You're beating a dead horse from a long, tired, drawn out debate. I don't care your opinion of what I do. I swing 90% of the time. I nymph and gear fish the other 10%. Don't say I don't have "skill" because I use these methods. I think that my ability to adapt and be more diverse as an ANGLER makes me more skilled than I would be if I clung to a narrow minded view of how to cover the water. Don't turn this thread in to what every other thread about nymphing turns in to. Jesse started this thread for advice about indicators... If you have nothing to contribute to his question, then keep it to yourself. If you want to debate it, start your own thread. I don't care if it's fly fishing or not; when I do it, I enjoy it.