oregon gun laws

Discussion in 'Cast & Blast' started by dominic7471, Apr 1, 2009.

  1. dominic7471

    dominic7471 Member

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    hey everybody,

    im taking a trip to Oregon for fishing and camping. where can i find rules for keep my bennelli supernova pump 12 gauge with me while camping. Just to be safe it is cougar country so i wanna bring it with but i need to know what the rules are for out of state 18 year old.



    Thanks
     
  2. Gary Thompson

    Gary Thompson dirty dog

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    Old Oregonian myself and as far as I know nothing has changed.
    If you keep you shot gun unloaded in your car/truck and get checked you won't have any problem.
    Hard to not open carry a shot gun so around camp and while hiking/fishing "locked and loaded" would be proper.
    Being a nonresident you may need a hunting lic.
    Maybe a quick call to Oregon Dept of Fish and Wildlife might be in order.
    Have a good trip.
     
  3. kal

    kal Member

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  4. Shapp

    Shapp Active Member

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    I lived for several years in the most dense cougar country in Eastern Oregon and worked in the woods nearly every day. Leave the shot gun at home, it aint going to help protect you from a cougar unless you have it in your hands 24/7. A big fat sheath knife would be usefull though incase one jumps you from behind (Mogley style).
     
  5. hikepat

    hikepat Patrick

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    The main thing in cat country is to look behind you fairly often while walking. Big cats of all types do not like to come at their prey from the front, since most of the prey has sharp horns and or hooves that would hurt them they only like to come at their prey from behind.
    In some parts of the world tribes men have been known to wear mask on the back of their head to make it hard for the big cats to tell which is the back side.
    As others have said shot gun would only do any good if carried at all times even then after an attack it would be hard to bring into play. A side arm or knife would be a better choice but only if able to be quick drawed while under attack.
    Had a cat see me as prey many years ago even though I was at a very large fire while camping by myself. The fire did not scare him sneaking up behind me but I had turned toward a very slight sound behind me thinking to see at most a racoon but most likley smaller. Instead it was a large cat and since I did not panic till later I just said while looking it in the eye, hello kitty and it took off at a run. It was only after it sank in what had just happened that any fear took hold and I was glad I was sleeping in the truck that night instead of a tent. What saved me from attack I feel was the eye contact and staying calm.
     
  6. andrew

    andrew Active Member

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    I'd agree...leave the gun at home, unless you are going to shoot a turkey. I always hike with my K-bar, and pepper spray.

    I've hiked cat and bear country and being 'aware' of your surroundings is most important. The GNP officers gave us a 30 minute speal on bear and cat encounters prior to giving us our backcountry pass. Brown bear are similar to cats: stand your ground, look big, move slow, and always keep eye contact. DON'T be an idiot and run...that is your last resort...you might as well be a 100+ pound bag of catnip with a side order of bacon!
     
  7. Gary Bechtoldt

    Gary Bechtoldt New Member

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    I agree; you would probably get into more trouble than it was worth if you actually shot a cougar without an out-of-state license and tag, regardless of the circumstances.
     
  8. jcnewbie

    jcnewbie Member

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    :eek: I agree - and I disagree

    And watch your back-trail and sides a lot. 99.99% of the time you will never know you are on the cat's menu until he sinks his teeth into the back of your neck and flattens you like a pancake....a bit too late at that point!!

    Jc
     
  9. jcnewbie

    jcnewbie Member

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    :eek: Disagree, Disagree, Disagree!!

    Not sure if you were referring to our lower 48 Black bear or real Brown bear/Grizzly Bear in the northern tier states, including Alaska....but in any case their methods of hunting are entirely different as are defensive measure to be taken by you (us).

    First:
    I strongly recommend that you NEVER try to stand your ground, make eye contact and make yourself look BIG in a confrontation with a Brown/Grizzly bear - unless of course ya jus' wanna' "commit suicide by bear!" I can think of far easier, quicker & less painful ways of doin' that!
    If you are attacked you'd better be capable of the best "acting job" of your life and play dead -- very, very convincingly! If that doesn't work...well....,the bear is quite hungry and you are well on your way to the same fate as Timothy Treadwell, to wit, "bear poop!"

    Black bear in the lower 48 are generally much more timid (the operative word being, "generally") and will usuall flee in human/bear encounters - but you should NEVER rely on this behavior. Try not to surprise them on the trail or in the "blue or black berry patch" and don't attempt to cuddle up to those cute little cubs staring at you with those big black eyes from the side of the trail or tree.

    Second:
    Cats are ambush hunters/stalkers and do not advertise themselves in advance. That is why you will rarely if ever see the one that's stalking you. If you do see one it will not be hunting you and will be purely accidental and not through the intention of the cat.

