November on Puget Sound

Discussion in 'Saltwater' started by Jonathan Tachell, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. Jim Welch

    Jim Welch Veni, Vidi, Fishi OFFC

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    Sorry Pat, I don't see your point, I am the Jim Welch in Renton (check under my name), not Massachusetts. Discounting has nothing to do with fear, its about being accountable for your actions and opinions, if there were a fear factor here its resident in the people with psuedo-names. My post is very appropriate here, there were a bunch of people jumping on Jonathans case as well as those that are defending Jonathan that have decided to be somewhat anonymous, and it was a thread on this forum that challenged people to change their avatar names to their real ones, I have respect for that and I changed mine. I think an opinion is much more valid when it comes from someone that takes responsibility for it rather than being anonymous.
     
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  2. Pat Lat

    Pat Lat Mad Flyentist

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    I was just commenting on the fact that jim welch is somewhat anonymous as well, a quick google of the name brings up quite a few by that same moniker. How do we even know that is your name. Why not make a thread listed under NFR to express your concerns about peoples anonymity. Just seems like you're trying to stir something up.
    Even though I've been a forum member for a short while I'm already getting tired of people posting things non fishing related . But whatev it doesn't really matter anyway, I 'll let you get back to your soap opera.
     
  3. Puget Sound Pimp

    Puget Sound Pimp Banned or Parked

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    Love the report, keep it up. Ignore all these numb skulls that are shooting your report down. They are self absorbed posers that have nothing better to do than troll reports. Hope that fish tasted good, I caught a native around the same time and made me a nice dinner that night.
     
  4. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

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    To life, or not to lift, is that the question? Or,
    To bonk, or not to bonk, that is the question? So many possibilities in this thread. But take heart, and worry not. Why not worry? Well, because, . . .

    South Puget Sound has been managed as a hatchery coho wipe out fishery since the 1960s. What does that mean? From Seattle south, the state chose to focus on harvesting all surplus hatchery coho salmon, which is about 90% of them. As a result, any native wild south sound coho were also harvested at that high, close to 90% harvest rate. And because sport fishing for salmon is so inefficient, the vast preponderance of those coho were caught in gillnets and purse seines by commercial fishermen. Back in the 1960s, coho habitat was still intact enough that the healthy wild populations could tolerate harvest rates as high as 75%, meaning 3 out of every 4 wild coho was "surplus" and therefore, harvestable. However, at a 90% harvest rate, and declining habitat conditions in south Puget Sound streams, too few wild coho escaped harvest to spawn.

    The result is that for all practical purposes the native wild south sound coho have been functionally extinct for decades. And that was by management choice no less. That doesn't mean that there aren't any wild coho left in south Puget Sound today, but it means that they are the result of hatchery fish either being stocked in streams as fry or smolts, or straying as adults to spawn in the natural environment. One thing I think this should mean to all WFFers is that when we hear, "don't sweat the small stuff," it means don't worry none about a sport fisherman bonking an unmarked south sound coho when it is legal to do so. Even if it is wild, it's genetic roots are traceable to the Green River or Puyallup salmon hatcheries. There are so much better places to expend one's concerns about and efforts toward wild fish conservation.

    And for Mr. Welch, who tends to discount posts written under a handle than an actual name, I beg some leniency because Salmo g. has more than 15 years of internet fisheries credibility, vastly overwhelming any street cred earned under my non-cyber persona.

    Sg
     
  5. underachiever

    underachiever !

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    Salmo g, does that mean I can't act all indignant... like fly fishing is some kind of physical therapy for the fish I catch and release?
     
  6. stilly stalker

    stilly stalker Tuna sniffer

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    ^and people are still unclear as to why many of us are sick of tribal BS^
    Good article, but it makes me EXTREMELY angry
     
  7. Mike T

    Mike T Active Member

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    [quote="Salmo_g, One thing I think this should mean to all WFFers is that when we hear, "don't sweat the small stuff," it means don't worry none about a sport fisherman bonking an unmarked south sound coho when it is legal to do so. Even if it is wild, it's genetic roots are traceable to the Green River or Puyallup salmon hatcheries. There are so much better places to expend one's concerns about and efforts toward wild fish conservation.

    Sg[/quote]

    Salmo- Do you have any data on what the catch rate is today, or in the past several years, of those wild (but not native) fish? Also is there any difference in the harvest rate the native and non-native wild fish can handle and still survive? Thanks in advance.
     
  8. Loren E

    Loren E Member

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    Hehe I love this quote from Jonathan in his other recent post as it pertains to this post.... " I release all fish that I catch with the exception of hatchery salmon, hatchery steelhead, rock fish and lingcod when it is legal to retain them and if I feel the fish in that area are not in short supply."
     
  9. Chris Bellows

    Chris Bellows Your Preferred WFF Poster

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    what is this, a political campaign where operatives are searching for flip flops?

    i'm sure posts like this will make jonathan feel like posting fishing reports again :rolleyes:

    i feel sorry and apologize for my own contributions to these threads that not only have cunted up good fishing reports but also pushed jonathan into not posting great fishing stoke.
     
  10. skokomish fly

    skokomish fly New Member

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    I can tell you one thing if someone spends enough time on the water fishing lingcod and rockfish in an area that person knows a lot more about the population than WDFW. You should see what kind of gear and where they choose to fish for bottomfish when doing a test fishery. Lets just say sandy and and gravel flats with no structure usually don't hold many bottom fish especially in puget sound. Just saying.
     
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  11. PfleugerPhister

    PfleugerPhister Active Member

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    Seeing as how your ass in San Rafael has probably never met the dude, you're in no place to say shit about whatever he does.

    But wait...maybe you can help me with something because I want to buy your used shit and go on a trip to Alaska with you!

    Maybe you should listen to your own words,
     
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  12. Blake Harmon

    Blake Harmon Active Member

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    Jonathon, if your still keeping up on this thread. Ive never met ya, but I swear when I read your posts its like I'm reading my own shit. Your non stop pursuit of fish(any and every species), and the amount of time spent on the water seem to match fairly close with mine. In any case, If you ever make it over to the dry side. Gimme a shout!


    -(I would say tight lines right here, but I know that's already the case!)
    -Blake
     
  13. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

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    Underachiever,

    As you probably know, you can act however you want. But natural and logical consequences ensue, so some of us choose our actions based in part on the reactions we expect to elicit.

    BTW, I've found fly fishing to be both physical and psychological therapy.

    Sg
     
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  14. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

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    Mike T,

    No, I don't have the data. I rely on the WDFW catch statistics from the website. The harvest rate on the wild fish in south sound is unknown because they are not even included as part of the SS coho population, last I heard. They are few in number, and not part of harvest management planning.

    Native and non-native wild fish can likely both tolerate the same harvest rates. The rate varies with each year class according to fresh water habitat conditions and marine survival. In Puget Sound that rate varies from zero up to around 50% I think.

    Sg
     
  15. Loren E

    Loren E Member

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    Ha I knew I shouldn't have gotten involved in the shit-slinging fest, but you are begging for some criticism when you post in an online forum that you release ALL wild salmon in Washington, presumably because of their threatened status in the state, and then shortly after post a report about killing a wild salmon....questionable at best. Nowadays, with the condition of wild salmon and steelhead in Washington, you are understandably going to get some heat for killing wild fish, regardless of whether the WDFW misguidedly says it is legal.

    And as cute as your reply was PfleugerPhister, I live in Seattle, work in a Seattle fly shop, am a committee member for the Wild Steelhead Coalition, and fish a damn lot for wild salmon and steelhead in this state....just happen to be from San Rafael originally.