Problem with my Swing?

Discussion in 'Spey Clave' started by jcalderon, Jun 8, 2009.

  1. Panhandle

    Panhandle Active Member

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    Your rod tip shouldn't "turn" or move the fly. Your rod shouldn't dictate the lines/flies swing aside from mending. You're trying to achieve a swing where the tip is aligned with the line and fly, but you are allowing the water's natural speed and flow to sway the speed of the swing--- the rod just follows the waters motion. In other words, everything is moving at the same speed, resulting in slight tension and just a little give. A good way to practice this is to start the tip high after the initial mend, then slowly drop the tip as you follow the course of the swing. If you're hanging up and you think everything is lined up, you're fishing too fast a tip for the water you're fishing. Remember, Fish will not move down to chase a fly and steelhead don't always sit on the bottom. To know you swinging well, you learn to feel that everything is moving at the same pace; you can feel it in your mind's eye. I don't think there’s any way to shorten the learning curve of this feeling aside from swinging your ass off. You'll know when you're doing it right when one of those bastards pulls back. :thumb: I hope that gibberish makes sense. :D
     
  2. KerryS

    KerryS Ignored Member

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    Thanks for the compliment Jason.

    Let me clarify a bit. The deal is to be on the water. Fish as much as you can and keep your fly in the water. Time will bring fish. As you put in the time and start to catch fish you will start to learn where to fish which in my opinion is more important than how you swing the fly. The more casts you make the more you will learn on how to swim a fly. Notice I said swim this time not swing. You will learn what I mean by that as you spend more time fishing. But remember what I said first. The perfect swing in water that does not hold fish will not catch fish. If you want to shorten the learning curve quit posting questions on the internet and go fishing with someone that has been doing this for awhile. Serveral posted on this topic. Watch everything they do. Watch what water they spend the most time fishing. Ask why they use a certain tip on certain runs. Ask questions about everything you can think of. Lots of them. When I first started fishing for steelhead with a fly I bugged the living shit out of my mentors. I asked questions about everything, most probably dumb but they all got answered and after time I learned a little bit. There is no way to describe the perfect swing on the internet because every cast is in different water. You have to be there to make the perfect swing.

    You got some good advice on here from some good fishermen, get out there.

    And if you are catching cutthroat on the swing it is only a matter of time 'til you reel gets smoked.
     
  3. jcalderon

    jcalderon Member

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    Thanks you guys for your info. My plan of attack was ultimately improve my swing by time on the water. I have seen way too many people write off swinging because they "never catch anything" but they literally spend 3-4 days a year on the water. My plan is to stay local on the sky 3 times a week after work and one weekend day. Hopefully, I will be able to figure it out, and maintain a marriage!
     
  4. Brian Thomas

    Brian Thomas Active Member

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    Don`t be afraid to try a downstream mend . I like to do this to speed the fly up , especially in froggy water , but I`ll do it pretty much anywhere , thus , helping to keep the fly off the bottom .

    An added benefit is that a downstream mend will give the fish more of a broadside view of the fly .
     
  5. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    HEHE.

    Welcome to the party!
     
  6. doublespey

    doublespey Steelhead-a-holic

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    Damn, I missed the Ditch Pickle thread cause I was in Texas. Yep, catching 'em off the dock in a little farm pond on topwaters. Hell, at least they're not endangered.

    As for da Swing? Kerry said it - find fishy water and let the fly swim. I'll only add that you need to develop a "feel" for the right swing tension. Just the lightest connection between the line and rod. In slow water, that may mean leading your fly with the rod tip. In faster water it usually means doing your mending EARLY and following with the rodtip until the end of the swing. This keeps the fly's feathers and hair pulsing instead of that greased-back stiff look you get when you have too much tension on the fly.

    And mend EARLY!!! You'll spook potential takers if you keep mending when your line gets to 45% below you in clear summer water. Better to use the length of your spey rod to manage the speed of the swing to avoid spooking the fish.

    Damn, now that I'm back I gotta get out there. I've got Steelhead Deprivation something fierce.

    Tight Lines!

    Brian
     
  7. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

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    If "the swing's the thing," then evaluating one's swing should be a worthwhile investment of time. Jeremy mentioned something that I wish I had thought to advise people many years ago. To check out the swing, put on a floating line and a skater. It will give you a better idea of how your line and fly are fishing than will a sinking line or sink tip.

    A rule-of-thumb about swing speed that I didn't see posted in this thread is that in average or typical steelhead holding water, the speed of the fly coming across the water should not be faster than the downstream velocity of the river. That's a useful rule since each pool, and section of a pool, has a different water velocity. Like most rules-of-thumb, this one also has an exception. In slow froggy water, the fly fishes effectively when its speed across the water is greater than the downstream velocity of the river. A downstream mend will usually speed up your swing in this type of water.

    Sg
     
  8. TallFlyGuy

    TallFlyGuy Adipossessed!

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    This is a tip I learned a while back that has really put a ton of fish on the beach. Most don't know what the hell they are talking about when they give advice about swinging, so read closely and then reread at least 10 times.

    When you find a nice piece of holding water that some steel might reside, look around for some nice pea size gravel etc. Reach down and grab a huge handfull of the gravel, and then throw it out across the holding water in one big swath so about 500 little pebbles splash the hell out of all the holding water. This will cause those dumb little hatchery fish to come right up on top and sometimes stick their head out of the water to see what the hell is going on. I think it reminds them of the good ol'e days of being fed at the hatchery etc. Whatever the case, it really fires em up.

    At this point, you want to take about a 6 ft section of 30 pound maxima and tie about 10 bomber/skater flies on. Make sure they are seperated equally. Then you want to cast upstream of the holding water and let it swing through that holding water. HOLD ON. Cuz those dumb hatchery fish will attack the hell out of those top water bomber flies. Sometimes you will get two on at a time. This is why you need the 30lb maxima.

    HOpe this helps. It really increased my catch rate when swinging the fly.

    Justin
     
  9. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    TallFLyGuy...................shit man......you got me sniffin' but I am not sure if I should bite or not........is that a whopper tip or a load of horseshit with a hook in it..........
     
  10. Jeremy Floyd

    Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

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    ^
    The good guys only need 1 pebble! (Teeny's brilliant rock manuever)
     
  11. TallFlyGuy

    TallFlyGuy Adipossessed!

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    LOL, It is meant to be funny and yes it is a bunch of Chit
     
  12. Dale Dennis

    Dale Dennis Formally Double-D

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    All very good tips and no simple answer, Kerry S. said it well and sounds like he has spent some time with the mentors. I will just add that in the shoot cast put a mend in the line before it touches the water, this is called the reach mend it will give you a greater presentation of the fly in the swim (swing) which I like to have perpendicular to the water flow, this works particularly well in higher flows or deeper runs where you want to get down, you can also add another mend if necessary and as someone mentioned your not pulling the fly with a mend while in the swing, if you get my drift.
     
  13. Jeremy Floyd

    Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

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    Jesse, come on over to this side of the state and we can go hit the Ronde for smallmouth and get your swing tuned up for steelhead season.
     
  14. jcalderon

    jcalderon Member

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    J- Thanks very much for the offer. I have been hoping to make it out that way this season. is smallmouth fishing an all-summer thing? Or should I make it over in a hurry.
     
  15. Jeremy Floyd

    Jeremy Floyd fly fishing my way through life

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    Any time before I head to Cali in sept should be fine.