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Would you stop fishing? (Steelhead)

8K views 91 replies 59 participants last post by  Citori 
#1 ·
Hypothetical question here with certain intent:

If saving native steelhead meant closing down all river systems for 20 years, would you be willing to make that sacrifice? Look at it in terms of no steelhead fishing what so ever, not even for brats.

I ask this, because we often talk about making sacrifices for the better good, but we're also human, as well as selfish steelhead junkies. I would be interested in getting honest answers. It would be a very tough one for me. I support hatchery programs because of my selfishness, but also know that this selfishness is detrimental to native fish health. So.....
 
#64 ·
Maybe it's this beverage, but I don't think angling is this the cause of the fish declines, and, really don't have a lot of faith that less "angling" especially C&R is gonna bring it back.

Like Farrar has so well said, look at what they allow then cut off the one group of users that really have no political clout.

Off subject, but in the early 80's amidst declining salmon returns, whom did they cut back and punish? The smallest group of commie fishers that really were an independent lot and had no political orginazation, (didn't want it) =The hook and line ocean salmon trollers. Not the gillnetters and seiners with their nets strung across river mouths at peak of runs. And Puget Sound pink netters with mesh so small it also got the searun cutt spawners. I am sure Mr. Johnson knows 1000% more about that subject than I.

Before you throw me in the fire this March ( must let me take my drink with me), I do hope I am wrong, but I do not believe closing the C&R season on the Skagit or really any other type of "recreational" regulation and closure is gonna amount to a hill of beans.
 
#66 ·
I dunno guys, that’s a tough question. If there were a guarantee that it would turn it around, it might be worth considering. Unfortunately, for every one of us that gives a rip, there are 10,000 who don’t. Most of them don’t fish. And, therein, lies the great irony: it is we who are out on the water and have met this grand fish who are ultimately motivated to care anything for its future.

The question, while thought provoking, is pretty much an impossibility. For me, I answered real questions in real life. I released wild fish for years before there were ever laws that said we must. When high seas drift nets were decimating steelhead numbers, I boycotted every product those countries sold and wrote letters to their consulates to tell them so.

When proposed legislation could help or hurt the fish, my senators and representatives have heard my voice on the phone and in writing. And I’ve gotten off my ass and testified at legislative hearings when they’ve tried to say hatchery was the same as wild or when certain logging practices threatened a stream.

But would I have done any of this had I not experienced and come to respect these fish? If I’m honest, I can’t imagine I would.

That’s the problem. If a law prevents this generation that comes behind from experiencing what I have known, then what will motivate them to fight as I have against the larger threats that would end the steelhead’s existence?

And if, rather than quitting steelheading, we taught our values to our youth on the water, then maybe, just maybe they would also catch our passion in time to help do something before it is too late.

It is, at best, a precarious knife edge on which rests the future of wild fish.
 
#68 ·
(Conflict): Some perspective for myself in order to understand why I am being so human and self centered.

I'm disappointed in myself that my honest answer is what it is.

Between ages 19-24 (when I was young, naive, and saw only one perspective) I was deeply involved in the environmental movement, in particular the preservation of our dwindling old growth forests. I was a city kid from Portland who failed to realize there was another side to logging, like, the fact people's lives depend on it.

If someone would have asked me then to abandoned hikes and backpacking trips in these forest tracts, I would have done it in a heart beat.

So, I ask myself, "What's different now Adam, why would you not hold yourself to the same values now?"

I think there are two components for me to answer this question. One, is that steel heading is so dam gratifying recreationally and mentally for me. Without the potential to fish for them, I feel like I would lose a lot of my lust for life. I use steelheading trips to get through work, and life's other bullshit. Without it, I feel as though I would lose the carrot that keeps me looking ahead—a void I could not fill with something else as healthy.

I had a huge wake-up call when I moved to rural Montana and got to know rural people and the dynamics of rural culture. A lot of my dogmas were turned up-side down. In other words, I’m much more conservative now. Some how that plays a part in this, but I'm not sure how as of now.

