WDFW will not release 'early winter' hatchery steelhead this spring unless legal issues are resolved

Chris Bellows

Your Preferred WFF Poster
#92
Wow boys, settle down now. Mature adults are allowed to disagree on things, its okay, sometimes there is no single 'right' answer. To start getting vicious when the other does not agree......that's weak, goes against the spirit of a good debate.
as i've said before, the ignore list is not about stifling debate. i have and continue to have serious disagreements with many folks on this board.
- i disagreed with many of the impacts of catch and release on heavily fished waters when discussing no fishing from boat regulations
- i disagreed with many on the snider creek hatchery program
- i disagree with some well respected posters about the impacts of hatchery fish and the need for early returning wild fish
- i disagree with people that bucktailing is fly fishing.... and those fuckers should be on my ignore list ;)
- i disagree with many about issues within the industry, guiding, etc.

none of these disagreements have resulted in additions to my ignore list. the difference is that they debate honestly and do not put words in people's mouths. dishonest debate tactics cause people to use the ignore list, not the actual debate. i'm generally disagreeable and love a good debate.

i've been reading and posting on piscatorial pursuits for years and nobody can say that board doesn't have seriously different views on hatcheries, harvest, and regulations than mine. i have one person on ignore because he got personal years ago, not because of any policy disagreements.

my ignore list contains people who debate dishonestly, put words in my mouth, or post political bullshit on this board (i look elsewhere for that). but if the ignored want to believe that i just cannot handle their version of truth telling that's fine because it is their right to believe in fairy tales like santa claus, the easter bunny, and their intellectual superiority.
 
#95
Wow- this thread got seriously de-railed.

Thoughts- without the hatchery fish to bonk- a lot of fishermen will give up fishing all together. Less pressure on wild fish, yes, but less proponents of the resource as well.

There will be an exponential increase in pressure on rivers that still receive the plants, and those rivers will undoubtedly close early as every single hatchery fish gets bonked and doesn't make it back to the hatchery.

Wild fish may indeed get a chance to rebound, but I suspect that we may get a moratorium on winter fishing completely for the better part of a decade
 

Rob Allen

Active Member
#96
Wow- this thread got seriously de-railed.

Thoughts- without the hatchery fish to bonk- a lot of fishermen will give up fishing all together. Less pressure on wild fish, yes, but less proponents of the resource as well.

There will be an exponential increase in pressure on rivers that still receive the plants, and those rivers will undoubtedly close early as every single hatchery fish gets bonked and doesn't make it back to the hatchery.

Wild fish may indeed get a chance to rebound, but I suspect that we may get a moratorium on winter fishing completely for the better part of a decade



hatchery fish do not attract people who are proponents for our rivers.. heck wild fish don't even do that. The battles that have been won in favor of wild fish were won because one person or a small group of people fought tooth and nail to protect the fish.. Not because a large organized group of users got together and did anything...

the only really good example I can think of is Frank Moore and the Steamboaters..

and now Lee Spencer who keeps the pool full of fish from being poached...

what river did wild fish advocates in Washington save?? Heck we cannot even get WRS statewide without exception.. even though we tried.

The only way we will save wild steelhead in Washington state is to get people into WDFW who are willing to tell user groups hell no.
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
#98
Rob, you and freestoneangler should get a room together. You two are such extreme opposites of each other you might just get along. While you guys are exploring each other's anal orifices perhaps the rest of us can get on with having intelligent and productive conversations.
 

freestoneangler

Not to be confused with Freestone
#99
Rob, you and freestoneangler should get a room together. You two are such extreme opposites of each other you might just get along. While you guys are exploring each other's anal orifices perhaps the rest of us can get on with having intelligent and productive conversations.
This guy has a serious anal fetish... as demonstrated by his repeated references to the subject. But then he was the first butthead I encountered on this forum, so perhaps that explains it. They don't care for non-parishioner's of the COWS and resort to personal attacks when they don't agree with differing views. Then, like pouty kids, they use the ignore feature -- as if I give a shit.

Your ignore function appears to be broken Kerry, better call it in.
 

KerryS

Ignored Member
There you go with the name calling again. You can't seem to make a civilized statement about anyone with calling them something derogatory. But we don't expect anything better from you. I would like to see all of these "repeated references" you speak of. Another tactic of yours is to spread false information about those that dislike you. And again with the name calling. I usually have you on my ignore list because your dribble is so useless and predictable it doesn't require constant viewing. You repeat the same posts over and over and over and over again. Like digging up a thread that had stopped getting posts 2 months ago. What, you couldn't find anything current that you could garner some attention from? You repeatedly describe the people on this forum using derogatory terms and wonder why nobody likes you. Grow up dude. Act like a man.
 
the truth is often very unpopular... you can talk intelligently until your head explodes.. that won't change the unthinking truth. as long as people have the "what's in it for me" mentality nothing is going to change.. and it doesn't matter a whole lot whether you are a tribal netter wanting to make an income. or a plunker wanting to take home a trophy nate or a barbless hook swinging liberal from downtown Seattle. if you are not in it for the fish for the sake of the fish instead of your own playtime then you are just another user group, maybe your use is less harmful than everyone else's but just a user none the less.

want to be a force for change? go get your doctorate in fisheries sciences and get hired by WDFW and work your way into an important position. WDFW only listens to WDFW.
 

freestoneangler

Not to be confused with Freestone
There you go with the name calling again. You can't seem to make a civilized statement about anyone with calling them something derogatory. But we don't expect anything better from you. I would like to see all of these "repeated references" you speak of. Another tactic of yours is to spread false information about those that dislike you. And again with the name calling. I usually have you on my ignore list because your dribble is so useless and predictable it doesn't require constant viewing. You repeat the same posts over and over and over and over again. Like digging up a thread that had stopped getting posts 2 months ago. What, you couldn't find anything current that you could garner some attention from? You repeatedly describe the people on this forum using derogatory terms and wonder why nobody likes you. Grow up dude. Act like a man.
Point made... thanks for doubling down on it.