    Third:
    A shotgun is of no value against a cat attack. It may be of certain limited value in the event of a bear attack, which is most unlikely - unless of course you've pissed the bear off for some stupid reason...like "wounding" him/her with a poorly considered and equally poorly placed shot!! In other words, don't get "trigger-happy" just because you encounter some wild animals while you're out tromping around in "their territory!" :ray1:

    Fourth:
    Even if you are highly skilled and trained in the use of firearms (handguns in particular) or edged weapons such as knives, swords etc., you will not have the time to employ them in a cat-attack because you are going to be flat on you face in the dirt, struggling to catch your breath that has just been kncked out of you by the impact of a 150-250 lb cougar smacking you in the back while at the same time sinking those massive "canines" into the back of your neck as his massive forelegs and those 3 inch very, very sharp claws rake across your chest, abdomen, arms and shoulders! If you ain't dead yet it's just a matter of seconds until you are, that is unless the cat has mis-calculated (even cats make mistakes) and only "grazed" you as he sailed by. If that happens you'd better be damn quick with your gun or knife 'cuz they can stop and turn-on-a-dime!

    Not trying to scare you out of enjoying the backwoods but it is important that you fully understand the risks involved and how frail you really are in the presence (and domain) of natures beautiful wildness.

    Respectufully,

    Jc:)
     
  10. hap

    hap Member

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    jc
    As a longtime bear and flyfishing guide in AK with a lot of time on Kodiak Island in the company of many, many bears and as a photo guide/bear guard in Timothy Turdwell's "area" I have to disagree with much of what you say about bears.

    Bears intimidate easily most everywhere (I've shot bears in Washington State as well as Alaska and a few others, too) and standing your ground is always your first best move. If the bear hesitates and especially if it is making noise you can likely maintain your poise and edge out of the area while still maintaining eye contact and dominance.

    Assuming the fetal position and playing dead is a good way to get that way, especially with black bears and young brown/grizzly bears.

    Quiet bears are dangerous bears. Among the many highly experienced bear guys I know, none have ever been able to remember a single incident where an actual charging bear vocalized anything, or "popped" their jaws (an incredibly intimdating sound at close range) before or during a charge.

    The average bear attack is going to be a protective charge at someone wandering too close to a bear protecting a meal. It will happen from close range and be over in a flash. Around Anchorage there have been a number of examples of folks being killed because they did not realize a bear had a kill it was intent on keeping.

    The average bear charge is a bluff with noise and hackles raised, lots of uncertainty and lateral motion before advancing. Unfortunately a bear winning a meal that way is going to die that way because it will continue doing it until someone bojects to bears coming close. Last summer we had many bears within 15 yards. However there were several dominant bears hanging around and when they came the riverbank was cleared.

    I have had to sort bad things out a few times with bears and two have died literally on my boot tops.

    Further, bear spray is a bad, ineffective joke inclined toward creating more problems than it solves... Twice I have seen it used and twice it failed to protect the bear's life. You cannot fly with it and there are many stories of bad things happening to people with it.

    Handguns are of marginal use as most people are not competent with a handgun large enough to be of use. Competent handgun users with a 357 shooting hardcast bullets as a minimum should take some comfort from a handgun.
    art
     
  11. jcnewbie

    jcnewbie Member

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    Art,

    My resume is puny compared to yours and I therefore defer to your superior experience concerning bear.
    ____________________
    “Assuming the fetal position and playing dead is a good way to get that way, especially with black bears and young brown/grizzly bears.”
    __________________
    I’ve never had the occasion to prove or disprove this particular point but all that I’ve read suggest that chances of survival when under bear attack – that is, when a bear is actually mauling and biting you, not when they’re popping their teeth or bluff charging – are best when playing dead.

    To the best of my knowledge the only person to survive a Grizzly/Brown bear attack by fighting back (with a hunting knife) was a fifty something cement finisher in Alaska who was deer hunting with 3 other hunters when he was attacked as he was cleaning a deer he’d just killed and his rifle was out of reach. Although severely mauled and bleeding profusely he managed to walk (stagger?) several miles to the water where two of the other three were waiting. The other missing hunter was later found quite dead, dismembered and mostly eaten by a grizzly. He had also just shot a deer and was apparently approaching the deer to clean it when he was attacked. I’m sure you are more familiar with the details than I but I think I have the basic facts right.

    My point was to illustrate the very different methods used by Cougar and Bears in pursuing or attacking their prey.

    I do completely agree however that “Bear spray” is a cruel joke at least as far as grizzly and browns are concerned – as the saying goes, “it just makes their poop smell like pepper!”