Basically, it’s an imperative luxury I’m not willing to put down. That’s not without internal conflict however.
 
#69 ·
So, I ask myself, "What's different now Adam, why would you not hold yourself to the same values now?"

I think there are two components for me to answer this question. One, is that steel heading is so dam gratifying recreationally and mentally for me. Without the potential to fish for them, I feel like I would lose a lot of my lust for life. I use steelheading trips to get through work, and life's other bullshit. Without it, I feel as though I would lose the carrot that keeps me looking ahead-a void I could not fill with something else as healthy.

I had a huge wake-up call when I moved to rural Montana and got to know rural people and the dynamics of rural culture. A lot of my dogmas were turned up-side down. In other words, I'm much more conservative now. Some how that plays a part in this, but I'm not sure how as of now.

Basically, it's an imperative luxury I'm not willing to put down. That's not without internal conflict however.
Damn Pan! You had me at, "I had a huge wake-up call when I moved to rural Montana".

Well put. Maybe you aren't a HUGE ARSE afterall! :rofl:
 
#70 ·
Pan,

Based on what is currently happening in the ESA LISTED California streams, the devastated Eel drainage in particular:

1) They removed the hatchery.
2) They went to 100% H&R on wild fish.

Bait is still allowed. Barbs are not. In fact, from everything I can find, fishing is NOT BEING DISCOURAGED WHILE KNOWINGLY SPORT ANGLING OVER A DEPRESSED POPULATION OF ALL WILD STEELHEAD. The catch...since removing the hatchery and going to 100% wild release the runs are steadily improving. Coincidence? Methinks not. Getting rid of the hatchery and it's angling impacts (intense 'sport' angling over hatchery fish has proven to impact the wild population- Washougal and Wind springer steelhead come to mind) seems to be a step in the right direction. Of course the ocean conditions in this general region are being much more favorable to steelhead as compared to the state of Washington. I do find it VERY interesting that the run began building immediately following the removal of fish culture.

To add the southern most population of wild summer steelhead still exists in the Eel drainage. Not a big population (<1000). What I find interesting is these ESA LISTED fish aren't being closed to angling. No bait, no barbs, no direct kill. Oh the blasphemy of actually LEGALLY going fishing with 'washington's selective gear rules' on a run of listed fish.

WDFW's politically induced idea to close the Skagit's H&R season this year (or part of it as is now the word the on the street) flies in direct contradiction to how life is being managed in the devastated habitat called California. Whose fish numbers are rebounding even in spite of this terrible thing called H&R sport fishing.

If we drop our rods and reels I can guarantee you that will be that. Nothing meaningful will be done and there won't be any reason to protect what is loved if it's locked up behind closed doors. As with most things human we will move on...another river...another game. And all but a few will forget what was. There won't be enough of anybody left to fight the fight.

I guess I believe we are required to actually be fishing in order to protect the fish. Not sitting around because we don't want to be politically incorrect about fishing over a depressed run that isn't meeting some hypothetical crock of shit escapement number.

William
 
#71 ·
To reply to the original question:

Yes, I would but, because I have to travel so far in the first place. I dont know that I would answer the same if I still lived there.

I fell in love with Washington, Oregon and the fisheries and although I live in Colorado, I try to do what I can to help to save the steelhead. for me, its contributions and money - not much, but its what I can do from my vantage point.

For those that are native to the Pacific Northwest, I cant imagine the question is an easy one to answer. I wish we didn't even have to think of such a situation.
 
#75 ·
To beat on this a little farther, since I just asked a similar question,...

Yes, if the rivers closed for steelhead, I would go fish the lakes. Hands down, If a closure was nessecary for steelhead survival, by all means, we stop steelheading.

