iagree I'll cast my lot with the DanVise also. It was my first vise when I started tying about three years ago. Having spent a few hours at a clinic and coming away convinced this was something I wanted to do, I felt it made sense to invest in a rotary right off and yet didn't feel as a beginner that I needed to spend over $100.00. Even at full retail (purchased from the shop that provided the clinics for several weeks at no charge) the DanVise answered my needs then and I have never had any cause to upgrade. I think it represents a geat choice for the "serious beginner" and it will quite likely meet one's tying expectations for a long, long time.