skagit vs. the world.

Discussion in 'Spey Clave' started by Panhandle, Feb 4, 2011.

  1. golfman65

    golfman65 Guest

    I think partially it's a canadian thing...as far as speypages...I learned my casting and fishing for the most part up there and lost a good half season because I was told only knobs fished skagits and tried to use a cnd gps line on a 13 soft rod...was horrible...sink tip on that line doesn't like heavy flies and I struggled mightily...Part of it I attribute to the "classical" learning curve of a british property...

    Fish our rivers, especially the skagit and you'll understand why that line was developed...your not fishing bars for the most part, your walking out from the trees...try throwing a longer line and the D loop will tangle constantly...

    I've argued with many that part of learning ANY casting style is the method..what these guys don't get is when your throwing distances over a hundred feet part of the skagit or scandi cast is learning to deal with your running line and having the power stroke to throw it in current....

    All that said, I've found that mid bellies etc. don't fit me anymore as I'm just not into the rotation etc. and it's effect on my body all day....I do like the fall favorite or vector line at roughly 50' heads...but again..with a decent running line these heads with long leaders etc. can easily be used out to whatever your max casting distance is...they are a lot easier to cast long distance and will work in good winds too....a mid/long line is normally 110-120' .. with a decent running line 130' in my unskilled hands and 150' in the good guys hands are pretty attainable...So what's the point?

    On the rivers like the clearwater etc. you need long casts and small flies..so using a mid/long or fall fav. type line is a very good choice....You don't want to be plunking something heavy out there...you use long leaders and small flies and it's a stealth thing to some degree...it's a fuck of a lot easier to use the proper head out there....Most guys using skagits don't understand that with a floating tip on there you need a heavier head to compensate for the weight of your tip...so they struggle trying to throw their winter heads with a floater...

    All part of the curve and nobody is right....just what you choose to use and FISH IT EFFECTIVELY!!!!
     
  2. Panhandle

    Panhandle Active Member

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    Good post, Golf.
     
  3. speyday

    speyday Rod tubes in the overhead compartment

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    I'm a utilitarian, and there are so many different tools within flyfishing that I know there is a right tool for the job at the moment. Longbelly guys would have a hard time fishing dirty 36 degree water from December thru march. they might wrestle with small water with wood, or abrubtly contured holes and lies that are often slightly bigger than a bathtub.

    Skagit guys might have difficulty fishing clear water to fish that might get turned on and jiggy when something is skating on the surface. Those fish might have a great sight-seeing vantage point. Who knows, they might turn their nose up at sunken stuff--- and the resulting 20 feet of rope they can see so well just upstream of the offering. (the example in the OP makes me wonder if that could have been the reason)

    If my fish acted like those on the North Umpqua, or babine, I would most assuredly switch to a different tool. Even if the majority of our fish were wild, I'd be tempted. But they don't act that way here. And they aren't all wild, and many arent F1 fish (wild parents) any longer except for MI fish. They are F2 inbred fish that are at times, retarded and respond to glo bugs mostly. I believe our fish aren't as prone to chase as PNW fish.

    But that aint happening, so pass the t-20 and scissors. I need to really tempt the fish, and getting it right at eye level 'quickly' is important.
     
  4. Flyborg

    Flyborg Active Member

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    A good friend once told me that the hardest part about spey casting is telling your parents that you're gay.

    Then Skagit lines came along. Spey casting is now officially bisexual.
     
  5. Salmo_g

    Salmo_g Active Member

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    Good chuckle Flyborg.

    Pan,

    I read the progression of that thread and was fairly astonished at the degree of hair-splitting. Part of me wants to chalk it up to me not being that well educated about Spey casting. The other part of me notes that when actually on the rivers and observing other casters and fishermen, I'm really not such a duffer.

    I started with a DT10F and struggled but could always count on a roll cast to deliver my fly. Then I made my first Skagit heads that weren't that good, but caught fish anyway. Then I finally bought a bunch of Orvis short belly lines on close-out that I actually like to cast and fish with. I guess they are sort of "Windcutter-ish". Then 3 Christmases ago got my first Skagit line, and it is by far the best method of delivering sink tips and or weighted flies. I'm guessing that people that don't get that probably didn't get or take physics either.

    Sg
     
  6. And then a guy walks up with a single hander and completes his swing just 3 feet from the shoreline and nails a bright 30"... Who the hell cares!
     
  7. Panhandle

    Panhandle Active Member

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    Salmo, that's kind of the most ironic thing about all this bullshit.....Very few two handed casters that I have witnesses are actually what I would consider "good, " and I could count them on one and a half hands.
     
  8. golfman65

    golfman65 Guest

    yeah with a pink worm shitting an egg no less....some people can't figure out how to swing or that fish will take a swung fly and that's why were out there...might as well buy a pin for your set up and stop pretending...
     
  9. No, with any classic steelhead pattern. One doesn't need spey rod to catch fish on the swing, just sayin'... Yeah, if you want to look cool, you can throw all the double handed stuff, but fish don't care what you throw or how its done. All they care is for the location and presentation. My point was that it can be done just as well on the single hander as it is on the spey, might not look as nice as that double spey. Don't get your panties into a wad over it.
     
  10. Big Tuna

    Big Tuna Member

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    I'm glad no one on this site gets into those kinds of pissing matches. It's hard to believe anyone would waste their time arguing over long bellies vs. skagit. That argument is almost as stupid as single hand vs. spey or nymphing vs. swinging. Nothing but intelligent debates around these parts.
     
  11. bennysbuddy

    bennysbuddy the sultan of swing

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    I knew I was mental challanged & subhuman, but the line I use was handmade at a fly shop in MT.Vernon within view of the skagit river, this was well before the term skagit line was introduced as a marketing tool, SO is my line a pre skagit rabbit leach jacking line or just what should I call it.
     
  12. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    I hear you. My first "skagit" line was a so called Launcher line I picked up at the Fly Fishing Shoppe in Welches Oregon in the '90s. I was throwing it on sage 9126-3. I had my rod hanging from the ceiling in the shop, because they were still very rare down in California, and it generated interest and guide bookings, though not many sales. Everybody who knew what they were talking about just kept telling me "30 foot line? 12.5 foot rod? that's not a steelhead outfit! You need a 14 or 15 footer! And a DT cut for tips! Nobody in their right mind would fish a 30 foot line on a 12.5 foot rod!" Skip forward 13 or 14 years, and what do ya know! :rofl::rofl:
     
  13. Dan Page

    Dan Page Active Member

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    I'm quite sure anyone who masters the long line, or the scandi, or the skagit system can fish equally with one another. The pissing matches start by someone needing to defend their system.
    I use em all, but do have my preference.
     
  14. Philster

    Philster Active Member

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    The funniest thing that proves this to be true, is Dana over at speypages ended up using a scandi power stroke, even on long bellies, because of an injury.
     
  15. guybg

    guybg New Member

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    Damn...does this mean that if you happen by while I'm fishing nymphs, I won't get a sip of your single malt?:beathead: