
 
#69
So I'm trying to follow,
Sage occasionally accidentally lets costco get their hands on high end fly rods and sell them at an outrageous discount.
Instead of buying them out it's more of a not our fault, not our problem sort of deal,
Leland's gets their dealership revoked by Sage for saying screw it, if Costco can sell discounted sage rods then we can too.
Sour grapes all around and dirty laundry gets aired out in the open, and here we are now?
 

Alex MacDonald

that's His Lordship, to you.....
#71
One of us mentioned getting a Burkheimer or some other custom rod for about the same as (what I consider) an outrageous price for a piece of graphite, as being a "deal". I can't fathom that! The most expensive rod I own is a Headwaters bamboo for about $250 when I bought it. $800 for a Sage?? I'll spend that for a custom longbow, but not for a Sage when my little Echo Solo coupled with an Orvis Hydros 3D casts every bit as well. Then, if I want, with the money I saved, I could rent a guide's expertise (or put it toward the next Montana elk hunt!!),
 
#73
One of us mentioned getting a Burkheimer or some other custom rod for about the same as (what I consider) an outrageous price for a piece of graphite, as being a "deal". I can't fathom that! The most expensive rod I own is a Headwaters bamboo for about $250 when I bought it. $800 for a Sage?? I'll spend that for a custom longbow, but not for a Sage when my little Echo Solo coupled with an Orvis Hydros 3D casts every bit as well. Then, if I want, with the money I saved, I could rent a guide's expertise (or put it toward the next Montana elk hunt!!),
Ultra premium rods just aren't for you, which is fine. And while an Echo SOLO is a very good rod, it doesn't cast every bit as good as a Sage. If both rods cost the same, which would you choose?
 

JesseC

Active Member
#74
One of us mentioned getting a Burkheimer or some other custom rod for about the same as (what I consider) an outrageous price for a piece of graphite, as being a "deal". I can't fathom that! The most expensive rod I own is a Headwaters bamboo for about $250 when I bought it. $800 for a Sage?? I'll spend that for a custom longbow, but not for a Sage when my little Echo Solo coupled with an Orvis Hydros 3D casts every bit as well. Then, if I want, with the money I saved, I could rent a guide's expertise (or put it toward the next Montana elk hunt!!),
Alex - just a matter of priorities. If you wanted a high performing american made rod, then you could grab a sage. If it's not that important, grab an echo.

I bought a couple of echos for rods to teach my friends on after the second sage was broken. They're great rods, but when you hold a sage (entry level vantage) in one hand and an echo (carbon) in another, it's startling how much heavier the echo's are and how much more refined the Sage feels while casting.

If you don't notice those subtleties, more power to you!

;)
 

GAT

Dumbfounded
#75
If I owned a fly shop, I wouldn't go wacko as has Leland and drop my Sage rods. I'd still offer them but I'd probably push Winstons and other high end rods instead.

It's up to Sage to protect its dealers from this sort of thing. Sage sold the rods to someone shady and that is on their head, not Costco.

However, if someone feels they will die without a Sage rod, as a fly shop owner, I'd still offer them.

What Leland is doing is not good business. One shop is not going to bring down Sage no matter how mad he is at the company so he's just shooting himself in the foot.