Skagit to Skagit

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by _WW_, Feb 2, 2008.

  1. Scottpuck

    Scottpuck Member

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    We could also propose a rule change that would require only flies where the bottom portion of the hook is removed so that the fish could not be hooked.

    This was you get the thrill of the bite, but no fish is harmed with the subsequent fight.
     
  2. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    Is that supposed to be funny?

    I haven't been hearing ludicrous ideas being passed around in this thread so I don't get who or whom you are aiming your sarcasm at.
     
  3. PT

    PT Physhicist

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  4. Scottpuck

    Scottpuck Member

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    Who said anything about sarcasm?

    It is ever bit a valid response as banning wading, fishing from boats, closing hatcheries, and most other suggestions that has been made here.

    The benefits of this would include:

    • Providing the fish the necessary protection they require,
    • Continue to allow people to fish and enjoy the outdoors,
    • Allow the fish and game to still collect revenue from license sales,
    • Increase the total number of wild fish,
    • Eliminate the commercial vs. sport harvest quotas which are argued every year, and
    • allow for the closures of fish hateries

    Why would you think I am being sarcastic when there are so many positive outcomes of this proposal?
     
  5. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    Okay great. You are SOOO right. Awesome man! :thumb:

    I guess banning bait is as ludicrous as making hookless hooks mandatory! We sure have a lot of people with too much free time around here.....

    I can't believe I have to defend the idea that banning bait will help save wild fish.

    ADDED LATER : PT, I never said it couldn't happen. I have heard of people catching the same steelhead on a fly repeatedly. However, many people have told me that with bait, repeat catches are MUCH more common. This was told to me from bait guys who have had to stop fishing a hole because they were worried about the vitality of the fish they were absolutely hammering over and over. Plus, with bait, the hooks tend to grab deeper in the mouth, causing far more damage than a fly usually does. But still, I never said you couldn't mortally wound a steelhead with a fly (I guess I have to cover EVERY conceievable angle when I post these days).
     
  6. PT

    PT Physhicist

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    Bait bans in specific fisheries make perfect sense. Bait bans in all steelhead fisheries seems misguided. I was just pointing out that your remarks regarding bait seem to be based on opinion not fact.

    I know it's a passionate issue.

    The fishing community is fractured enough. Alienating certain user groups will do nothing to restore wild fish runs, for example, banning folks from fishing from a boat on the Sauk. Personally, I see that as one user group trying to get rules enacted to enhance their particular pursuit while limiting someone else's.

    Again, this is just one person's opinion.

    "We sure have a lot of people with too much free time around here....." 835 posts since July '06?
     
  7. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    Banning bait and boat fishing in no way takes away ones ability to fish. I think that is the thing to remember.

    Fishing is still entirely possible with gear. Gear guys can still use the same corkies, lures et cetera, minus the bait/scent.

    "Fly Fishing Only" waters are where I would agree with you though. That type of stuff divides the fishing community BIG TIME.

    As for me having too much free time and my number of posts. I hope, and I admit I am not perfect, but I would hope that the vast majority of my posts were actually constructive in some way and not wasted energy. This is was what I meant by too much free time: net nannies, spelling nannies, joksters, trolls, plain old idiotic rants, worthless posts that get threads off topic, nitpickers, insignificant exception pointer-outers; that is the type of shit I was reffering to as being a waste of time; and people who usually add such stuff when they post are wasting theirs and our time in a failing attempt to be "right" whatever the hell "right" may be to them. I laugh at arguments around here where guys are trying to be "right", I am mostly here to help and learn from guys like Salmo G and Smalma. If it weren't for them, I would have stopped coming here long ago.
     
  8. PT

    PT Physhicist

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    There, I fixed it for ya'.;):clown:
     
  9. PT

    PT Physhicist

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    Each river system should have reasonable rules in effect so that the resource is not being exploited. That is a given IMHO.

