What's Up With The Caddisfly Emerger Bubble?

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Entomology' started by GAT, Aug 13, 2015.

  1. zen leecher aka bill w

    zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

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    I think Gary knew the difference between emerging pupae and adults diving down to lay eggs. Have you read any of LaFontaine's books on how he came to create the pattern? I know I have the book but have not read it in detail. This discussion will get me to do that. I'm curious if he snorkeled with the pupae or had them in an aquarium.
     
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  2. Taxon

    Taxon Moderator Staff Member

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    Bill-

    I certainly share that belief.
     
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  3. zen leecher aka bill w

    zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

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    I read Gary's words on the two sparkle patterns he created, the deep sparkle pupa and the sparkle emerger. He said the caddis get gas under their skin that inflate the skins and aids in emergence. The difference in the two patterns is the pupa hang up at two levels in the water. One deep, just above the bottom and the other just under the surface.

    He made no claims to an air bubble outside the body on the pupa. The air bubble is for the fly pattern to simulate the live pupa as it ascends.
     
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  4. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    This guy ran into the same problem with obtaining an answer to the air or even a gas bubble generated by a caddis pupa phenomenon that was reported by Lafontaine. He got as far as I did with a whole lot of "I don't know" from the bug guys who should know.

    So what did this guy do? He ran his own experiment in an aquarium to see for himself if the pupa takes on a gas or bubble influenced appearance when emerging. As far as I'm concerned, his findings are just as viable, as what Gary claimed he saw... neither were made under scientific study conditions:

    http://www.troutnut.com/topic/7950/Is-the-Sparkle-Pupa-Just-an-Attractor

    The thread is attracting comments very similar to ours here.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2015
  5. zen leecher aka bill w

    zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

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    The earth is flat. You will fall off the end.
     
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  6. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    Denial is not just a river in Egypt... :)

    Obviously, I'll need to set up my bug aquarium again, collect some caddisfly larva and make my own observations... but I tossed my aquarium because I didn't think I'd ever need it again. Doesn't matter, some of you guys wouldn't believe my observations anyway :D

    I can see right now that when it comes to this subject, we'll need to agree to disagree.
     
  7. zen leecher aka bill w

    zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

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    If it was me, I would net some chironomid pupae and try to recreate it with them. Once I was sure what the shiny body thing was then I'd catch some caddis and see if it looked the same. My guess is it's only some types of caddis as I found nothing about it on October caddis emergers.
     
  8. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    It really doesn't matter why. Gary's patterns do catch trout.
     
  9. zen leecher aka bill w

    zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

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    Gene, If I was a betting man my thoughts would be Gary came up with these "bubble" patterns before the shiny body materials commonly used for chrony pupa were popular. Chronies have a somewhat shiny body, look a the popularity of Rowley's pattern called the chromie.
     
  10. Ralph Cutter

    Ralph Cutter New Member

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    It was interesting to read about my observation regarding Gary LaFontaine. As they say, if it's on the internet it must be true! I never said that, and in fact have witnessed many hundreds of caddisfly pharate adults generate air underneath their cuticle in both rivers and lakes. Here is one from Manzanita Lake in Northern California.
    AscCaddis2.jpg
     
  11. Taxon

    Taxon Moderator Staff Member

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    Ralph, please accept my sincere public apology for thinking it might have been you who doubted the accuracy of Gary's observations. Based on your post, I am obviously mistaken.
     
  12. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    Ralph! How ya been? You and I both wrote columns for Fly Fishing magazine all those years ago.

    I'm still on the fence about this all. Some folks have indicated that the caddis emerger can take on a shiny look when swimming to the surface and they feel that may be what Gary witnessed.

    I honestly can't tell by the photo.
     
  13. Matt B

    Matt B ...

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    The photo looks a lot like a bead head nymph IMHO.
     
  14. GAT

    GAT Dumbfounded

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    Yes... yes it does.