    Almost as cruel however is the encouragement to arm people with powerful handguns who have no training other than to shoot a target with maybe one cylinder full or one magazine full of ammo and expect them to function calmly under the stress of an attack by a 1,000 lb grizzly/brown bear. That is absurd beyond belief. It is absolutely meaningless comfort for the average hunter or person to pack a handgun who has never had to defend his life from an “apex predator” like a bear! Or from someone that is shooting back for that matter. It’s a whole different world under those conditions, believe me! Proficiency with any handgun can only be accomplished by shooting thousands of rounds under varying conditions of stress (simulated OR real) until “muscle memory” becomes infallible and automatic – if you have to stop and think, it’s too late, you’re dead!

    Now, you have obviously been in the big game hunting business for a long time and have no doubt developed skills such as calmness under extreme stress and knowledge of your opponent that has enabled you to survive – the average hunter or person cannot be expected to perform well under those same conditions….in fact I will guarantee they cannot perform under those conditions at all. The guy who killed the grizzly with his hunting knife was one tough S.O.B. - AND determined to survive. Whether or not he was calm in that endeavor is another question entirely but he WAS determined and tough enough to accomplish it.
    So, in conclusion, I partly agree with what you say and disagree with other parts, but then you have the advantage of vast experience so again, I must defer - but still respectfully disagree and conduct my future accordingly.

    It’s been interesting discussing these differences of opinion and don’t intend to provoke a “pissin’ contest” over the issues but it may be a learning experience for us all.

    Respectfully,

    Jc:beer2:
     
  12. hap

    hap Member

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    Jc
    Certainly intended no ill will or bent feelers, just stating facts such that my points could receive what I consider to be their full value.

    Gene Moe is the old Cement finisher you refer to and a friend, though he was over 60 when the bear attacked him there on Raspberry Island. He was alone. Tough SOB is an understatement and the bear is lucky it waited until he was an old man. A younger Gene would have made the bear hurt on top of expiring! ;) His nephew, Doug Moe, was on the same trip and watched his uncle walk up to the cabin after radioing for a pickup. Gene insisted on walking up the hill so as not to alarm Doug.

    Doug used to live on the Bluff directly above Cook Inlet and it was a considerable drop to the ocean beach in front of the house. I never have golfed and find the game a wee bit foolish... But whacking golf balls off the bluff and watching them go nearly forever is gratifying! ;)

    The hunter killed by a bear you refer to is a sad thing... I did not know him, but a very good friend knew him well and his sister and the dead guy's daughter have been best friends forever. I played support on the recovery and it was not pretty, though there was no eating. I have hunted the exact area a number of times and shot a large brown bear just over the top from the location on Uganik Island. Raspberry and Uganik Islands are in sight of one another, but are on opposite sides of Viekoda Bay/Kupreanof Passage on the very NW corner of Kodiak Island.

    For background, the bears that year were having problems due to salmon run failures and no berry crop due to a lingering cold spring following a cold winter... All the blossoms were frosted out. Hungry bears are a very bad thing.

    October of '07 I spent in the area just under the attack site and the surf smelt were spawning on the ocean beaches and the bear were keying on them. The best beaches had bears in double digits, minimum and we counted 35 bears on a single stretch of beach under 1/2 mile. ADF&G claims there are but 120 bears in the whole unit and we saw more than that on just the beaches in one very small segment of the unit. And there are many araes of the unit with surf smelt beaches.

    I'll spare you any pictures of departed bears:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    These are just two pictures that I recall exactly where they were taken and both are directly under the site of the killing. The second bear is a biggie...
    [​IMG]
    A dink from this past summer that was often inside 15 yards.

    Most bear experts have changed fields on the playing dead thing and the standard procedure these days is to fight back with everything you have, everytime. Black bears are likely looking at you as food and will be doing all the eating they can as fast as they can.

    There are many examples of people fighting back and surviving bear attacks.

    "Bear Attacks" by Steven Herrero is often cited as good bear defense guide. His first edition is worse than useless and usually panned. The second edition is an entirely different book and he corrects many of his more egregious errors. Even he suggests fighting off any bear attack.

    I absolutely stand behind exactly what I wrote about handguns and have to assume my inverted statement got lost...
    "Handguns are of marginal use as most people are not competent with a handgun large enough to be of use. Competent handgun users with a 357 shooting hardcast bullets as a minimum should take some comfort from a handgun."

    I know extremely competent handgunners. I shoot far more than most with big handguns and consider myself merely competent. Give me a big rifle, anyday. A shotgun if it is all that is available...
    art