    But, I don't see it as your responsibility or mine to dictate how other people should be allowed to fish. And don't take that as me saying that snagging, flossing, etc. is ok. I do believe in selective fisheries, certain rivers not being fished from a boat, power boats not used in certain rivers, etc. Reasonable regulations.

    The more "exclusive" we get with our regs the more divisive the fishing community becomes.
     
  10. HauntedByWaters

    HauntedByWaters Active Member

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    I agree with you 100%.

    I still think that banning bait doesn't change up peoples fishing methods that much and this does help protect the fish.

    This is especially the case with a C&R fishery. I think it is idiotic to have bait fishing allowed in a C&R fishery and a C&R fishery will be what we have (hopefully) if they close all the hatcheries on the Skagit.
     
  11. FT

    FT Active Member

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    Todd,

    I have folks in boats and rafts fishing with fly rods park opposite me on the Sauk and cast into water I was fishing. It has nothing to do with the type of fishing gear one uses. However, banning fishing from boats would allow the fish more sanctuary for the simple reason that there would be more holding water that would not be able to be fished.

    I amazes me that banning fishing from boats or other floating devices has been the rule on Montana's Madison since the early '80's and on Oregon's Deschutes since about the same time, yet neither river suffers from a lack of fisherman whether they use gear, spinning, or fly rods.

    Since Montana has a ban on outfitters and guides floating the Big Hole river certain days of the week, perhaps not allowing fishing from a boat certain days of the week is needed. A regulation that only allows fishing from a boat on say Sunday to Wednesday and bans fishing from a boat on Thursday to Saturday would be more acceptable to you.

    I simply would like to see the fish have a bit more of a chance to not be hooked and banning fishing from a boat or other floating device on the Sauk would do just that. No restrictions on type of rod or lure used to fish, simply a ban on fishing from a boat.
     
  12. Scottpuck

    Scottpuck Member

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    Does anyone have the breakdown for the Skagit steelhead (hatchery & wild) returns for whatever the most recent year of data is avaialble?

    What I'm interested to see is the following:

    (ttl commerical take) + (ttl tribal take) + (ttl sport take) + (ttl hatchery return) + (in est. in river spawning) = ttl est. hatchery run size

    - and -

    (ttl commerical take) + (ttl tribal take) + (ttl sport take) + (ttl wild escapement) = ttl wild run size

    Is this data available?

    Scott
     
  13. Two-Hand

    Two-Hand New Member

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    I personally would be in favor of implementing a daily fee ( say, ten bucks per day ) to fish the Sauk/Skagit or any other Washington water deemed to be a classified water. As someone else on this thread mentioned, if you fish B.C. and you fish a classified water i.e. Thompson, Dean, Babine, Bulkley, Sustut, Copper, etc...etc...etc..., you pay a daily fee which could be as much as forty bucks or as little as twenty. The point is that there is a daily fee to be paid if you want to fish the river. Now, the caveot here is that the fee is paid by NON RESIDENTS of B.C. and not the those who reside in the province. I live in WA and have happily ( well, maybe not happily, but understandably ) spent thousands of dollars over the years to fish those B.C. classified waters. My only problem with the system in B.C. is that ( I believe ) those dollars go into one big general fund and I suspect very little of those $$'s go into the perspective fisheries. Now, if we in WA had a similar system in place to charge non residents a nominal daily fee to fish our "classified" waters we could use that money to fight the good fights, enforcement, restore estuary habitat, etc....etc.... Anyway, some food for thought.

    Two-Hand
     
  14. Will Atlas

    Will Atlas Guest

    Scott,

    Call the region 4 WDFW office and ask to talk to Brent Barkdahl (sp?). He could give you data until your ears bleed.
     
  15. Smalma

    Smalma Active Member

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    Scott -
    The Wild Steelhead Coalition has put together some of that information; see -

    http://www.wildsteelheadcoalition.org/Repository/main.htm

    Look at Data & Click on Puget Sound.

    For more specific or up dated data I'm sure that Barddull can provide it though it may take a little time.

    Tight lines
    Curt