I have been serching my soul on this question for some time because it always comes up. I have a natural inclination to say that I will keep fishing, because I only catch a few steelhead a year and always realease them, wild or not. But in a sense this is just saying" I'm not the problem, somebody else is the problem." This is a damaging line of thought, because we all are the problem, to varying degrees.

Then again, steelhead fishing is an extremly improtant activity for me. It is one of my strongest connections to the natural world, one of the only areas in my life were I can let go of the mess of bulshit that surrounds everyday life. This isn't to say that no other activity will help me find this peace of mind.But I have no right to harm the life of steelhead in my search for my own salvation.

Perhaps there is a middle ground. A world were both I and the steelhead can flourish. There have to be sacrifices I can make, along with others that allow for greater steelhead health. Short of the ultimate sacrifice of not fishing.

If sport fishing for steelhead needs to stop in places, for a period of time, then it has to be a full meal deal. Comercial intrests need to be seriously curtailed, certain dams need to be studied and hopefull broken down (snake) and our environmental practices as a society need to be examined and changed.

For now I will not voluntarily stop fishing. I will continue to fish in a way that is as least damaging to the wild stock as possible. I will also seek out ways to help the situation that I impact with my flyrod. Hopefully this will be enough.

Tyler
 
#82 ·
Takes a lot of energy to dig up a two year old thread.

Looks like steelheading may come to an end on most rivers anyway, and we won't be consulted on the matter, and it won't make any measurable difference to steelhead recovery, based on the same data I referenced in my post two years ago.

Sg
 
#85 ·
BJG,

All Columbia River tributaries upstream of Bonneville Dam received good returns this year. The good returns appear to have been the combined results of: 1. higher than average ocean survival; 2. spill required 1 and 2 years ago by Judge Redden; and 3. they plant an unbelievable shitload number of hatchery smolts in those rivers. I assume by dismal returns elsewhere you mean west side coastal rivers which receive very small hatchery plants by comparison and didn't enjoy the same ocean survival. Not all steelhead use the same parts of the ocean in their migration.

Sg
 
#87 ·
Cool, thanks. A lot of the fishing report's I've read, were saying that a large portion of the fish being caught up there were unclipped. I know it's not a very scientific survey because of the "fishing report" fudge factor but, are a large portion of these hatchery fish unclipped?
 
#86 ·
More "WILD" fish were counted over Wells Dam 8919 then the 10 year average of "all" fish counted over Wells Dam 8733. Must agree with Salmo-G, better wash out from good snopacks, coupled with better spills over dams, coupled with better ocean conditions, led to a very nice Columbia Steelhead run in all tributaries. The only way I am stopping to fish for steelhead in Columbia Tributaries is if they stop all sport fishing in them. The sport fishing will be the first to go.
Craig
 
#89 ·
YES I'd stop now but I've nothing to loose I only fish a couple of times a year for steelhead. I'm 72 and my health is not so good, and on top of that I've never caught a steelhead anywhere. They've always been a dream but never a reality. So not too hard for me and the getting out is my thing anyway and I'm gradually losing that anyway. Looking at the future as the human race uses up the natural elements from our world in our need for more and more of the things we create the world will never be the same again. But I won't be here to miss it as I knew it so it won't matter to me. my descendents won't know what things were like in my day at all since things are changing faster all the time the old will be unbleaveable to the fuure generations. Good Luck everyone hopefully something survives.
 
#90 ·
If there came such a time where my personal impact caused me to lay awake at night, yeah, I'd put the rod down and walk away. But i would most likely come back and fish, but only after I had clipped the hook portion off the fly. And if that were to eventually cause me to lay awake at night pondering the selfishness of my actions, then i would lay the rod down, again, and sit and watch the river for a good deal many moons.
 
#91 ·
Hypothetical question here with certain intent:

If saving native steelhead meant closing down all river systems for 20 years, would you be willing to make that sacrifice?.....
Yes.

The only stipulation being the fish were not being raped by other users and abusers of Steelhead and thier habitat.

:)
 
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